Zhang San Feng and his students

[Yang Guo]

I'm not sure if this was covered somewhere in the novels or this forum, but from what I recall... Zhang Jun Bao separated from Shaolin at age 16 or so and started cultivating with taoist scriptures for some years. Then of course, he founded Wu Dang receiving countless pupils and grand pupils.

I remember when Zhang Cui San came back from the Ice Fire Island, they made it just in time for Zhang San Feng's 100th birthday. At the time I'd say Zhang Cui San was no more than 40? That's a sixty year difference in age.

When did Zhang San Feng found the Wu Dang school and start taking in students?

[lthlth]

ZSF started Wudang in his 70s. ZCS was about 30 when he came back from Ice Fire island.

[Yang Guo]

oh... so what he do in those 50 years in between?

[Dennis Chen]

oh... so what he do in those 50 years in between?

Just going with the flow.

[Candide]

ZCS was about 35 when he got back from the Ice Fire Island. Song Yuan Qiao, the eldest of the Wudang heroes, was about 50. ZSF was 100 then. Therefore, ZSF might have started the Wudang school when he was about 50-something ( he didn't start the school with 7 disciples). That's about right for a school founder.

[bliss]

oh... so what he do in those 50 years in between?

He had to make up a whole school of martial arts.

[Cornsloth]

This may help you a bit:
Note: This is from the translation by Athena

Zhang JunBao thought: "Miss Guo said her older sister was very bad-tempered and often scolded other people for no particular reason. She also told me to just put up with her. I'm a grown man, why should I put up with that kind of attitude. If that husband and wife cling on to their self-respect, so should I, Zhang JunBao. Why do I have to put up with anyone's bad-temper?"

He made up his mind and carried the 2 buckets up and went up Mount WuDang. He found a cave and lived in it, living on water from springs and fruit from the forest. He started studying [Jiu Yang Zhen Jing].

Many years later, he realised something: "Master DaMo originated from India, even if he knew Chinese it would be very basic. The language of [Jiu Yang Zhen Jing] is very deep and profound. It is definitely not written by foreigners. Probably some ShaoLin monk created this and used the name of Master DaMo. And this monk wrote [Jiu Yang Zhen Jing] inside the Lankavatara sutra."

But this was just his deduction and he felt still somewhat puzzled by it. JueYuan taught Zhang JunBao [Jiu Yang Zhen Jing] for some time, so he was able to remember 50, 60 percent of it. More than 10 years later, his internal strength reached a very high level, and he started to study Taoist manuscripts and scriptures. He managed to learn a lot from the cultivation of "qi" in these scriptures.

On one particular day, he looked up in the sky and some some clouds and looked down and some the flowing water, Zhang JunBao seemed to have realised something. He went back to his cave and pondered on his discovery 7 days and 7 nights, finally he understood it completely and comprehended the martial arts theory that "gentleness can overcome fierceness." [Yi Rou Ke Gang]. He laughed to his heart's content.

This laughter produced a top martial arts master. He created a martial arts style based on Taoist theories and [Jiu Yang Zhen Jing]. He founded the famous and glorious WuDang School.

Later when he roamed about, he saw 3 peaks reaching up into the sky. He changed his name to SanFeng and became China's martial arts mysterious master namely, Zhang SanFeng.


And there was also this in chapter One:

Guo Xiang turned around and saw a 16, 17 year old man standing there. He had thick eyebrows and big eyes and was very tall. But still looked very young. She met him 3 years ago at Mount Hua, he was Zhang JunBao.



So we can surmise that he was at least 37 when he started studing Taoism. Unforunatly I've noticed Jin Yong is very undecided about numbers, there are always 7 to 8 people, they are always 17 to 18 years old. It's pretty annoying, it's really frustrating to get used to chinese writters.

But after what evidence I've given we still can only guess.
However we can guess that he didn't immeadiatly open his "school" to the public, he probably took on several students first, those students being the heros of Wu Dang.

I have not read enough of HSDS to know all of what you guys are talking about,and no one agrees on ZCS's age, I'll say thirty-five since it is the average age given.
So ZCS is thirty-five when ZSF is one-hundred years old, let us assume thatZCS has been training all his life, so he came to learn from ZSF when he was 5, meaning that ZSF was seventy. Since he was the fifth, his oldest brother I could guess from his maturity was no more then ten years older then ZCS. Though this is hard to say, perhaps this is revealed later in the novel.
So that puts us at Sixty...
So we can see only a seventeen year gap. That I would surmise is enough time to study taoism, create a fighting style, and become prestigous enough that mothers would send their children to study with this man.

Or I'm completely wrong...

[SkineePanda]

I think these are their ages when they first appear. Song Yuanqiao was described to be 40 or so. Yu Daiyan was stated specifically to be 30 or so. Both Yan Liting and Muo Shenggu was less than 20. So Yu Lianzhou, Zhang Zhongxi and Zhang Chuisan should be in between these guys.

[Cornsloth]

I was mostly right with my guesses and assumptions, looks like I was off by five years which still brings us only thirteen years to fill in with misc. jive that Martial Arts masters need to do.
I'm satisfied with my calculations.
Damn I seem a pompous *** today, Oh well.

[Yang Guo]

thanks for the answers

[lthlth]

According to Chap 3 of 1st edition trans. by zhaomin:

"After he reached 70 years-old, when his kung fu reached a very high level, Zhang SanFeng began to take disciples. Because of that, although he himself was already 90 years-old, his seven disciples were still young. The head disciple, Song Yuan Qiao, was not yet 40 years-old, while his 7th and youngest disciple, Muo ShengGu, was still a young teenager. But although those 7 disciples were still young, they had done good and noble works which shook the realm of martial arts."

[dgfds01]

ZCS was about 35 when he got back from the Ice Fire Island. Song Yuan Qiao, the eldest of the Wudang heroes, was about 50. ZSF was 100 then. Therefore, ZSF might have started the Wudang school when he was about 50-something ( he didn't start the school with 7 disciples). That's about right for a school founder.

ZCS was about 31-32 when he got back from the island.

From Chap 3 (Meh's transalation):
"As they continued on their journey, a person on a fast galloping horse suddenly passed them from behind. Du DaJin sees that it’s a youngster of about twenty-one or twenty-two."

That was when the Dragon Gate people met ZCS after losing Yu Daiyan on Wudang Mt. ZCS spent 10 years on the island, so he was around 31-32 when he returned.

[Loke-Gao-Zhu]

wow, son yun qiao lost his virginity when he's like about 60........damn wu dang pimps

[kyss of the sword]

if ZSF was 17 when he left shaolin, started studying taoism more then ten yers, 11-12yrs, he should be 29-3. study for a few years, understand soft overcome hard and crate martial arts at 35yrs approximate. wander wulin for 15yrs (just when guo xiang becomes nun) age fifty takes students starts wudang?!

[Noisulli]

Courtesy of Temujin admin for wuxiamania forum

Direct link to Wudang's Xuan Wu Quan.

The form is performed by Master Yuan Xiu Gang, the real Master of Wu Dang Martial Arts Schools.

Now, you can see the real Wu Dang Martial Arts you always watch in Wuxia movies Wink

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...67061&q=kungfu

This is the link for Wu Dang Ba Xian Jian (8 Immortal Swords Arts), also performed by Master Yuan Xiu Gang.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...03134&q=kungfu

and finally Wudang Tai Yi QiGong

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...61188&q=wudang

[yittz]

Much Thanks

[Extremer88]

wow, son yun qiao lost his virginity when he's like about 60........damn wu dang pimps

Is it true, really? Gosh...