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Thread: Tan Zhi Shen Tong underrated?

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    Default Tan Zhi Shen Tong underrated?

    Everyone talks about formlessness. Huang Yaoshi used pebbles to fight. Doesn't that make him par with Dugu Qiubai?

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    Senior Member superboy's Avatar
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    DY's lack of knowledge in sword techniques also makes his 6msj formless, but we can't really say that that's dugu's level. HYS's ability to kill with a pebble is impressive, but it's just a projectile.
    "I will punish the evil and protect the weak, superboy is in a winning streak. The sky's peak is what I seek"

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    Senior Member qiaofeng's Avatar
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    shen si fu is much more impressive. u dont even have to bend down to pick up a pebble. u can just spit into ur palm, then make top kung fu experts ur slaves with ur spit, now thats impressive

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    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qiaofeng
    shen si fu is much more impressive. u dont even have to bend down to pick up a pebble. u can just spit into ur palm, then make top kung fu experts ur slaves with ur spit, now thats impressive
    Can't beat my Siu Long Lui and her bees technique. Don't even need anything, just need to whistle and once stung, you'll be begging for your life. haha

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    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    Everyone talks about formlessness. Huang Yaoshi used pebbles to fight. Doesn't that make him par with Dugu Qiubai?
    Certainly it is impressive technique but that alone can't make him par with Dugu Quibai.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    Can't beat my Siu Long Lui and her bees technique. Don't even need anything, just need to whistle and once stung, you'll be begging for your life. haha
    Unfortunately, this is easily thwarted with protective clothing. No dice.

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    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    Unfortunately, this is easily thwarted with protective clothing. No dice.
    That's is the only way to beat it. But still a good technique. And if one is unprepare, would definitely become a victim to it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    That's is the only way to beat it. But still a good technique. And if one is unprepare, would definitely become a victim to it.
    This bee thingy, one whistles and the bees will come? At least that's how it was portrayed on TV. No doubt it's a good technique, but what if the bees take a while to arrive? And what if other people emulated the "whistle", won't the bees be confused? How is it like in the novel? I believe Jin Yong should have a good explanation detailed out in ROCH, as in the case of HSDS and DGSD (even though the nature of TV adaptations often led to these details being left out and audience left in the dark on the mastery of the author).

    And I believe somewhere in the story, XLN "gave" the bees to ZBT, 'cos I distinctly remember a scene in which the funny fellow summoned but couldn't get the bees to retreat, and thank goodness XLN happened to pass by.

    To tie back to the original subject of this thread, I'd think that Dugu would be the stronger of the 2, regardless of TZSG. Primarily due to his name. Plus HYS is a member of 5 Greats, while Dugu stands alone (more "exclusive"). As you can see, an unintelligent answer based sorely on impression since I don't know much about these 2 guys.

    BTW, why would this be considered formless? Aren't those pebbles a "form"?

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    That's is the only way to beat it. But still a good technique. And if one is unprepare, would definitely become a victim to it.
    The bees are apparently controlled by the sound of Little Dragon Girl or Chow Bak Tung's whistle command. Defeating it means overcoming the sound. Someone with Lion's Roar Technique could do it, or East Heretic Wong Yerk See playing his flute could probably do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    Can't beat my Siu Long Lui and her bees technique. Don't even need anything, just need to whistle and once stung, you'll be begging for your life. haha

    Sorry dude but i feel that yang guo and his wife sucks.

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    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    The bees are apparently controlled by the sound of Little Dragon Girl or Chow Bak Tung's whistle command. Defeating it means overcoming the sound. Someone with Lion's Roar Technique could do it, or East Heretic Wong Yerk See playing his flute could probably do it.
    That is a good theory. But what if the Bees have the canny abilities to seperate sounds on different levels? Kinda like how there are alot of sounds around us but our brains actually tune out some of them so we may focus on the important ones.

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    Moderator Han Solo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    Everyone talks about formlessness. Huang Yaoshi used pebbles to fight. Doesn't that make him par with Dugu Qiubai?
    HYS uses techniques with the tai zhi shen gong. it is not formless.

    Where is the old discussion about forms and formless?

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    Quote Originally Posted by superboy
    DY's lack of knowledge in sword techniques also makes his 6msj formless, but we can't really say that that's dugu's level. HYS's ability to kill with a pebble is impressive, but it's just a projectile.
    6MSJ actually have stances so his technique is actually form. He just cannot perform them correctly. So it should be semi between formless and form. But more on the form since he does not understand the technique. The more you understand the technique, the less you would use the original stances; and the more you reach formless.

    Quote Originally Posted by qiaofeng
    shen si fu is much more impressive. u dont even have to bend down to pick up a pebble. u can just spit into ur palm, then make top kung fu experts ur slaves with ur spit, now thats impressive
    actually at short distance, HYS doesn't have to use a pebbles like around 2 or 3 zhangs. Only at long distance, that he's require a medium.
    Last edited by TaiHan; 09-08-05 at 11:37 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    Certainly it is impressive technique but that alone can't make him par with Dugu Quibai.
    What can Dugu Qiubai do that Huang Yaoshi can't?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    What can Dugu Qiubai do that Huang Yaoshi can't?
    Kill with his mind, like Janitor Monk.
    明月心跳起來,又回頭,嫣然道,你還要不要我帶上那面具?
    傅紅雪冷道,現在你臉上豈非已經戴上了個面具?

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    Default Dan Zhi Sun Tong is underrated

    Dan Zhi Sun Tong isn't just shooting pebbles. It's actually a finger technique, like 1 Yang Zhi. You may only have image of DZST as pebble shooting because in LOCH, East Evil only used the finger technique once without pebbles and that was when he was fighting the mad OYF. However, in ROCH, it is used a bit by YG. The problem with YG using it is that we all don't see it at full potential because it takes 3 years of practice to master it. YG used it against Wu 3 dude, the No Valley Valley boss, and once somewhere else. According to ROCH, DZST is suppose to be like the 2nd best finger technique behind 1 Yang Zhi. From what I know, to truly use this technique at full potential, beside 3 years to master, you also must master the Sword technique that was also taught to YG by East Evil. The reason is because when you combine the two in combination, it will be all attacking on the Blood streams or Xua Duo. East Evil also used this to parazlye Golden Wheel Monk at about 3/4 of the 4th book.

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    Actually, I got it from the 2nd Edition novel where ZBT, YD and GLFW are fighting and all of a sudden something shoots out at GLFW. And out steps HYS who was in the area and heard the commotion and went to see what was up.

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    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    What can Dugu Qiubai do that Huang Yaoshi can't?
    how about unable to find a match anywhere, for starters.
    TC to Ken: "You need to watch the ending of ROCH 83."

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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    how about unable to find a match anywhere, for starters.
    That might just be an accident of birth, however. Dook Goo Kau Bai met no match during his lifetime, but just what kind of competition was he up against? We might never know.

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    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    That might just be an accident of birth, however. Dook Goo Kau Bai met no match during his lifetime, but just what kind of competition was he up against? We might never know.
    Dugu did travel around to find competition, covering vast lands. He probably faught more competition than any fighter as well as found plenty to beat. Some theorize he injure the creator of 9yum junging during his career. I'm sure he has beaten fighters who we would consider Greats but comparing to Dugu, they were ordinary. Eventually, Dugu ran out of opponents that he simply gave up and lived in seclusion.

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