ROCH chapter corrections

[fox-s]

Actually, that was my thought too ... I have posted a remark on this long time ago, but since the rest of the translators used the separate names, I was compelled to follow .. Anyway, don't take my word, I am not completely Chinese literate. Just a thought, what do the media use? How do they write Chinese names? Hmmm ... maybe I need to pay more attention. But then again, they (as most of them are westerners) might be as lost as we are.

[JamesG]

Actually, that was my thought too ... I have posted a remark on this long time ago, but since the rest of the translators used the separate names, I was compelled to follow .. Anyway, don't take my word, I am not completely Chinese literate. Just a thought, what do the media use? How do they write Chinese names? Hmmm ... maybe I need to pay more attention. But then again, they (as most of them are westerners) might be as lost as we are.

I had a PM and e-mail discussion with a Wuxiapedia guy about this as well and agreed that there might be some flack regarding correctness vs popular usage. I think I'll let Athena respond to my reply and decide what to do after that. It's early enough in this final proof-read for me to make changes without getting PO'd and giving up. If people suddenly jump in here after we've done four or five chapters and start nitpicking I'll just ignore them. Got to see my avatar-Avatar in action again today in the movie 'Wizards' on the Canadian Space Channel. Every time I see it I spot new things that I missed before.

[Athena]

Most Chinese academicians feel that one should "glue" the names together, Yaoshi in Huang Yaoshi without the space. Otherwise, it reads rather awkward and it feels like one is dissecting the names.

- So names with three characters (including surname) should look like this:

Lin Chaoying, Wang Chongyang, Huang Yaoshi, Hong Qigong, Qiu Qianren, Qiu Qianchi, Liu Chuxuan, Qiu Chuji, Wang Chuyi, Hao Datong, Zhao Zhijing, Yin Zhiping (*Zhen Zhibing), Lu Wende, Zhu Ziliu, Wu Santong, etc. etc.

- Double surname characters should look like this:

Ouyang Feng, Gongsun Zhi, Shangguang Jiannan, Dugu Qiubai etc.

- Names with the first character ending with a vowel and the second character starting with a vowel too, put an apostrophe in between.

Sun Bu'Er, this is not the same as the calling affectionate name Guo Jing, Xiao Longnu call Yang Guo as in Guo'er. So, some distinction should be made there. For instance using a capital letter + the apostrophe, or something like that.

- Taoist or Buddhist names should also be put together without space between the characters.

Reverend Yideng, Reverend Wuse, Ci'en (or Ci'En). Furthermore, for instance the leader of the Kunlun School was called Qingling Zi. Qingling is his given (Taoist) name, "zi" is a courteous term for enlightened sir. So writing it as following [Qingling Zi] would be better. Same goes for Xiaoxiang Zi.

If you want, I could help you out here and there.

[Bangs]

(Madam Wu was caught unawares when she heard her husband's shout.)

unaware

(Originally, the red flower and green leaf handkerchief was a lovers' gift from Li Mo Chou to Lu Zhen Yuan.)

lover's gift(LMC is one person)

(Li Mo Chou figured that Lu sounds like green, the green leaf representing her beloved, and thought "Red Flower Green Leaf, will be always together.")

will always be

(She had a plan to deal with the two, but didn't expect the sudden illness of the Lu Zhen Yuan.)

of Lu Zhan Yuan

(Can it be that when she touched her face her face gently she used the chance to emit poison?)

her face

(Wu San Tong replied, "Lu Zhen Yuan and his wife are dead now, his brother and wife died under your hands, its only two girls, you can just leave them.")

Lu Zhan Yuan (oh heck is it Zhen or Zhan? confusing lol)

(When the two words ‘Ah Yuan' was said, Li Mo Chou's faced changed and she said, "I once swore that whoever mentioned that ****'s name in front of me will be killed by me or I would perish trying.)

face (comment: Why the need for censorship? Little kids won't read this stuff)

(Gou Fu gazed afar but still couldn't see the two eagles, and shouted, "Eagles, eagles, come back here!")

Guo Fu

(As she was about to inquire who was she heard the man speak to Cheng Ying.)

who he was, she

(Li Mo Chou knew that she had met trouble today; if she didn't escape now her life would in danger.)

would be in

(He boy replied, "Your have so much skill, you can save me.")

The boy

(Guo Fu saw that his palm was black and said, "You hand is disgusting, take the flowers you pick and cover your smell with it.")

Your hand

(The boy was indeed named Yang Guo, and somehow Huang Rong had called it out, the shock was too much for him, his felt pain in his chest, the poison in his hand had returned, his brain started to get blurry and he fainted.)

he

The “Toad Stance” is one of the top skills in the martial arts word, the changes refined, mysterious and clever, and its internal energy aspect hard to beat; but if it is practiced wrong, not only will the body be harmed, but the practitioner will expel blood and die.

world

(Huang had suffered a blow but she wasn't hurt although she had a fright and made her flush.)

Huang Rong (just a family name makes it confusing)

(She’d had a tiresome day, and after a meal, she went to bed.)

She had

(Huang Rong and Guo Jing heard the shout, and hurried to see what the matter was; when they saw it Ke Zhen E on the floor they gasped.)

saw Ke Zhen E

(Go Fu shouted out, "Hey, what are you doing there?")

Guo Fu


That's it for me......

[hhaung]

Bangs, I believe it should be "unawares". Check out http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/unawares.

[JamesG]

Most Chinese academicians feel that one should "glue" the names together, Yaoshi in Huang Yaoshi without the space. Otherwise, it reads rather awkward and it feels like one is dissecting the names.

- So names with three characters (including surname) should look like this:

Lin Chaoying, Wang Chongyang, Huang Yaoshi, Hong Qigong, Qiu Qianren, Qiu Qianchi, Liu Chuxuan, Qiu Chuji, Wang Chuyi, Hao Datong, Zhao Zhijing, Yin Zhiping (*Zhen Zhibing), Lu Wende, Zhu Ziliu, Wu Santong, etc. etc.

- Double surname characters should look like this:

Ouyang Feng, Gongsun Zhi, Shangguang Jiannan, Dugu Qiubai etc.

- Names with the first character ending with a vowel and the second character starting with a vowel too, put an apostrophe in between.

Sun Bu'Er, this is not the same as the calling affectionate name Guo Jing, Xiao Longnu call Yang Guo as in Guo'er. So, some distinction should be made there. For instance using a capital letter + the apostrophe, or something like that.

- Taoist or Buddhist names should also be put together without space between the characters.

Reverend Yideng, Reverend Wuse, Ci'en (or Ci'En). Furthermore, for instance the leader of the Kunlun School was called Qingling Zi. Qingling is his given (Taoist) name, "zi" is a courteous term for enlightened sir. So writing it as following [Qingling Zi] would be better. Same goes for Xiaoxiang Zi.

If you want, I could help you out here and there.

My brain is now officially mush! Major confusion is setting in. [And IcyFox is blissfully unaware as he learns to polish his brass buttons and boots and march in step with his fellow soldiers! ]

The 'Tired Eyed Wizard' kowtows before Athena and pitifully asks: Help!!
What do you suggest in the way of helping me with the names?

[Athena]

I could help you out if you want to. But I think it is rather easy.

I take Lin Chaoying as an example. Her surname is Lin, we leave space between her surname and given name and then we type Chaoying without leaving space between [Chao] and [Ying].
So we get Lin Chaoying.
I have some time this week, if you want I could send you a private message with a list of those names already worked out via the aforementioned format. Just let me know.

[JamesG]

I could help you out if you want to. But I think it is rather easy.

I take Lin Chaoying as an example. Her surname is Lin, we leave space between her surname and given name and then we type Chaoying without leaving space between [Chao] and [Ying].
So we get Lin Chaoying.
I have some time this week, if you want I could send you a private message with a list of those names already worked out via the aforementioned format. Just let me know.

Please do so and thanks.

[TaiHan]

This thread is nice . I am loading some the chapter right now, and had been doing some minor editing also. On the names, I find some of them confusing also (I actually thought about editing them, but I kind of lost on few of them, so they were left alone for the time being)

Such as Ah Yuan, is it just Ah Yuan or Ahyuan?

Also Terms such as Jiang Nan, Jiang Hu, etc. Are they suppose to be put together also?
Jin Lun Fa Wang?

On places such as Mountains, Lakes:

Ex: Hua Shan?

How about martial art names:

Hang Long Shi Ba Zhang?


Sorry for the endless questions, I had more but can't remember them right now.

The list of translators and editors is already at the top of every chapter and again in the novel's frontpage.

Since we're uploading these edited copies now, I'll be removing the "translated by" notes in the middle of the chapters unless there's any objection from the translators.

You can always keep an offline copy as a reference for yourself as for who did what, if you're a translator, but then you already know what you did anyway.

So do you want me to leave them out? I actually think they are a pain to go back in and add them.

[HuangYushi]

This thread is nice . I am loading some the chapter right now, and had been doing some minor editing also. On the names, I find some of them confusing also (I actually thought about editing them, but I kind of lost on few of them, so they were left alone for the time being)

To: TaiHan
I think it's better if you leave the editing to JamesG. Then, we can be sure of having only *one* uniform copy of the text.

How about martial art names:
Hang Long Shi Ba Zhang?

To: TaiHan
Are you sure it's *Hang* Long Shi Ba Zhang?

To: JamesG
If it really is *Hang* Long Shi Ba Zhang, can you please review all the chapters done by that particular translator? It should be *Xiang* Long Shi Ba Zhang.

Thank you!

[TaiHan]

To: TaiHan
I think it's better if you leave the editing to JamesG. Then, we can be sure of having only *one* uniform copy of the text.



To: TaiHan
Are you sure it's *Hang* Long Shi Ba Zhang?

To: JamesG
If it really is *Hang* Long Shi Ba Zhang, can you please review all the chapters done by that particular translator? It should be *Xiang* Long Shi Ba Zhang.

Thank you!

My typo, in the translation it is mainly Eighteen Subduing Dragon Palm or something like that. Sometime I mix my vietnamese with the chinese pinyin.
(It was only an example, since there are other martial art names in the novel that I was curious about).

[fox-s]

Please do so and thanks.

JamesG & Athena, can I get a copy please? I think I will edit the chapters I am working on, to ease up a little bit of James' burden later on. You can pm me or James already knew my email address.

[JamesG]

I just noticed that this version of my avatar looks like he is using the 'Divine Flicking Finger'.

[Bangs]

I just noticed that this version of my avatar looks like he is using the 'Divine Flicking Finger'.

Put a green stuff on his hand and it becomes "Booger flicking finger".

[JamesG]

Put a green stuff on his hand and it becomes "Booger flicking finger".

Gaaaarrp! If the avatars were bigger I'd add a flying pebble to it!
I'm busy 'gluing' names together so I won't post chapter 3 until tomorrow. You'll have to wait for the 'glue to dry' before you get to nag me with errors.

Chapter 3 is posted!

[Athena]

I was going through the posted translations on the main site, looking through the names and such.
And I came across this in the translated chapter 36: Then these eight people bowed to her and introduced themselves. Everybody who heard their names was surprised. They were not ordinary people. The first was a Buddhist Monk, none other that Reverend Wu Se, the head of Lou Han Hall of the Shaolin Temple. The others were Old Master Zhao of Xing Yang, and other Seniors of Wulin world!

But in the original text in Chinese it is:
[八人躬身向郭襄行禮，自報姓名，群雄一听，無不駭然，原來當先一個老和尚，竟是五台山佛光寺方丈曇華大師， 素与少林寺方丈天鳴禪師齊名，其余趙老爵爺、聾啞頭陀、昆侖派掌門青靈子等，無一不是武林中久享盛名的前輩 名宿。]

Different people, reverend Wuse of Shaolin's Arhat Hall never showed up. That is why Guo Xiang did not recognize him in the first chapter of HSDS.

The first was an old Buddhist monk, none other than the abbot of Mount Wutai's Foguang Monastery, reverend Tanhua. He is the peer of the Shaolin's abbot, zen master Tianming. The others are old marquis Zhao* and the Deaf and Mute Dhuta*, Qingling Zi, the leader of the Kunlun School. All of them were seniors of the martial arts realm.

In chapter 37, I saw this Three Headed Mosquito Hou Tong Hai. This should be Three Headed Serpent, because it is [三頭蛟侯通海]. In some edition 2 copies, there was a typo and turned his nickname into mosquito. The poor man, lost his ears, lost an arm, he was also crippled and blinded now he is suffering from rheumatism. On top of that his rather cool nickname is turned into mosquito. Haha, the poor fellow.

The pills of the Peach Blossom Island, [九花玉露丸], should be Nine Flowers Jade dew Pills. [露] can mean revealing but it also means dew and in this case, Huang Yaoshi probably used dew to create these pills.

In chapter 39 I saw: Zhou Bo Tong laughed, “Duke Duan, don’t fret, this Old Urchin won’t die so easily. You should spend more effort treating that beauty Lu Wu Shuang.”

Yideng/Duan Zhixing used to be the emperor of Dali Kingdom, so Zhou Botong addressed him as [段皇爺] (emperor Duan).

[Athena]

Addendum on [頭陀]:
A "Tou Tuo" or Dhuta in Sanskrit is a monk who wants to pursue nirvana by cleansing himself of the trials in life.
They have 12 principles which helps them in this process:
1. Wearing cast-off rags
2. Wearing three simple garments
3. Eat only begged food
4. Only have two meals a day (breakfast and lunch)
5. No other food allowed between and after these meals
6. Eat small portions of food
7. Live like a hermit
8. Dwell amongst desolate places, tombs, (small) monasteries, etc.
9. Rest under trees and not in houses
10. Spend most of the time in open sky, meditating, etc.
11. Meditate wherever possible
12. Always sit (even when resting), lying down is not allowed.

"Tou Tuo" is a phonetical translation of Dhuta which means shaking off, cleansing in Sanskrit.

Addendum on [趙老爵爺]: This old marquis Zhao is a member of the imperial family of the Song dynasty (the Zhaos).
Personal opinion on this man, I don't like him. Guo Jing, Huang Rong and others are fighting for the survival of the remaining Song dynasty. This man has audacity not to show up at the Heroes Gathering, he was only present at Guo Xiang's birthday. Hello, people are fighting more or less for the dynasty of his family and he does nothing! I would like to kick his derriere.

[Bangs]

Gaaaarrp! If the avatars were bigger I'd add a flying pebble to it!
I'm busy 'gluing' names together so I won't post chapter 3 until tomorrow. You'll have to wait for the 'glue to dry' before you get to nag me with errors.

Chapter 3 is posted!

LOL! Nice finger flicks! I'll post up my read through later when I have time.

[fox-s]

Different people, reverend Wuse of Shaolin's Arhat Hall never showed up. That is why Guo Xiang did not recognize him in the first chapter of HSDS.

My mistake. I did not have access to the chinese version at that time, so I relied on different translation. I had a thought of going through the earlier chapters (32, 36 and 38) but since James has already started, I opted to leave it in his capable hands. Chapter 34 and 40 were also mine, but I did check them against the original chinese, so I hope they are OK.

James, would you kindly edit those offending paragraphs, please? Athena, thank you.

[JamesG]

It seems that Spring Break has given Athena the time to read our translation and she's using some of her time to help us. What a Fabulous and Wonderful friend!