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Thread: Did Yeung Gor begin to suspect the truth about Yeung Hong even early on?

  1. #1
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Default Did Yeung Gor begin to suspect the truth about Yeung Hong even early on?

    Until Ohr Jen Ngok and the former Jin Empire thugs Sa Tung Teen, Pang Lin Fu, and Ling Tze Seung Yan revealed to Yeung Gor the truth about his father Yeung Hong's life of villainy, Yeung Gor lived with the illusion that his father was a good, righteous man who had been betrayed and murdered. That's understandable: no son would want to believe that his father was scum.

    Nevertheless, didn't Yeung Gor suspect something was wrong with Yeung Hong even early on? Yeung Gor's mother Muk Lim Chi refused to discuss the subject of Yeung Hong with him. Gwok Jing and Wong Yung, whom Yeung Gor knew to be good and trustworthy people, were unable to give him a straight account of what happened. Yau Chui Gei wrote the epithet "unfilial student" on Yeung Hong's gravestone. Most significantly, nobody wanted to talk about Yeung Hong, much less honor his memory. This must have tipped Yeung Gor off that *something* must have been wrong with his father, even if he didn't know all the details. Do you think he might have subconsciously known (or at least suspected) it all along, but couldn't bring himself to face the truth until he had incontrovertible evidence?

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    Member Humplewumps's Avatar
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    Too busy going Gugugugugugugugugugugugugugugu to notice such unimportant hints.

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    Member LiarLiar's Avatar
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    Actually, YG did suspect the truth. Mainly because he saw how good of a person GJ was and knew there must unlining reasons why GJ would killed his father. He was just unwilling to think of his father as anything less than a hero.

    P.S. Ken, the whole of ROCH had been translated. It's a good read. You should really read it. By the way, it great to have a person like you in this forum, always come up with topics. Without you this forum wouldn't be as lively.
    Last edited by LiarLiar; 03-11-06 at 02:20 AM.

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LiarLiar
    Actually, YG did suspect the truth. Mainly because he saw how good of a person GJ was and knew there must unlining reasons why GJ would killed his father. He was just unwilling to think of his father as anything less than a hero.
    That's what I gather too. From his reaction to what Ohr Jen Ngok and the Jin flunkies told him, Yeung Gor was certainly upset, but he didn't seem shocked. His reaction was more that of a person finally getting confirmation of something he feared to acknowledge rather than being presented with completely unexpected information.

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    Member Humplewumps's Avatar
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    I always thought that given his earlier reactions to people saying his dad was a bad egg, he accepted Ke Zhen Er's version with 100% conviction rather quickly.

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    Senior Member Siven's Avatar
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    In ROCH06 that just came out the child YG asks, while throwing a tantrum, if GJ and HR were responsible for his father's death in the very first episode.
    林家有女玉啄成
    嫣然巧笑艳冠人
    纤纤起舞随风动
    疑似飞燕又重生

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    Senior Member Extremer88's Avatar
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    Everyone in the wuxia world talk about how heroic or powerful Guo Jing and Huang Rong is, but hardly anyone mention about the greatness of Yang Kang and Mu Nianci, because there's nothing to say about them at all.

    So when Yang Guo grew up, he might have the slightest idea in which he thought that his father was an ordinary guy in the jianghu world, and less accomplished or heroic as compared to GJ.
    ..ext88

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    Senior Member munianci's Avatar
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    Guo Jing did tell young Yang Guo that his father fell into bad company when they were on the way to Chong Yang Palace, but he didn't elaborate. "Your father was once taught by Priest Qiu. Alas, he fell into bad company."

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    Senior Member Snafu3721's Avatar
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    These are some of the things that bothered me about YG's character.

    He's supposed to be intelligent and witty. How can he not have figured out that his dad was a bad guy?

    And how can he POSSIBLY suspect GJ and HR of foul play?!? That is just ridiculous. YG was blantly just being a brat at some points when it came to matters of his father.

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    It's not that farfetched. Yue Buqun was a hypocrite and had everyone convinced he was a good guy; Guo Jing could have been doing the same thing in Yang Guo's mind. Once he saw with his own eyes, rather than hearsay and words, how Guo Jing was willing to sacrifice his own life multiple times he correctly deduced that GJ was not faking it and there was more to it than he knew, except he was still faced with the dilemma of vengeance being the #1 priority in those wulin times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snafu3721 View Post
    These are some of the things that bothered me about YG's character.

    He's supposed to be intelligent and witty. How can he not have figured out that his dad was a bad guy?

    And how can he POSSIBLY suspect GJ and HR of foul play?!? That is just ridiculous. YG was blantly just being a brat at some points when it came to matters of his father.
    When emotion gets in the way, the smartest people on earth can act like absolute idiots with no common sense.

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    Senior Member Snafu3721's Avatar
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    No denying that emotions plays an important factor in YG's dilemma.

    But as this thread points out, YG didn't want to face the facts until the last chapters of the book. I'm sure he knew that the story didn't add up about his father being a hero and the Guo's being murderers.

    YG had already witnessed MANY times how GJ was very heroic and willing to sacrifice anything for the people. Yet... he still kept thinking "my daddy must be a good guy.... damn the Guo's!" The part of the novel I couldn't stand most is when YG STILL tried to assasinate GJ after GJ wasted so much internal chi trying to "heal" YG from fire deviation at Xiang Yang. IMHO that's just a punk attitude!

    And as for the Yue Buqun example... although Yue turns out to be an ambitious a**hole, it's not the same case. I don't think YG was thinkning "GJ must be a fake gentleman... there must be something wrong with him!" And there is no way to comapre the deeds of Yue vs GJ. Their reputations are on totally different levels:

    1) Yue was seen as a decent man and leader of a noble sect. Thats about it...

    2) GJ is the Eagle Shooting HERO who contended in Mt. Hua, student of H7G (that alone can justify his integrity), student/sworn brother of QZ, fought mongols for the nation, husband of beggar sect leader, etc. etc. etc.
    Last edited by Snafu3721; 07-01-10 at 02:21 AM.

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    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Yang Guo had a strong preconceived notion of his father which made it hard for him to see the truth. In this regard he was effectively blind.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Even though he didn't actually face the fact that his dad was an evil traitor, he also gave up any hope that what GJ/HR did was unjust. He secretly knew his father deserved death for whatever reason, as he risked his life saving GJ/HR on multiple occasions, and made his peace with them.

    He avoided it as much as he could but when it hit him in the face, he manned up and accepted it. You can say Guo Jing went through a similar phase when he helped Genghis Khan conquer the world. He knew what he was doing was causing countless death and suffering, but when he finally saw first hand all the slaughtering of innocent civilians (he must have known it was happening even without witnessing it) he decided he couldn't do it anymore and took responsibility to stop it.

    It's extremely easy to be blind to things that you are unwilling to see.
    Last edited by tape; 07-01-10 at 08:40 AM.

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    Senior Member xiaolong's Avatar
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    Actually, what I don't get is...why didn't GJ and HR tell him that OYF was pretty much responsible for YK's death after they found out that he learned the toad stance from OYF? (YK died from OYF's poison because OYF refused to give him the antidote - I'd say OYF held more responsibility than HR for YK's death) Would have saved a lot of trouble later.

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xiaolong View Post
    Actually, what I don't get is...why didn't GJ and HR tell him that OYF was pretty much responsible for YK's death after they found out that he learned the toad stance from OYF? (YK died from OYF's poison because OYF refused to give him the antidote - I'd say OYF held more responsibility than HR for YK's death) Would have saved a lot of trouble later.
    Gwok Jing wasn't a liar, though, and to say that Au Yeung Fung was responsible for Yeung Hong's death was to bend the truth quite a bit (after all, Au Yeung Fung didn't personally or deliberately administer the poison). Many factors went into Yeung Hong's death, but the main factor was Yeung Hong's own vile intentions.

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