Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng after SENTIMENTAL SWORDSMAN

[Ken Cheng]

During the SENTIMENTAL SWORDSMAN, RUTHLESS SWORD storyline, Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng, two fairly similar characters, clashed twice. The first time, Ging Mo Meng defeated Ah Fei easily while the latter was in the thrall of Lam Sin Yee and had lost the deadly edge he had commanded when he first met Lee Chum Foon earlier in the novel. Later, however, after Ah Fei rejected Lam Sin Yee and regained his edge, he defeated Ging Mo Meng even more easily than Ging previously defeated him.

Both Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng survived SSRS, and an older and more powerful Ah Fei later appeared in BORDERTOWN WANDERER. Ging Mo Meng was not the kind to take a defeat meekly. Did he challenge Ah Fei again? If so, what was the result?

[Siven]

Maybe I got the names wrong, but didn't Ging Mo Meng (is this the guy who was "trained only to kill" or something and followed the #1 baddie around all day?) have a disciple too? I seem to remember his disciple picking a fight with Lee's student...

[CFT]

Ging Mo Meng's student I think is Lo Siu Gwai, who had a run in with Yip Hoi in BORDERTOWN WANDERER.

[slchan0]

I thought at the end of SSRS Ging Mo Meng already lost his purpose in life. Don't think he'll come out for revenge personally since his world revolves around Shang Gun something..

[CC]

Jing WuMing showed up in Bian Cheng Lang Zhi.

He talked to Ye Kai and said that in the time following Shangguan's death, he searched far and wide for Dagger Li. He wanted to challenge and defeat Li. It was only after some time that he gave up the search because he decided that he could never defeat Li.

It basically was one of those Gu Long philosophical plots about how a dagger which was meant for doing good and saving lives will never be defeated etc etc.

[Ken Cheng]

I think it's regrettable that Gu Long never penned a novel in the SENTIMENTAL SWORDSMAN series that focused on Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng as the two main characters when they reached the pinnacle of their prime as wulin stalwarts.

In SENTIMENTAL SWORDSMAN, RUTHLESS SWORD, both Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng were gifted up-comers, but neither one was yet at the elite level that he could truly pose a challenge to such top wulin luminaries such as Old Man Sheun, Seung Gwoon Gum Hung, and Lee Chum Foon. Both Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng demonstrated that they had the potential to reach that level (and possibly beyond), but as of the end of SSRS, they had not attained that level yet.

By the time of BORDERTOWN WANDERER, when they reappeared, Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng had attained top-dog status in wulin, but they were also past their prime. The wulin youth generation was now led by Yip Hoi and his peers, and Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng were retired elders. Gu Long essentially skipped over Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng's generation in terms of depicting them as *the* eminent active heroes of wulin.

[Ian Liew]

I don't think that Jing Wuming and Ah Fei were that far from the wulin elite, unless No 4 Guo Songyang was quite far from No 3 Li Xunhuan. Jing did manage to kill Guo in a fair fight. Granted, Guo deliberately gave openings to Jing so that Li Xunhuan could learn Jing's technique by examining the wounds on the corpse, but I don't think Guo would have chosen to do that had he had even a remote chance of winning. He must have realised he was totally outmatched, and resolved to gain the biggest advantage for his friend before going down.

There seemed to be quite a big gap between Guo and No 6 onwards (can't really tell with Lu Fengxian other than he was totally outclassed by Shangguan Jinhong, but then everyone, including Li Xunhuan and Old Man Sun, was too) so maybe there was a big gap between Guo and Li. I always thought, though, that Jing Wuming and Ah Fei were pretty much there already, just that they were too young to be included in the book when Bai Xiaosheng wrote it.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Keep in mind, though, that Jing Wuming was with Shangguan Jinhong at that time, which is why Guo Songyang was 100% sure that he was going to die and exposed so many flaws. If Jing Wuming had been by himself, I doubt Guo Songyang would have acted in such a way! My personal opinion is that Guo Songyang is most likely stronger than Jing Wuming by himself.

I don't think that Jing Wuming and Ah Fei were that far from the wulin elite, unless No 4 Guo Songyang was quite far from No 3 Li Xunhuan. Jing did manage to kill Guo in a fair fight. Granted, Guo deliberately gave openings to Jing so that Li Xunhuan could learn Jing's technique by examining the wounds on the corpse, but I don't think Guo would have chosen to do that had he had even a remote chance of winning. He must have realised he was totally outmatched, and resolved to gain the biggest advantage for his friend before going down.

There seemed to be quite a big gap between Guo and No 6 onwards (can't really tell with Lu Fengxian other than he was totally outclassed by Shangguan Jinhong, but then everyone, including Li Xunhuan and Old Man Sun, was too) so maybe there was a big gap between Guo and Li. I always thought, though, that Jing Wuming and Ah Fei were pretty much there already, just that they were too young to be included in the book when Bai Xiaosheng wrote it.

[Ken Cheng]

I don't think that Jing Wuming and Ah Fei were that far from the wulin elite, unless No 4 Guo Songyang was quite far from No 3 Li Xunhuan. Jing did manage to kill Guo in a fair fight. Granted, Guo deliberately gave openings to Jing so that Li Xunhuan could learn Jing's technique by examining the wounds on the corpse, but I don't think Guo would have chosen to do that had he had even a remote chance of winning. He must have realised he was totally outmatched, and resolved to gain the biggest advantage for his friend before going down.

There seemed to be quite a big gap between Guo and No 6 onwards (can't really tell with Lu Fengxian other than he was totally outclassed by Shangguan Jinhong, but then everyone, including Li Xunhuan and Old Man Sun, was too) so maybe there was a big gap between Guo and Li. I always thought, though, that Jing Wuming and Ah Fei were pretty much there already, just that they were too young to be included in the book when Bai Xiaosheng wrote it.

My impression is that during SSRS, Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng were both bursting with potential, but were still a bit raw and unrefined compared to the established elites. As superb as they were, Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng were not yet ready to really challenge the likes of Old Sheun, Seung Gwoon Gum Hung, and Lee Chum Foon.

[Ken Cheng]

What I think is frustrating for fans of Ah Fei and Ging Mo Meng (and I count myself among these fans) is that in SSRS, we see them raw and undeveloped...definitely supremely talented, but not refined, and then don't see them again until they're more or less retired from active wulin (and thus, don't really demonstrate the extent to which their skills had grown). In SSRS, Ah Fei couldn't even seal or unseal acupressure points (sort of a basic skill for wulin people, but something Ah Fei had not yet learned to do), and neither he nor Ging Mo Meng demonstrated any skill beyond swordsmanship and...killing people. Neither one was a complete martial artist (with significant all-around skill in inner power, hing gung, and acupressure sealing) yet. I would have liked to see more of both of them as fully developed, but still fully active martial artists.

It's like we missed out on both of these guys in their true prime.

[daydreamer_gal]

I got the impression that Jing Wuming was a more well-rounded fighter than Ah Fei (in terms of variety of skills, though his specialty was no doubt his sword skills). Probably not surprising since he actually had formal training by Shanguan Jinhong.

Yeah, I found these 2 guys interesting too, and would have liked to know a bit more about how they spent their time in the 15 -20 yrs between SSRS and Bordertown Wanderer.

Btw, did something happen to Jin Wuming's arm in those years? I read the translation of the series a while back, and in SSRS, my impression was that his arm was just crippled, not cut off, but in Bordertown Wanderer, they referred to him as a "one-armed swordsman".. heh.. i guess we can always blame the XO as usual =P

[Ken Cheng]

I got the impression that Jing Wuming was a more well-rounded fighter than Ah Fei (in terms of variety of skills, though his specialty was no doubt his sword skills). Probably not surprising since he actually had formal training by Shanguan Jinhong.

This is true. Both of them had great natural talent, and both were great at *improvising*. When Ah Fei was swordless at Shaolin Temple, he used an *icicle* to kill the monk who was trying to murder him. That was impressive.

[Ken Cheng]

Btw, did something happen to Jin Wuming's arm in those years? I read the translation of the series a while back, and in SSRS, my impression was that his arm was just crippled, not cut off, but in Bordertown Wanderer, they referred to him as a "one-armed swordsman".. heh.. i guess we can always blame the XO as usual =P

Adaptations show him as having two arms, but only one that was operational after Lee Chum Foon daggered him (and I think Seung Gwoon Fei caused further damage to the arm before dying). I guess if Ging Mo Meng had two arms, but only one that worked, for wulin purposes, he was essentially a one-armed man.

[daydreamer_gal]

I guess that's true.

The thing is that the reference was made by people who saw him but didn't know who he was (I think one of them was Ding Ling Lin), so if he had both arms, they shouldn't know that only one was functional. Of course, I suppose his other arm could have been so badly damaged that it was visibly clear that it was not usable in a fight.

[minutemanwayne]

Probably another Gu Long brain fart. He obviously still had his arm in Sentimental Swordsman (although I dont know how that is possible with a 7 inch hole in it) whereas in Bordertown Ding Ling Ling described him as a one-armed man. Probably had it amputated later as it was useless anyways.

[Ken Cheng]

Probably another Gu Long brain fart. He obviously still had his arm in Sentimental Swordsman (although I dont know how that is possible with a 7 inch hole in it) whereas in Bordertown Ding Ling Ling described him as a one-armed man. Probably had it amputated later as it was useless anyways.

Seven-inch hole, eh? Guess it was a good idea to just cut it off: infection, gangrene...it was essentially dead flesh, attached or not.

[tape]

He pushed a knife from his shoulder all the way through his body, sounds like some serious damage.

[Ken Cheng]

He pushed a knife from his shoulder all the way through his body, sounds like some serious damage.

Whatever slim hope that the wound might heal was lost when Seung Gwoon Fei, in a final act of spite, shattered that same shoulder.

[daydreamer_gal]

For some reason, I've always felt rather sorry for Jing Wuming whenever he appears in the story. His life (or lackthereoff, as implied by his name) is just so empty.

[daydreamer_gal]

Whatever slim hope that the wound might heal was lost when Seung Gwoon Fei, in a final act of spite, shattered that same shoulder.

I think it was slightly different in the novel. If I remember correctly, Jing Wuming used his injured arm to block Shangguan Fei's rings before proceeding to gut him. Though in any case, the outcome was the same.