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Thread: What makes Jin Yong the most popular wuxia writer?

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    Moderator kidd's Avatar
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    Default What makes Jin Yong the most popular wuxia writer?

    There is a saying, "wherever there is chinese, there will have Jin Yong's books"

    What makes Jin Yong the most popular wuxia novels writer?

    How is Jin Yong's work better than the works of other wuxia novel writers like Liang Yu Sheng, Gu Long, Wang Rui An, Huang Yi, Wang Du Lu and Wong Long Sheng?

    Fans of the other writers also can give your opinion about your fave authors' works.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

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    Senior Member Candide's Avatar
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    Because he wrote entertaining lies that have 70%+ truth in them - using real life materials (history, real martial arts, caligraphy, music, wine tasting etc.) but just twisting some minor details to make them almost believable and fascinating to read. Essentially he is a better "liar" than other authors, who "lie" so badly that it makes even the dumbest reader scream "BULLSHIT!"

    Because his characters are mostly unique. He didn't clone his characters like other authors, notably Gu Long. They could also be understood or viewed in many dimensions. Other authors' characters are mostly 1D. When I read Gu Long characters, I quickly get this: the men act cool, talk like nerds and behave like dickheads; the women are horny, cruel and untrustworthy. When I read other authors' characters (excluding LYS' as I haven't read his work yet) I get this: the men are violent, horny and powerful as Superman; the women are horny and submissive.

    Because his stories have multiple depths. You can read the novels briefly just to enjoy violence, beautiful women and witty jokes, or you can read the novels backwards and argue days and nights on Internet forums (or at school/work/restaurants in my parents' and grandparents' days) about some random ambiguos sentence just to prove that your favourite character is 0.1 of a level better than another person's favourite. Or you can waste your time researching stuff he wrote about martial arts or scholarly arts because they sound so cool and believable, only to find that half of them are fairy tales, but you still feel that it was worth it.
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    Banned strife_au's Avatar
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    Because they are so deep, and well linked seamlessly. It was original and everyone liked it, people get used to referring to all his characters martial arts etc. Sounds quite realistic aswell

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    Moderator kidd's Avatar
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    Thanks Candide for the serious detailed answer and thanks strife too.

    I find it unbelievable that there is only one writer good writer in this genre of literature.

    I mean, so many wuxia story writers, only one with depth and originality?
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

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    TommyH
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    I guess it's because he doesn't just create some unrealistic thing out of thin air. His stories actually had a lot of real history in it and many people like it for that. Plus he created many interesting characters and not just the usual heroic-powerful-handsome characters. And a lot of his characters aren't perfect like in most books. GJ isn't 'handsome' and he is slow-witted. YG is handsome but he later loses his arm. WXB is a pervert and is anti-hero but is actually quite enjoyable to read about and to watch on TV. A lot of wuxia flavor in short.

    JY stories has a lot of elements to it and it just isn't the usual stuff from many authors. That's why you see most of the discussion in this forum is on JY novels, characters, places, etc.

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    Senior Member Demonic Swordsman's Avatar
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    i think JY is the most popular wuxia writer because of the depth of his history, and the realistic martial arts. He did research on actual moves, accupoints, medicine ect. Also JY's characters arnt perfect and thus the readers can sympathize with them. His stories are seamlessly linked and writen and are also original
    "The most happy marriage I can picture or imagine would be union of a deaf man to a blind woman."

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    IMHO it's because Jin Yong's books are good novels with wuxia in them, whereas some other books are about wuxia and use the novel as a means to that end.

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    Moderator kidd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyH
    JY stories has a lot of elements to it and it just isn't the usual stuff from many authors. That's why you see most of the discussion in this forum is on JY novels, characters, places, etc.
    Just curious. Have you read the works of these many authors?

    The discussion here mostly centered on Jin Yong novels, most probably also because Jin Yong's novels was the most widely adapted while we seldom see adaptations of other novel. So, people who has only seen the tv series but not read the books, like you and me, can only discuss Jin Yong's stories here because those are the only stories we are familiar with.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

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    TommyH
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    Quote Originally Posted by kidd
    Just curious. Have you read the works of these many authors?

    The discussion here mostly centered on Jin Yong novels, most probably also because Jin Yong's novels was the most widely adapted while we seldom see adaptations of other novel. So, people who has only seen the tv series but not read the books, like you and me, can only discuss Jin Yong's stories here because those are the only stories we are familiar with.
    But come on...for those people who read JY, GL, LYS, HY, and more books from more authors. Who do you guys think is the best?

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    Moderator kidd's Avatar
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    Thank you all for the insightful answers.

    I've only read Lu Xiao Feng (translation) and Xia Ke Xing (half-way through), so, most of my knowledge is from TV series.

    So, I was most interested to know from readers who have read the works of many authors what makes Jin Yong's works tick and what is lacking in the works of the other authors.

    It's still unbelievable that one author dominates the whole wuxia genre (ok, a pretty large piece of the cake also went to Gu Long). In all genre of english literature, there are many authors that are good. It depends on the readers taste which one they like.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

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    TommyH
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    I wonder what happened to the people who voted Gu Long in my JY vs. GL thread...

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    Moderator kidd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyH
    But come on...for those people who read JY, GL, LYS, HY, and more books from more authors. Who do you guys think is the best?
    That is the reason I asked my question in the first place. To know why 'people who read JY, GL, LYS, HY, and more books' still like Jin Yong's work best.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

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    Banned strife_au's Avatar
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    Oh yeah and adaptions of his novels are the best... others aren't so good

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    Senior Member Extremer88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strife_au
    Oh yeah and adaptions of his novels are the best... others aren't so good
    LOL. More money are spent on doing JY adpatations than compared to GL adaptations as far as those producers are concerned.
    ..ext88

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    Quote Originally Posted by Extremer88
    LOL. More money are spent on doing JY adpatations than compared to GL adaptations as far as those producers are concerned.
    exactly lol, makes the general public think JY novels would be the best, since the most money is spent on it.... I think his novels are the most ideal to turn into adpations

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    Moderator kidd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strife_au
    exactly lol, makes the general public think JY novels would be the best, since the most money is spent on it.... I think his novels are the most ideal to turn into adpations
    You make a good point.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

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    Member Naruto-kun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Candide
    the women are horny, cruel and untrustworthy. When I read other authors' characters (excluding LYS' as I haven't read his work yet) I get this: the men are violent, horny and powerful as Superman; the women are horny and submissive.
    Horny women ? Which Gu Long ? Gotta read that !

    I rarely watched adaptions but I still think he's better than other authors. I don't think his first edition enjoyed a big marketing budget but he still be popular. It's proven and true that his works were exceptional. Depth, as Candide like to put it. I occasionally read Gulong and I can't help it during one I thought to myself, "Heh ? Whatt ??" in a disbelief.
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    Senior Member The Khan's Avatar
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    The only writer that comes close to Jin Yong imo is Huang Yi. His style is also very similar to Jin Yong in that his best novels were part fiction part historical.

    Da Tang shuang Long zuan is one of my favourite novels, so is Xun Qin ji.

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    I agree with Candide and K2Grey.

    So far, I have read 12 novels by JY (as I described in another thread about ranking JY's novels). I also read quite many of GL's novels since my younger brother like him. For GL, I have read the Lengendary Twins (the little Fish's story), all books from the Adventure of Chu Liu Xiang series, a few (2-3) books from the Adventure of Lu Xiao Feng series, Little Flying-Dagger Li, "Meteor. Butterfly. Sword" and another story about the same main character (I forget the name of the novel), Hero without Tears, a few (or many?) of his Weapon series, Third Young Master's Swords, "Midnight, Bright Moon, Saber", another novel translated as "Happy Heros" in Thai (don't know the real name), plus a few more. So, I read totally around 20-30 novels by GL.

    I also read a few Wuxia novels by other authors but I never remember the author name. Some of them I read because the TV adaptation of these novels are interesting. But, honestly, I quite disappoint when I read the novels. One series, I remember quite correctly, is about the story of 4 detectives (they are really a police officer/investigator or something like that). All four of them come from the same master and the 1st one (or the leader) cannot walk (he sit on the wheel chair, if my memory is correct). I think I read about 1-2 books of this series but the last book I read it ends like the bad guy is so powerful that no one can beat him. However, he died because of lightening since "heaven" will "punish" the bad guy. Come on!!!!!!

    About GL, first, note that I think my brother have all books of Lu Xiao Feng but I cannot read anymore after a few books. Honestly, the story is not very logical as a detective story. I ask myself "What?", "What is that?", "How can he (GL) do this?", etc. Then, no more LXF for me. When I read Little Flying Dagger Li, I wonder why many people praise this story a lot. It was fun but not exceptional, to me. Nevertheless, I like the Lengendary Twins and CLX series but mostly for entertaining since they are easy to read and enjoyable...although the last book of CLX (Midnight-Blooming Orchid, I think) is...well... Also, another book in CLX series (Legend of the Peach Blossom, I think), GL make CLX getting married and he know the girl because she did *****...I say GL show his gut to do this.

    Also, when I read the "Happy Heros" (forget the real name), well 4 (or 3? or 5?) guys live in the same room (same house?) and sleep on the bed that described as dirty as I try to imagine. Sigh. However, the worst one out of GL's novels I read, in my humble opinion, is "Meteor. Butterfly. Sword" and another story about the same main character. These two books (especially the second one of these two) are too much for me. YG's problem is nothing comparing to the main character of these 2 novels and the way the story go is quite illogical in my opinion...too much unnecessary (can I say stupid?) pressure.

    The Third Master and the story of Moon Saber are ok. However, I don't understand why GL like to have his main cool heros sleep with his companion (lover/ex-lover/etc.) before the fight as shown in the end part of the Third Master and probably a few more GL books that I read (if I remember correctly). I agree with Candide that many girls in GL novels (of course, not all, for example, some girls in Flying Dagger Li are not that easy) like to go bed with (cool?) guys. In the Lengendary Twins, there is a time that the little fish may get killed by his twin but he was safe because a girl undress and put her nake body on his twin to let him escape. Sigh. I don't know what to say.

    Anyway, to me, GL is purely for entertain and some of the books are quite enjoyable. JY's novels are more than that. The depth of JY's stories and characters, by putting his idea of nation, virtue, human nature, politics, etc., make his novels very interesting and, at the same time, fun and enjoyable. It make his reader "think" and can be "discuss" and "debate". His novels also has a quality of a "good novel" and sometimes "classics" in the literature (both Chinese and World).

    I heard that usually Wuxia novel is a low-class novel just for entertaining. JY is the first one who make the Wuxia novels into the literature (i.e., accepted by scholars). To me, JY may be the only Wuxia writer who have this quality so far. Note that I never read Huang Yi's novels. However, I have seen one of adaptation of his novels (about the 1st emperor of China with the time trip - but not the whole TV series, btw) and heard a bit about another of his story. Honestly, I don't feel like his storyline can capture me...although I could be totally wrong.
    Last edited by Wu Xing; 05-19-06 at 04:28 PM.

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    Senior Member Zhuge Liang's Avatar
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    None of the other authors can compare when it come to character development. Gu Long's heroes are really 1D as candide says. The most memorable one was the brat kid of Lin Xin Yi in Dagger Lee and even then... I kinda wished Lee Chum Foon would finally get killed for his masochistic do-gooder niavety ways.

    JY on the otherhand can create characters which really stick in your mind even if you don't like them. He makes you really concerned about the well being of characters and there is constant thrills.
    TristeCoeur on Lady Yang: Someone needs 2 tell her that when u want 2 save people from being killed, u need to hurry the hell up, not play bull#### music & dance around. Her mission failed big time

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