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Thread: 20-year old Gwok Jing is timewarped 20 years into the future...

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Default 20-year old Gwok Jing is timewarped 20 years into the future...

    The 20-year old Gwok Jing who fought against East Heretic Wong Yerk See and North Beggar Hung 7 Gung in the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament occupied a unique level of martial arts in his era. He was still no match for the Greats, but was head and shoulders above everyone else in wulin. During that period, there was no martial artist at Gwok Jing's level: six other fighters were definitely above him, and everybody else was definitely beneath him.

    Let's take the Gwok Jing of that period and timewarp him 20 years into the future. He is in the middle section of ROCH. How does 20-year old Gwok Jing, who fought two Greats to a combined 600 moves at the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament, fare against these ROCH-era fighters in one-on-one combat:

    1. Gung Sheun Tze

    2. Wan Hak Sai

    3. Siu Seung Tze

    4. Lui Mor Singh

    5. Lee Mok Sau


    These five fighters from ROCH were also sub-Greats level, but better than most everyone else. How good a match would it be between any one of them and 20-year old Gwok Jing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    The 20-year old Gwok Jing who fought against East Heretic Wong Yerk See and North Beggar Hung 7 Gung in the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament occupied a unique level of martial arts in his era. He was still no match for the Greats, but was head and shoulders above everyone else in wulin. During that period, there was no martial artist at Gwok Jing's level: five other fighters were definitely above him, and everybody else was definitely beneath him.

    Let's take the Gwok Jing of that period and timewarp him 20 years into the future. He is in the middle section of ROCH. How does 20-year old Gwok Jing, who fought two Greats to a combined 600 moves at the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament, fare against these ROCH-era fighters in one-on-one combat:

    1. Gung Sheun Tze

    2. Wan Hak Sai

    3. Siu Seung Tze

    4. Lui Mor Singh

    5. Lee Mok Sau


    These five fighters from ROCH were also sub-Greats level, but better than most everyone else. How could a match would it be between any one of them and 20-year old Gwok Jing?
    I think GJ can beat them all. GJ is nowhere near the level he was in the very first part of ROCH when YG was 14 and GJ was 33. And GJ achieved mastery of 9 Yin + has a new and improved modified XL18Z. A 33 years old GJ would probably had murdered any of these in less than 5 stances. A 20 years old GJ is not as strong, but still strong enough against these 5 fighters. His internal would have been enough to beat any of these at 20. Even if GJ's palm is not conservative, his unmodified XL18Z's brute force is enough to kill any of these 5 fighers.

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    At 20 years old, most of his internal was still Quanzhen. Did Ma Yu give him training that other Quanzhen disciples weren't fortunate enough to receive?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    At 20 years old, most of his internal was still Quanzhen. Did Ma Yu give him training that other Quanzhen disciples weren't fortunate enough to receive?
    No, but he had limited training in the 9 Yum Jen Ging's inner power techniques, which none of the Cheun Jen Sect disciples had benefitted from. This was not very much compared to what he would gain in later years, but it was still enough to put him significantly ahead of fighters such as Ma Yuk and Yau Chui Gei.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    At 20 years old, most of his internal was still Quanzhen. Did Ma Yu give him training that other Quanzhen disciples weren't fortunate enough to receive?
    No.. GJ was already more 9 Yin. But GJ hasn't yet to achieve full mastery of 9 Yin and hasn't learned all of 9 Yin yet. 此时郭靖早已将《九阴真经》上的《易筋锻骨篇》练成,既得一灯大师译授了真经总纲,经上其他的功夫也已练了 不少,内力的精纯浑厚更是大非昔比,身子略侧,避开掌势,回了一招见龙在田。欧阳锋回掌接住,这降龙十 八掌的功夫他本知之已稔,又知郭靖得洪七公真传,掌力极强。但比之自己终究还差着一截,不料这下硬接硬架, 身子竟然微微晃动。高手对掌,只要真气稍逆,立时会受重伤,他略有大意,险些输在郭靖手里,不由得吃了一惊 :只怕不等我年老力衰,这小子就要赶上我了。当即左掌拍出。This was approx. GJ's mastery of 9 Yin at the end of LOCH. This is in the middle of the 4th book when GJ fought OYF for the 2nd to last time in the tent at the Mongol camp. At this time, GJ has learned Yi Jing Dwan Gu Pian, the main Sanskrit part, and several others arts within 9 Yin.
    At this time, GJ's unmodified XL18Z palm is already near OYF's palm.
    GJ would become a little bit stronger before he goes to Hua Shan 2 because OYF would force him later to learn more.

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    If by the end of LOCH GJ is already near OYF's palm, and GJ could only match OYF's palm by the beginning of ROCH, GJ didn't improve much in 16 years. This is assuming that OYF's advancement was also limited.

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    Getting more on topic, Dennis, do you think 20 year old Gwok Jing could take, one-on-one, each of those five sub-Great level ROCH fighters I listed?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    Getting more on topic, Dennis, do you think 20 year old Gwok Jing could take, one-on-one, each of those five sub-Great level ROCH fighters I listed?
    I think he could. I can't quite picture any of them being able to resist H7G's or HYS's final attack on LOCH GJ as well as GJ did.

    Except possibly Gongsun. That guy seems slightly above the other four IMHO.

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    how old was YG when GJ was 40 yrs old?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus
    how old was YG when GJ was 40 yrs old?
    Yang Kang died when GJ was still about 20, so YG should be about 20 years old when GJ is 40.

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    I think dialogues are more interesting when they are allowed to and can grow organically from the original premise. It's what makes conversations good and allows people to grow in knowledge and understanding by asking questions pertaining to the subject relating to the original premise given.
    Last edited by Dennis Chen; 06-29-06 at 01:56 AM.

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    i think that GJ would beat all the listed save perhaps GSZ he seemed pretty powerful to me and GJ might have some trouble against his double sword-sabre technique.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Chen
    I think dialogues are more interesting when they are allowed to and can grow organically from the original premise. It's what makes conversations good and allows people to grow in knowledge and understanding by asking questions.
    That's true, but you could still offer a straight opinion on the question.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus
    i think that GJ would beat all the listed save perhaps GSZ he seemed pretty powerful to me and GJ might have some trouble against his double sword-sabre technique.
    It was a technique based on fancy moves, so Hung 7 Gung's essential lesson to Gwok Jing applies: break fancy moves with overwhelming force.

    The question being, was Gwok Jing's force at age 20 overwhelming enough to overcome Gung Sheun Tze's fancy moves?

    If that fails, perhaps Gwok Jing could try using Left/Right Hand Technique with Hong Lung 18 Palms on one hand and Vacant Fist on the other (or perhaps two different Hong Lung Palm variations) and see if that can match Gung Sheun's dual weapons technique.

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    Senior Member Exodus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    It was a technique based on fancy moves, so Hung 7 Gung's essential lesson to Gwok Jing applies: break fancy moves with overwhelming force.

    The question being, was Gwok Jing's force at age 20 overwhelming enough to overcome Gung Sheun Tze's fancy moves?

    If that fails, perhaps Gwok Jing could try using Left/Right Hand Technique with Hong Lung 18 Palms on one hand and Vacant Fist on the other (or perhaps two different Hong Lung Palm variations) and see if that can match Gung Sheun's dual weapons technique.
    but doesn't GSZ have pretty good inner power but sure GJ might have better so i do think that GJ will win.

    YG would beat GJ easily when they both were at the same age

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus
    YG would beat GJ easily when they both were at the same age
    That discussion has been continued in The Official Gwok Jing vs. Yeung Gor Debate.

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    Let's timewarp 20-year old Gwok Jing even farther ahead in time...about 130 years to the time of HSDS.

    Let's set him up against these folks (one on one, fair fights):

    1. Yeung Siu

    2. Yan Teen Sing

    3. Tse Tsun

    4. Fan Yiu

    5. Granny Golden Flower

    6. Wai 1 Siu

    7. *one* Yeun Ming Elder

    8. *one* of the Dao generation Shaolin monks

    How does 20-year old Gwok Jing fare against each of these opponents?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    Let's timewarp 20-year old Gwok Jing even farther ahead in time...about 130 years to the time of HSDS.

    Let's set him up against these folks (one on one, fair fights):

    1. Yeung Siu

    2. Yan Teen Sing

    3. Tse Tsun

    4. Fan Yiu

    5. Granny Golden Flower

    6. Wai 1 Siu

    7. *one* Yeun Ming Elder

    8. *one* of the Dao generation Shaolin monks

    How does 20-year old Gwok Jing fare against each of these opponents?
    Hm.. the Ming Cult Guys. I personally think GJ would still win, but the people of Ming Cult are smarter and more tactiful. 1 Xuan Min Elder would probably lose to GJ. 1 Du Generation Monk...., I'm not too sure. The biggest question lies in how big of a difference is LOCH Great and End of ROCH Great. MY opinion on that issue is that it is big enough. YG did mention that a Pre 16 Years JLFW would be no match for the Post 16 Years YG. This seems to suggest that the improvement is a lot during 16 years. Similiarly, if we applied that type of improvement from LOCH to Pre 22 Years ROCH (14 years), then it would techinically mean that LOCH Greats would get screwed over by a ROCH Great. And if that is the case, then 1 Du Monk>GJ.
    法王正欲回掌相击,突听嗤嗤轻响一股柔和的气流涌向面门,正是一灯大师使出一阳指功夫,正面拦截。法王一直没将这白眉老僧放在眼内,那料到他这一指之功,竟是如此深厚
    此时一灯大师的一阳指功夫实已到了登峰造极、炉火纯青的地步,指上发出的那股罡气似是温淳平和,但沛然浑厚,无可与抗

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    What about bringing him 100 years to the past. Will he beat the likes of MRF, DCQ, DZM?
    Burying his Dugu 9 Jian manual under an epitaph, Dugu Qiubai felt he has left his legacy for the next generation. He then moved to Shaolin to study Buddhism, sweep floors and tap elite fighters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ardor
    What about bringing him 100 years to the past. Will he beat the likes of MRF, DCQ, DZM?
    I give him even odds of defeating Mo Yung F'uk, but I'm not so sure about Ding Chun Chou (because of Ding's poisons) and Deun Jing Ming (because of 1 Yeung Finger Technique).

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