Would you hate Gwok Fu so much if she'd hurt someone other than Yeung Gor?

[warlock110]

Gwok Fu is not the type of person to be "hated" in my book, more on the line of sympathy. i really feel sorry for this character because of the situation that was force on her. she's is actually like alot of the kids that we know in real life, whether she was talented no one knows. she's sort of the lay back and enjoy type, not the type to do big things. that's pretty much lead to all the crappy things she did.... but w/e was the case. she was emotionally hurt too, she was never really happy. so i do feel bad for the girl.

[SkineePanda]

Why Guo Fu sucks? It's because she's Guo Fu, as simple as that.


How many times did YG saved her? 5 times!! Twice before having his arm chopped off and three more after....unbelievable how she remains so.

Guo Xiang and Guo Poluo have the same damn parents, yet they didn't end up stuck-up, self-righteous, and mass-destructive like Guo Fu was. Just to show that Guo Fu is just as a inherently screwed up person as it was the product of Huang Rong's mother of the year parenting.

[Ken Cheng]

OK, moving on here...

In summary, thus far: Gwok Fu is a character with some severe flaws who seems to get criticized out of proportion with those flaws (not that she does not merit criticism, but she strangely gets more of it than other characters who merit criticism even more than she does). I believe that this character is more psychologically complex than would be initially apparent, and would be an interesting subject for further examination. To do that, however, it's necessary to set aside (not discard; just set aside) prejudices towards the character and try to identify the source of her twisted worldview.

[Ken Cheng]

Do you know why Guo Fu sucks? It's because she's Guo Fu, as simple as that.

It's not as simple as that. That's the problem. People want to write the character off because they hate her for what she did to Yeung Gor. Nobody actually tries to understand this character (i.e. understand does not mean "sympathize," although it *could* lead there), and I think that's a shame because I believe there's more to this character than meets the eye.

[Suet Seung]

It's not as simple as that. That's the problem. People want to write the character off because they hate her for what she did to Yeung Gor. Nobody actually tries to understand this character (i.e. understand does not mean "sympathize," although it *could* lead there), and I think that's a shame because I believe there's more to this character than meets the eye.

Hey Ken,

If YTZ were exist in the same time period with GF, would they have made an ideal couple? GF wasn't ugly and we know YTZ was infatuated and then fell into "love" with Ah Chi because he found her appearance attractive (couldn't be her kind personality). YTZ loved to follow the person he adores and do whatever she wished while GF loves to have entourages at her beck and call. I mean we've got a whole S&M thing almost (not sexual of course). With the Mo Brothers leaving GF, if YTZ stepped into the picture, instead of the naive and righteous Yelut Chai, YTZ and GF would be an ideal couple.

[R!chard]

It's not as simple as that. That's the problem. People want to write the character off because they hate her for what she did to Yeung Gor. Nobody actually tries to understand this character (i.e. understand does not mean "sympathize," although it *could* lead there), and I think that's a shame because I believe there's more to this character than meets the eye.

To be honest, some characters are written as targets for hatred. You just hate them because you want to. And ironically some characters are likeable no matter what he/she has done. Does ZBT ring any bells?

[Ken Cheng]

Hey Ken,

If YTZ were exist in the same time period with GF, would they have made an ideal couple? GF wasn't ugly and we know YTZ was infatuated and then fell into "love" with Ah Chi because he found her appearance attractive (couldn't be her kind personality). YTZ loved to follow the person he adores and do whatever she wished while GF loves to have entourages at her beck and call. I mean we've got a whole S&M thing almost (not sexual of course). With the Mo Brothers leaving GF, if YTZ stepped into the picture, instead of the naive and righteous Yelut Chai, YTZ and GF would be an ideal couple.

It might have worked. Yau Tan Tze wanted someone to worship and Gwok Fu wanted someone to worship her. I don't have much hope for them lasting very long in wulin, however, despite Yau Tan Tze's great martial arts power.

[Ken Cheng]

To be honest, some characters are written as targets for hatred. You just hate them because you want to. And ironically some characters are likeable no matter what he/she has done. Does ZBT ring any bells?

Even Chow Bak Tung wasn't a one-trick pony that existed for comic relief and to impart some really terrific martial arts skills. The entire Ying Goo episode showed us a darker side of the character.

[SkineePanda]

It's not as simple as that. That's the problem. People want to write the character off because they hate her for what she did to Yeung Gor. Nobody actually tries to understand this character (i.e. understand does not mean "sympathize," although it *could* lead there), and I think that's a shame because I believe there's more to this character than meets the eye.

Dude you're talking to the guy that once made this thread http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=6810. Of course there were a few moments where she appeared to be somewhat sympathetic. But they are completely eclipsed by her actions and her attitude. She had always gotten her way and she's used to it. And when she doesn't get her way, that is when YG appears in her life, she freaks out and becomes destructive. People understand her character very well, her thoughts are completely written down. It's very straight forward, she's a diva character. When she feels like it she'll be nice and it's the superficial kind. When she doesn't she won't mind ruining your life without a thought. Her ultimate problem is her inability to think about others in THEIR position. That is why when she does something it blows up in her face as well as for the people who are unfortunately in her way. And when people try to clean up her mess, they too are screwed.

[R!chard]

Even Chow Bak Tung wasn't a one-trick pony that existed for comic relief and to impart some really terrific martial arts skills. The entire Ying Goo episode showed us a darker side of the character.

Yep exactly what I was refering to. ZBT can be as irresponsible as anyone in the world but you just can't seem to not like him even after what he has caused to 1D and Ying Gu.

*Would also like to clarify to some people that by resorting to Hitler and admitting that I am a YG fan, I had already resigned my position on the debate way before YG can say "gugu". You know your sarcasm has failed when one doesn't get its intention....

[Ken Cheng]

Yep exactly what I was refering to. ZBT can be as irresponsible as anyone in the world but you just can't seem to not like him even after what he has caused to 1D and Ying Gu.

The ultimate "Get Away Free" character card belonged to Yeung Siu in HSDS. The guy *raped* Gei Hiu Fu. It's immaterial that she fell in love with him later; she didn't give him permission to do the deed with her and as it turned out, it *did*ruin her life. There's not much difference between what Yeung Siu did in HSDS and what Wan Tze Ping/Chan Tze Bing did to Little Dragon Girl in ROCH, but who can resist the dashing, clever, and talented Yeung Siu?

I ended up liking the character, but there was a nagging thought in the back of my mind: "This man is a RAPIST."

[Yeung Gor]

You need a third option. I don't hate Gwok Fu, in fact, I pity her. Underneath all that bitterness and hatred was a girl who didn't know how to handle rejection. The sad part is she doesn't even understand herself and why she carries this hatred toward YG. Only at the end, she realizes her feelings for him.

She is still spoiled but no one is perfect.

[owbjhx]

I used to hate Guo Fu...but then I grew up. Thinking about it and discussing it with posters here, the most I would say now is this: GF, as written by Jin Yong, is - for most of ROCH - the least sympathetically portrayed character in the Trilogy.

As I've said before, whether or not you (dis)like a character is a reader's personal thing. I don't think there's any ground for argument about someone's personal (dis)likes, and to be honest, I don't give a **** about them. What I'm more interested in is the textual *portrayal* of a character and what the author was trying to do with him/her; there is definitely ground for argument there. To the point, GF was portrayed very unsympathetically.

You cannot assess the portrayal of a character in JY (or, to be honest, most other) novels simply by cataloguing the actions of that character. Sure, what GF did was fairly trivial in comparison to the likes of mass-murderers like Genghis, Li Mochou and Xie Xun, or the master-schemers like Yang Kang, Kublai and Cheng Kun. But one of JY's tendencies is that he is rather merciful in how he writes these sorts. I suspect this is because of his legal and journalistic background. What JY is a lot less merciful about is the petty, selfish & cruel type: types like Zhao Zhijing and He Taichong. GF numbers among this lot, but what makes her special is that JY never shows her feeling suffering for the consequences of her actions, and consistently shows her thought processes to be astonishingly remorseless and selfish. There is no other major character in the Trilogy who is portrayed like this.

The assertion that GF is "more psychologically complex than many people realise" and not a "two-dimensional spoiled brat" is understandable if, once again, we were to simply catalogue her actions and speculate what links them, or if GF were a real person. But unfortunately, what JY writes is precisely 38 chapters of two-dimensional spoiled brat and then a few rushed paragraphs attempting to 'explain' it. I like to read a lot into things, but when it comes to GF, there really isn't much to read into. To me, calling GF a "psychologically complex" character is a complement which neither author nor character deserve.

But this is all moot. Let's face it, guys: what's not to like in a beautiful girl who's so desperate to have you that she 'accidentally' poisons her main love rival and reacts to rejection by severing a key appendage of yours? I can't remember what happened to YG's arm, but JY should have made GF keep it - pickle it, sleep with it, rub it against her face (and whisper to herself: "Fu'er, Fu'er...come be my gugu...etc.") when nobody's looking. Now how's that for psychological complexity?

[SkineePanda]

I can't remember what happened to YG's arm, but JY should have made GF keep it - pickle it, sleep with it, rub it against her face (and whisper to herself: "Fu'er, Fu'er...come be my gugu...etc.") when nobody's looking. Now how's that for psychological complexity?

Twisted....

[Guo Xiang]

..... The answer I have isn't in the poll. I would hate Guo Fu if the arm she chopped off hadn't belonged to Yang Guo.

[yittz]

If she hurt LMC or one of the Wu brother, I wouldn't hate her so much. If she chopped off her own arm, I would laugh. Otherwise GF is GF.

[Arisa]

i dont hate her. n yg is a brat too, just cos he had brains everyone liked him better. gf is a poor soul and cos shes dumb, she cannot be a brat.

hr was a brat too. but people liked her cos she had brains. DUH.

[duguxiaojing]

The answer I have isn't in the poll. I would hate Guo Fu if the arm she chopped off hadn't belonged to Yang Guo.

Ya, Shouldn't one of the choices be, If Guo Fu was evil towards another character in ROCH(not necessarily a antagonist in the novel) would you still hate her.

But..come to think of it...had GWM saved GF's life 4 -5 times her parents life,her sisters life(twice), a bunch of her friends lives(at least twice)..and GF is still an ungrateful brat and verbally and physically attacks GWM(many times without cauee) , I would still hate her.

[dbx]

Guo Fu is hated not because we can't rationalize what she did and why she did it but because she can hold her head up high after doing it.

Guo Fu is a pretty 3-d character altho somewhat stereotypical, futhermore; people in general aren't that psychologically complicate, we just wish they were because we can't believe they would do xxx thing.

Remember Guo Fu as a child took the wings and fur off all the animals/insects on Peach Blossom Isle.

Guo Fu attacks to kill more often then not usually over some affront to her "honor".
Yang Guo is hardly the only person she injured or tried to injure in the novel.

Psychologically, as depicted in the book, Guo Fu is the kind of girl that if she was a guy would come home from a bad day and beat the shit out of his wife because of insecurity issues. The fact that she's a girl, she's got krappy wu-gong and generally incapable doesn't make her any more likeable in my eyes.

[Candide]

What is there not to like about Guo Fu? She just needs some decent spanking, then she'll be right.