The Book of Records for Jin Yong universe

[Whsie]

It wasn't a 15 zhang attack. When XF first was preparing for his attack, he already started moving from his initial 155 feet (ideally speaking) distance. When the energy released from his palm, he was already 75 feet (ideally speaking). Before his energy dissolved, he released a second palm energy from 35 feet (ideally speaking). So that is actually about 40 feet each palm.
I'm not sure about this, but Hanky said that the compromise reached at the JY Teahouse place was 30-40 feet each palm.

[CC]

It wasn't a 15 zhang attack. When XF first was preparing for his attack, he already started moving from his initial 155 feet (ideally speaking) distance. When the energy released from his palm, he was already 75 feet (ideally speaking). Before his energy dissolved, he released a second palm energy from 35 feet (ideally speaking). So that is actually about 40 feet each palm.
I'm not sure about this, but Hanky said that the compromise reached at the JY Teahouse place was 30-40 feet each palm.

I think we all knew that long ago. Its just a lot quicker and easier to say '15 zhang attack' rather then typing the whole sequence of detailed events.

[PJ]

About Murong Bo's distance from Duan Yu, I quite frankly do not think it was as far as 80 feet.

From the novel, right after Murong Bo flicked Duan Zhengchun etc: 灰衣僧转过衣来，向着萧峰合什说道：“乔大侠武功卓绝，果然名不虚传，老衲想领教几招！”萧峰早有提防，当 他合什施礼之时，便即抱拳还礼，说道：“不敢！”两股内力一撞，二人身子同时微微一晃。

Murong Bo simply turned around and was able to clash internal energy with Xiao Feng. If Xiao Feng was next to Duan Yu, then Murong Bo clashed energy with Xiao Feng from 70+ feet away?? I don't think that's possible.

Murong Bo probably maintained some distance from Murong Fu. The son was able to bow down to his father so there were some distance. We must assume that Murong Bo was closer to Duan Yu than his son. Let's say that papa Murong was 60 - 70 feet away from Duan Yu. He flicked 3 times, probably sending wave upon waves of energy. If he flicked once I don't think it was travel that far.

Anyway, some inconsistency from Jin Yong, me thinks. Imagination is to be used to piece together the puzzle.

[K2Grey]

The three flicks would seem to correspond to the three targets, as opposed to increasing range.

I don't think knocking the Judge's Pen out of DY and slamming it into the ground would necessarily count as object manipulation. After all XF was able to use XL18Z to make the projectile thrown at DY miss him, then boomerang around back at MRF. And he was outside 2 zhang range at that time.

Murong Longchen must be huge though.

[PJ]

The three flicks would seem to correspond to the three targets, as opposed to increasing range.

Sounds reasonable, although I think there is another possibility: perhaps the farther energy travels, the more distance it covers. Even though it started out being a small flick, after 60 feet it could expand its coverage. So Murong Bo might not have flicked once at each of 3 persons.

[CC]

Sounds reasonable, although I think there is another possibility: perhaps the farther energy travels, the more distance it covers. Even though it started out being a small flick, after 60 feet it could expand its coverage. So Murong Bo might not have flicked once at each of 3 persons.

Well, for starters JY did not specify it as such while the previous 2 incidents in the book was specifically narrated. Besides, if it was merged into 1 force, how does that 1 force result in both a push (well 2 pushes) and 1 pull?

As for the gap between MRB and MRF ;

那僧人迈开大步，走到慕容复身边

There you have it. He was next to MRF.

So how do we explain the following bit ?

灰衣僧转过衣来，向着萧峰合什说道：“乔大侠武功卓绝，果然名不虚传，老衲想领教
几招！”萧峰早有提防，当他合什施礼之时，便即抱拳还礼，说道：“不敢！”两股内力一
撞，二人身子同时微微一晃

Hmm, if MRB can project enough chi to kill BTS and DZC from where MRF was and XF was standing next to DY (after flinging MRF) who was attended by BTS and DZC, why can't he project his chi again to test XF?

Basically, if he can shoot killing chi at 8 zhang, he definitely can have a chi clash with XF at 8 zhang.

[Whsie]

that chi clash sounds wayyyy too far. Basically anyone between them better get out of the way or else they're toast!

[Ardor]

that chi clash sounds wayyyy too far. Basically anyone between them better get out of the way or else they're toast!

Or glow in the dak.

About the pulling, maybe he hit DY at the back and the force pushed the judge pen out?

[Black Night Sea]

Smaller objects have greater surface area to volume ratio and therefore have a proportionately higher drag.

Thanks for the info. I get to learn something new everyday. XD

his 3rd stroke had the finesse at 8 zhang to remove the Judge Pen from DY's wound and slam it into the ground (yeah he should have drove it in deeper into DY!).

Heh. MRB would've granted our wish if he wasn't so content in allowing the "Living Sword Manual" to exist in this world.

From the novel, right after Murong Bo flicked Duan Zhengchun etc: 灰衣僧转过衣来，向着萧峰合什说道：“乔大侠武功卓绝，果然名不虚传，老衲想领教几招！”萧峰 早有提防，当 他合什施礼之时，便即抱拳还礼，说道：“不敢！”两股内力一撞，二人身子同时微微一晃。

Murong Bo simply turned around and was able to clash internal energy with Xiao Feng. If Xiao Feng was next to Duan Yu, then Murong Bo clashed energy with Xiao Feng from 70+ feet away?? I don't think that's possible.

Great find.

Still, he was facing DZC, DY and Ba Tianshi when he performed Canhe Finger and for him to turn his body round afterwards suggests that XF had somehow gotten away from that danger zone. By doing so, XF was now probably within close distance of MRB where both experts clashed merely with their internal energy. 7-8 zhang would never have been possible seeing how 5 zhang is the maximum for palm range and logically speaking, throwing projectiles should cover a greater distance than energy emitted out (that's how I picture it). The darn thing is, Jinyong didn't describe the activity of these folks i.e. XF shifting away from his original position where he chucked MRF 7-8 zhang, and it seems strange he would move closer to MRF. Unless he was trying to check out if he tried anything funny?

In the end, the theory of Canhe Finger being loaded with 7-8 zhang of attacking power has always never really been conclusive. There wasn't and still hasn't been sufficient evidence to support it.

[CC]

In the end, the theory of Canhe Finger being loaded with 7-8 zhang of attacking power has always never really been conclusive. There wasn't and still hasn't been sufficient evidence to support it.

But we are still going to drag it out everytime someone tries to argue against XF/MRB>GJ/YG right? Right? Right?

[CC]

Still, he was facing DZC, DY and Ba Tianshi when he performed Canhe Finger and for him to turn his body round afterwards suggests that XF had somehow gotten away from that danger zone. .

Well, after the 3 dabs, he was talking to MRF again, so he must have turned back to MRF. Then he turned back to face the direction of XF/DZC/BTS/DY again.

XF might have been close to DY. But MRB is probably smart enough to judge that its not worthwhile trying to demonstrate Canhe Finger on XF.

[Black Night Sea]

But we are still going to drag it out everytime someone tries to argue against XF/MRB>GJ/YG right? Right? Right?

If you feel you've got meaty proof to trump the GJ and YG supporters. Then go for it! I'll be ready with a kingsized popcorn with me.

Well, after the 3 dabs, he was talking to MRF again, so he must have turned back to MRF. Then he turned back to face the direction of XF/DZC/BTS/DY again.

When MRB spoke "This is your family's Canhe Finger", it was uttered out audibly perhaps to get it into the ears of the wulin heroes. It wasn't really mentioned whether he turned back to MRF.

But MRB is probably smart enough to judge that its not worthwhile trying to demonstrate Canhe Finger on XF.

Dunno about that. Was it worthwhile transmitting his energy across in an attempt to harm XF?

Edit: Man...I really need to learn not to post at different wuxia forums concurrently. Otherwise the answers will turn out 'alien' which doesn't correspond with the asked question.

[K2Grey]

Well, MRB wanted to demonstrate how good Murong family arts were. Half of wulin was gathered there including Shaolin monks etc. so the demonstration would have to be very impressive. If MRB did a DYQ style finger projection then it would be ho hum. But if MRB hit someone from 70 feet away then it would be OMGWTFBBQ.

Since MRB wanted a successful demonstration presumably he would hit people who were known to be good martial artists, but not so good that they would be able to stop MRB. So he would not attack XF.

I think it makes more sense for MRB to have turned back to MRF. I don't see why XF would be on the other side of MRB, behind MRF.

Edit: What does Canhe mean?

[Whsie]

I think Canhe means Join Together. I don't know. Can means join as in canja. he means combine or together. So maybe Join Together? But it sounds quite crappy.

[PJ]

Let me try this again.

OK, so it is stated that no matter how strong you are, you can't possibly effectively palm blast someone from more than 50 feet away.

Well, isn't finger qi usually regarded as more difficult to transmit over a long distance than palm qi? So if the maximum distance of palm is 50 feet, finger should only be closer distance, not farther.

If Murong Bo were able to kill first class fighters with a finger blast from 70+ feet away, then not only is it the most impressive LDA attack in the history of Jin Yong universe, it would also mean that he is the most ultimately awesome Jin Yong law-defying badass, but he is only as good as 3 other people in DGSD, who are still behind some 4 - 5 other dudes in the novel.

[CC]

Let me try this again.

OK, so it is stated that no matter how strong you are, you can't possibly effectively palm blast someone from more than 50 feet away.

Well, isn't finger qi usually regarded as more difficult to transmit over a long distance than palm qi? So if the maximum distance of palm is 50 feet, finger should only be closer distance, not farther.

If Murong Bo were able to kill first class fighters with a finger blast from 70+ feet away, then not only is it the most impressive LDA attack in the history of Jin Yong universe, it would also mean that he is the most ultimately awesome Jin Yong law-defying badass, but he is only as good as 3 other people in DGSD, who are still behind some 4 - 5 other dudes in the novel.

Its either that or:

After DY got injured and MRF got flung 8 zhang away from DY. DZC and BTS went to DY, carried him at least 4 zhang _towards_ MRF before using YYZ to treat his injury and attempting to remove the Judge Pen from his body.

[PJ]

Its either that or:

After DY got injured and MRF got flung 8 zhang away from DY. DZC and BTS went to DY, carried him at least 4 zhang _towards_ MRF before using YYZ to treat his injury and attempting to remove the Judge Pen from his body.

Seriously, I think that Jin Yong probably goofed. I really don't think that he intended Murong Bo (or any character under his pen) to kill first class fighters from a distance of 70+ feet, considering that he made a big deal to specifically write that people can't project their energy outside 20 and/or 50 feet.

But wait, another possibility is: Murong Bo walked away from Murong Fu, towards Duan Yu, during his speech. Of course, this is all wild speculation but that's what we have to do when not much sense can be inferred from the writing.

[PJ]

Longest LDA....hmm Sweeper Monk on JMZ? Can anyone translate that part please?

with pleasure, will try my best.

转过一片竹林，忽见林间一块草坪上聚集着不少人。一个身穿敝旧青袍的僧人背向坐在石上，诵经之声便自他口出，他面前坐着多人，其中有萧远山、萧峰父子、慕容博、慕容复父子，不久前在藏经阁前见 到的胡僧哲罗星、波罗星，以及来自别寺的几位高僧、少林寺好几位玄字辈高僧，也都坐在地下，双手合什，垂首 低眉，恭恭敬敬的听法。四五丈外站着一人，却是吐番国师鸠摩智，脸露讥嘲之色，显得心中不服。

Sweeper Monk was giving a philosophical speech to the Xiaos, the Murongs, and several other monks. Jiumozhi was standing 4 to 5 zhang away (40 - 50 feet).

他慢慢绕将过去，要瞧瞧那高僧何等容貌，究竟是何许人物。但要看到那僧人正面，须得走到萧峰等人身后，他不 敢惊动诸人，放轻脚步，远远兜了个圈了，斜身缩足，正在走近鸠摩智身畔时，突见鸠摩智转过头来，向他微微一 笑。段誉也以笑容相披。
突然之间，一股凌厉之极的劲风当胸射来。段誉叫声：“啊哟！”欲施六脉神剑抵御，已然不及，只觉胸口一痛， 迷迷糊糊中听到有人念到：“阿弥陀佛！”便已人事不知了。
段誉赶到之时，听到那老僧正在为众人妙解佛义，他只想绕到那老僧对面，瞧一瞧他的容貌，哪知鸠摩智忽然间会 下毒手，胸口竟然中了他的一招“火焰刀”。

Duan Yu wanted to see the face of the Sweeper Monk. When he walked near Jiumozhi, the latter suddenly ambushed the former with Flaming Blade palm wind, instantly knocking Duan Yu unconscious.

原来那老名老僧正为众人说法之时，鸠摩智突施毒手，伤了段誉。无名老僧袍袖一拂，将鸠摩智推出数丈之外。鸠 摩智不也停留，转身飞奔下山。

Sweeper Monk uttered "amitoba" followed by a lift of his sleeves, the wind generated from which tossed Jiumozhi back several zhang.

----
In summary, Sweeper Monk launched sleeve wind at Jiumozhi from a distance of 4 - 5 zhang, and pushed him back several more zhang./

[Whsie]

I have to say I'm impressed. If we're excluding MRB's Canhe Finger's super long messed up attack, then longest LDA goes to Sweeper or maybe LQS's palm to XZ/TSTL.

[CC]

The effect was definitely one of the more spectacular. I don't recall any other fighter of JMZ's level (i.e. ROCH Greats level or similar) ever getting blown 'several' zhang by a LDA.

The way it was described made it seem real effortless too.

p.s. For those that can't read the chinese. The last verse said that after getting blown back multiple zhang, JMZ immediately turned and ran down the mountain.
You would have thought that after seeing the 2 taps, JMZ would be smart enough not to act like a punk in front of sweeps.