Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 33

Thread: Absorbing Skills Contest in JY's Universe

  1. #1
    Senior Member rabadi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    2,308

    Default Absorbing Skills Contest in JY's Universe

    In Jin Yong's novels, there are at least three absorbing skills: Hua Gong Da Fa, Bei Ming Shen Gong, and Xi Xing Da Fa. Between these three, which one is the most superior and which one is the less superior, and why? Your analysis and opinion, please. BTW, if I leave out any other absorbing skills in Jin Yong's novels, please do mention. Thanks.
    Guo Jing > Yang Guo. Book it, you morons!

  2. #2
    Senior Member someguy44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Status: On a deserted island in a parallel universe & wasting yet another life away.
    Posts
    1,006

    Default

    Actually, Hua Gong Dai Fa doesn't absorb inner power. It rather dissipates the opponents inner power without absorbing it.
    No longer walking amongst the living...

  3. #3
    Senior Member Athena's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Mount Olympus, sipping nectar and eating ambrosia
    Posts
    1,957

    Default

    This is what I wrote some months ago:SPCNET- The trials and tribulations of the Xiaoyao School
    So huge, so hopeless, to conceive
    As these that twice befell
    Parting is all we know of heaven
    And all we need of hell.

    Emily Dickinson (1830-1886)

  4. #4
    Senior Member rabadi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    2,308

    Default

    Originally posted by Athena
    ...As for Ding ChunQiu he invented his own techniques, namely using poison. His most famous one was HuaGong DaFa. This skill was used to eradicate your opponents internal energy. The practitioner absorbed many forms of poison into his body and in a battle the practitioner would use his own internal energy to activate the poison and wipe, eradicate the enemy's internal strength.
    As BeiMing ShenGong relied on the internal energy of yourself to absorb the energies of the opponents.

    Many centuries later there was a different martial arts under the name XiXing DaFa. It was derived from both Hua Gong DaFa and BeiMing ShenGong. But the influences of HuaGong DaFa were greater causing it to become more inferior to BeiMing ShenGong.
    I see. Thanks a lot, Athena.
    Guo Jing > Yang Guo. Book it, you morons!

  5. #5
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,565

    Default Bei Mei Shen Gong

    Too lazy yo start a new topic, so this hijack.

    Just one simple question.
    Q: Did Bei MEi Shen gong has it's own inner power re-generating potential?

    I'm asking this as i re-read CC's translation of the HJ vs Kau Mor Chee fight and it seems weird that the huge energy store that all the Xiao Yao elders passed to him was due from s*ucking other ppl without any self-generation. I mean how could they s*uck so many ppl's inner power????

    Thanks.

  6. #6
    Moderator Ren Wo Xing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Currently DC
    Posts
    6,553

    Default

    The energy-absorbing aspect of BMSG is only one part of it. Bei Ming Zhen Chii and other aspects of BMSG are not absorbing-related.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,565

    Default

    I figured that, but was there anything in the novel to support our belief?

  8. #8
    Senior Member someguy44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Status: On a deserted island in a parallel universe & wasting yet another life away.
    Posts
    1,006

    Default

    Originally posted by Han Solo
    I figured that, but was there anything in the novel to support our belief?
    Yes! Read CC's translation of the fight between Kau Mor Chi and Hui Jook at the JY forum to get your answer.
    No longer walking amongst the living...

  9. #9
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,565

    Default

    I re-read the translations that CC was kind to put up again but apart from the fact that HJ did not have any s*ucking ability, it did not specifically say whether Bei Mei have any internal energy generation ability. So just wondering whether other parts of the story mentions that.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Yang Guo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Posts
    1,307

    Default

    Originally posted by Han Solo
    I re-read the translations that CC was kind to put up again but apart from the fact that HJ did not have any s*ucking ability, it did not specifically say whether Bei Mei have any internal energy generation ability. So just wondering whether other parts of the story mentions that.
    From Moin's translations in chapter 2, I think it is just a way to take in other people's inner energy without helping to develop otherwise

  11. #11
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,565

    Default

    Originally posted by Yang Guo
    From Moin's translations in chapter 2, I think it is just a way to take in other people's inner energy without helping to develop otherwise
    You're right. I'm absolutely wrong. I guess i got confused by the fact that Hui Jul's Bei Mei Shen Gong doesn't have the s*ucking component thus prompting the question of whether Bei Mei can generate inner power indepently.

    Directly from Moin's translation:
    "He unrolled the scroll a bit further and read: "Divine Skill of the Northern Darkness is about using other's inner strength as my own. The sea of the Northern Darkness did not create itself. It said: 'All the rivers empties into the ocean, the ocean is because it can contain the rivers.' The vast open seas was accumulated. So 'Scripture of the Lunar Hand and Lungs' is the first lesson of the Divine Skill of the Northern Darkness" followed by detailed instructions as to how to practice this kungfu. "

    Further question, To Ren Wo Xing and other DGSD readers,
    few months ago there was this debate on wether someone practising DSGD would be at risk of losing completely their inner power when trying to s*uck an opponent that's greater than them.

    Again from Moin's "It concludes the section with: "When others practice inner strength, the path that they take is from Cloudy Gate to Less Merchant. But our Carefree Sect's kungfu is from Less Merchant to Cloudy Gate, if thumb comes in contact with others, then their inner force will gush into my body and be stored at Cloudy Gate as well as other pressure points. But if the opponent's inner force is stronger than mine, then the water of the sea will empty into the rivers and will lead to life threatening dangers, you have been forewarned. "

    But DY when starting to use this kungfu have virtually no inner power before. How then to explain this apparent contradiction?
    Or does this passage only refer to someone who is using the same technique but with greater inner power?

    Thanks.
    Last edited by Han Solo; 07-01-03 at 04:14 AM.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Laviathan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    1,480

    Default About Beiming...

    But if the opponent's inner force is stronger than mine, then the water of the sea will empty into the rivers and will lead to life threatening dangers, you have been forewarned.
    In my opinion, this means that if the Beiming practitioner wil try to absorb the energy of an opponent with superior inner power, then it would be like the water of the sea pouring into the river. His body would not be able to cope with such a high amount of power, and he will "explode". This was also mentioned in Chapter 5 when Duan Yu absorbed a little bit of power for the first time from Yu Guangbiao.

    So it's not like you will lose your power to others. It just means that at the beginning you have to be very careful and only absorb little portions of power, building a foundation for facing more powerful opponents in the future.
    對 敵 須 狠 , 斬 草 除 根 , 男 女 老 幼 , 不 留 一 人

  13. #13
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    5,565

    Default

    I guess there's no theorectical limit to Bei Mei Shen Gong, is it?

    Whenever you met someone who's stronger than you, you s*uck lots of weaker guy until you are stronger than your opponent, so that you can also have his/her power.

    How the heck don't the energy streams that got s*ucked using Bei Mei clash with each others if they are from different schools i.e. Taoist vs Buddhist?

  14. #14
    Senior Member Laviathan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    1,480

    Default

    Whenever you met someone who's stronger than you, you s*uck lots of weaker guy until you are stronger than your opponent, so that you can also have his/her power.
    It also has something to do with body parts I guess. An advanced practitioner can absorb power with almost every part of his/her body, and maybe even through weapons during combat without real physical contact. But for a novice it is much safer to absorb with the thumbs. Duan Yu however was hit in the Solar Plexus which in his case was the most safest way to absorb energy.

    How the heck don't the energy streams that got s*ucked using Bei Mei clash with each others if they are from different schools i.e. Taoist vs Buddhist?
    Well, that's why the style is so good. The theory of Xiaoyao School and Beiming is that all martial arts styles and internal powers can be integrated into my own being. Once you have absorbed other people's power, you will transform all these flows of energies into one type of power: Beiming Energy.

    Because Xixing Dafa of Ren Woxing was an inferior form of Beiming, Ren did not know how to integrate the energies into one and in the end he died because of this.
    對 敵 須 狠 , 斬 草 除 根 , 男 女 老 幼 , 不 留 一 人

  15. #15

    Default

    I agree with Lava's conclusion on Bei Ming. What happens when a person with low inner powers take energy from a person with much higher powers is that the body of the s*ckie can't handle it, it's not used to having so much power flowing through it.

    This is essentially what happened to Duan Yu after he took energy from basically everyone and forced the Emperor of Da Li to have to go to the monastery in search of a cure.
    春花秋月几时了,
    往事知多少?
    小楼昨夜又东风,
    故国不堪回首明月中.
    雕栏玉砌应犹在,
    只是朱颜改.
    问君能有几多愁,
    恰似一江春水向东流.
    --南唐后主,李煜.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Du Gu seeking a win's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    453

    Post Bei Mei Shen Gong

    Bei Mei Shen Gong

    Have any of you read the old version of DGSD? There I believe DY never got BMSG. DY got his internal power 'sucking ability' because he accidentally (wanting to commit suicide) ate a special kind of frog (Bong Koh Chu Hap = bullfrog, a pair of frogs which are the kings of poison snakes). These frogs are pure 'yang' and so DY got his (internal power) sucking ability called 'Sucking frog ability' (=Chu Hap Sin Kang, don't know the pinyin name).

  17. #17
    Senior Member Son of Light's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    S'pore, Yishun
    Posts
    1,004

    Talking Black hole

    Well, that's why the style is so good. The theory of Xiaoyao School and Beiming is that all martial arts styles and internal powers can be integrated into my own being. Once you have absorbed other people's power, you will transform all these flows of energies into one type of power: Beiming Energy.
    Then it's really like a black hole.
    Because everything that is sucked into a black hole become part of it...
    http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?...88&ref=tn_tnmn
    This year, August 25th~26th
    1st Singapore Ancient Chinese Culture Camp, pls join if you are in Singapore. ^^

  18. #18
    Moderator Ren Wo Xing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Currently DC
    Posts
    6,553

    Default

    Originally posted by Han Solo
    You're right. I'm absolutely wrong. I guess i got confused by the fact that Hui Jul's Bei Mei Shen Gong doesn't have the s*ucking component thus prompting the question of whether Bei Mei can generate inner power indepently.

    Directly from Moin's translation:
    "He unrolled the scroll a bit further and read: "Divine Skill of the Northern Darkness is about using other's inner strength as my own. The sea of the Northern Darkness did not create itself. It said: 'All the rivers empties into the ocean, the ocean is because it can contain the rivers.' The vast open seas was accumulated. So 'Scripture of the Lunar Hand and Lungs' is the first lesson of the Divine Skill of the Northern Darkness" followed by detailed instructions as to how to practice this kungfu. "

    Further question, To Ren Wo Xing and other DGSD readers,
    few months ago there was this debate on wether someone practising DSGD would be at risk of losing completely their inner power when trying to s*uck an opponent that's greater than them.

    Again from Moin's "It concludes the section with: "When others practice inner strength, the path that they take is from Cloudy Gate to Less Merchant. But our Carefree Sect's kungfu is from Less Merchant to Cloudy Gate, if thumb comes in contact with others, then their inner force will gush into my body and be stored at Cloudy Gate as well as other pressure points. But if the opponent's inner force is stronger than mine, then the water of the sea will empty into the rivers and will lead to life threatening dangers, you have been forewarned. "

    But DY when starting to use this kungfu have virtually no inner power before. How then to explain this apparent contradiction?
    Or does this passage only refer to someone who is using the same technique but with greater inner power?

    Thanks.
    Lava and I started this debate And I still stick to my guns; it's in the practicing of BMSG that one can 'pool together' his chii into the ocean, since chii in non BM practicioners can only be like rivers, thus the statement regarding the waters of the ocean flowing into the river can only signify the chii (waters) of the BM practicioner (ocean) being drained (flowing into) the internal energy of the enemy (the river).

  19. #19
    Senior Member Laviathan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    1,480

    Default

    it's in the practicing of BMSG that one can 'pool together' his chii into the ocean, since chii in non BM practicioners can only be like rivers, thus the statement regarding the waters of the ocean flowing into the river can only signify the chii (waters) of the BM practicioner (ocean) being drained (flowing into) the internal energy of the enemy (the river).
    Ocean: Abundant concentration of Qi
    Rivers: small Qi flows

    Water of the ocean pouring into the rivers = Energy of powerful opponent flowing into practitioner's body. If the practitioner's internal power is low, he will not be able to withstand such a great powerboost and he will "explode".
    對 敵 須 狠 , 斬 草 除 根 , 男 女 老 幼 , 不 留 一 人

  20. #20

    Default

    Originally posted by Ren Wo Xing
    Lava and I started this debate And I still stick to my guns; it's in the practicing of BMSG that one can 'pool together' his chii into the ocean, since chii in non BM practicioners can only be like rivers, thus the statement regarding the waters of the ocean flowing into the river can only signify the chii (waters) of the BM practicioner (ocean) being drained (flowing into) the internal energy of the enemy (the river).
    At first, I was inclined to agree with you, because that was the impression that I got from reading that part of the book as well.

    However, what happens later in the story simply does not fit with this interpretation. If this hypothesis is correct, then Duan Yu would have never been able to absorb any of the weak fighters' energy to begin with. In fact, I think JY said right after that first instance that Duan Yu was lucky, had he not done this to weak fighters with very low inner force, he would have died. Again, later, after Duan Yu absorbed massive amounts of internal force from various sources, he suddenly began to feel hot and bloated, as if he was going to explode from within.

    All of this just fits better with the other interpretation.
    春花秋月几时了,
    往事知多少?
    小楼昨夜又东风,
    故国不堪回首明月中.
    雕栏玉砌应犹在,
    只是朱颜改.
    问君能有几多愁,
    恰似一江春水向东流.
    --南唐后主,李煜.

Similar Threads

  1. Villains in JY's universe
    By rabadi in forum Wuxia Fiction
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 11-23-04, 09:15 PM
  2. The Best Character of JY's Universe?
    By Yeung Gor in forum Wuxia Fiction
    Replies: 60
    Last Post: 11-13-04, 07:32 AM
  3. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 06-24-04, 10:12 PM
  4. JY's Universe: The nicest and the meanest
    By rabadi in forum Wuxia Fiction
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 02-04-04, 10:54 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •