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Thread: The missing Condor novel.

  1. #1
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Default The missing Condor novel.

    In the condor universe, there are three novels : LOCH, ROCH, and HSDS. We all know that LOCH flow nicely into ROCH, but there is a large gap of time in HSDS and ROCH. That large gap of time encompass the life and growth of ZSF. I felt there should be a novel on the story of ZSF. It would be interesting to learn of his struggle to become such a great martial art master and we can also get more information about Gwok Jing and Yeung Gor post-ROCH. Too bad it was not written.

    If it had been written as a part of the Condor Series. All 4 novel would seemingly tell one long story of four heroes. First hero being Guo Jing, who crosses into the next story of Yang Guo, which both will cross over to the story of ZSF and then we end the Condor series with ZWJ.

    Since Jin Yong is still alive, I hope he would write this missing Condor novel.

  2. #2
    TommyH
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    In the condor universe, there are three novels : LOCH, ROCH, and HSDS. We all know that LOCH flow nicely into ROCH, but there is a large gap of time in HSDS and ROCH. That large gap of time encompass the life and growth of ZSF. I felt there should be a novel on the story of ZSF. It would be interesting to learn of his struggle to become such a great martial art master and we can also get more information about Gwok Jing and Yeung Gor post-ROCH. Too bad it was not written.

    If it had been written as a part of the Condor Series. All 4 novel would seemingly tell one long story of four heroes. First hero being Guo Jing, who crosses into the next story of Yang Guo, which both will cross over to the story of ZSF and then we end the Condor series with ZWJ.

    Since Jin Yong is still alive, I hope he would write this missing Condor novel.
    Let's all mail him!

    We all wish he would too but I don't think he'll listen since he's already pretty old and he doesn't need them money.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Thai guy's Avatar
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    I wonder whether Jin Yong himself has ever come to read this forum!

  4. #4
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyH
    Let's all mail him!

    We all wish he would too but I don't think he'll listen since he's already pretty old and he doesn't need them money.
    Yes if we all mail him, it may spark his interest again. I think the reason JY stop writing because he may feel like his work is done. He has accomplish more than anyone ever in wuxia fiction. But if we give him this impression that infact his work isn't finish. That the fans would like the Condor Series to be completed with the story of ZSF told. There is a possibility he may see it so. I know JY thinks highly of ZSF so it may spark his interest in telling his story. And finally, we will have the completness of the Condor Universe.

    I wonder what title would this novel be?

  5. #5
    TommyH
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    Yes if we all mail him, it may spark his interest again. I think the reason JY stop writing because he may feel like his work is done. He has accomplish more than anyone ever in wuxia fiction. But if we give him this impression that infact his work isn't finish. That the fans would like the Condor Series to be completed with the story of ZSF told. There is a possibility he may see it so. I know JY thinks highly of ZSF so it may spark his interest in telling his story. And finally, we will have the completness of the Condor Universe.

    I wonder what title would this novel be?
    But he is old and tired and I don't think he'll want to stress himself since he's already a multi-millionaire.

    BUT IF HE DOES THEN A GOOD TITLE WOULD BE:

    Zhang Junbao

    OR

    Young Hero Zhang Junbao

    OR

    The forming of Wudang and Emei

    OR

    The Return of the Return of the Condor Heroes

    OR

    ...seriously now...I think the title would be best off based on what's going to be in the novel.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyH

    The Return of the Return of the Condor Heroes


    .

    LOL You have to remember JY original titles are different that those we come to accept.

    Originals are:

    Chronicles of Eagle-shooting Heroes
    Divine Eagle and the Martial Couple
    Heaven Sword, Dragon Sabre.


    btw, yes JY is old and he does not need the money. But JY doesn't come across as someone who cares too much about money but he takes pride in his work. It really doesn't matter how old you are, as long as the passion is still inside of you. If he still loves to write he can still do it. We just need to restore that passion in him.

    I know the chance of this happening is slim, but we can always dream.

    How about instead of "Forming" , the title is "The Rise of Wudang and Emei" ?
    This title is fitting as it hint on the life of ZSF as well as his connection with Guo Xiang and her life too.
    Last edited by Yeung Gor; 11-08-06 at 10:12 AM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    In the condor universe, there are three novels : LOCH, ROCH, and HSDS. We all know that LOCH flow nicely into ROCH, but there is a large gap of time in HSDS and ROCH. That large gap of time encompass the life and growth of ZSF. I felt there should be a novel on the story of ZSF. It would be interesting to learn of his struggle to become such a great martial art master and we can also get more information about Gwok Jing and Yeung Gor post-ROCH. Too bad it was not written.

    If it had been written as a part of the Condor Series. All 4 novel would seemingly tell one long story of four heroes. First hero being Guo Jing, who crosses into the next story of Yang Guo, which both will cross over to the story of ZSF and then we end the Condor series with ZWJ.

    Since Jin Yong is still alive, I hope he would write this missing Condor novel.
    Cheung 3 Fung, Guo Xiong, Three Saints, Shaolin. Possible Yeung Gor descendants walking around just like Yellow Lady Yeung did in HSDS. The possibilities.

  8. #8
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    If anything, I think Jin Yong should fill the gap with a collection of loosely-connected short stories that each focuses on a character or set of characters rather than a full-length novel. A series of vignettes from this era would seem to work better than a single continuous storyline.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Bai Qi44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    In the condor universe, there are three novels : LOCH, ROCH, and HSDS. We all know that LOCH flow nicely into ROCH, but there is a large gap of time in HSDS and ROCH. That large gap of time encompass the life and growth of ZSF. I felt there should be a novel on the story of ZSF. It would be interesting to learn of his struggle to become such a great martial art master and we can also get more information about Gwok Jing and Yeung Gor post-ROCH. Too bad it was not written.

    If it had been written as a part of the Condor Series. All 4 novel would seemingly tell one long story of four heroes. First hero being Guo Jing, who crosses into the next story of Yang Guo, which both will cross over to the story of ZSF and then we end the Condor series with ZWJ.

    Since Jin Yong is still alive, I hope he would write this missing Condor novel.

    You know. Technically speaking, there is a larger time gap between LOCH and ROCH than there is between ROCH and HSDS. But, I know what you mean.
    青山不改,绿水长留. 请啊!

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  10. #10
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bai Qi44
    You know. Technically speaking, there is a larger time gap between LOCH and ROCH than there is between ROCH and HSDS. But, I know what you mean.
    Although the Gwok Seung/Cheung Gwun Bo/Gok Yeun/Ho Juk Do saga comprised the first chapters of HSDS, I treat those chapters more as ROCH: EPILOGUE than I do part of HSDS proper.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Surferket's Avatar
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    A Z3F does not fit into the GJ/YG family story at all since Z3F is a total stranger. That family theme went off tangent with HSDS ZWJ and the only loose connection back to the GJ/JY family line lies only in the swords and their secrets within. That plus the end-of-story appearance of the Lady in Yellow.

    A more fitting interlude to join the first 2 novels to HSDS would be to focus on GX after YG/XLN left the wulin, and her travels and eventual development of her own martial arts and the forming of the Emei sect. Then, Z3F can come into the picture as Emei and Wudang had close connection thru these 2 heroes.
    The romantic play between these 2 strong willed characters would be interesting, even if they will never be paired.
    Last edited by Surferket; 11-08-06 at 04:03 PM.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Surferket's Avatar
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    You are not thinking correctly. The reverse is true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bai Qi44
    You know. Technically speaking, there is a larger time gap between LOCH and ROCH than there is between ROCH and HSDS. But, I know what you mean.

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    Senior Member Bai Qi44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surferket
    You are not thinking correctly. The reverse is true.

    No, it's not. There's a 13 year difference between the end of LOCH and the start of ROCH and there is only a 3 year difference between the end of ROCH and the start of HSDS. Z3F (ZKB) was only 16 at the start of HSDS. He was 13 at the end of ROCH. The first two chapters of HSDS takes place only 3 years after the YG, XNL, GJ, etc... met Z3F and Kwok Yuan at Hua Shan event. There's a large unfilled gap between when Z3F was 16 and when he turned around 90.
    青山不改,绿水长留. 请啊!

    http://www.geocities.com/wackyjlee/Others/lee.swf <----Chen Zhen (Bruce Lee version) kicking arse

  14. #14
    TommyH
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bai Qi44
    No, it's not. There's a 13 year difference between the end of LOCH and the start of ROCH and there is only a 3 year difference between the end of ROCH and the start of HSDS. Z3F (ZKB) was only 16 at the start of HSDS. He was 13 at the end of ROCH. The first two chapters of HSDS takes place only 3 years after the YG, XNL, GJ, etc... met Z3F and Kwok Yuan at Hua Shan event. There's a large unfilled gap between when Z3F was 16 and when he turned around 90.
    I don't think anyone cares about those two chapters...even if they do they'll most likely refer it more to the ROCH side than the HSDS side.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Loke-Gao-Zhu's Avatar
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    I personally don't want to see how ZSF grows, mainly because you will see him fight.

    that's why his martial art is described as "deep and unpredictable",

    we also enjoyed the every moments he fought in HSDS

    and the ZSF vs 3 Kong monks description will also lost its value (about how all his opponents die), i think it will be the best to keep it a mystery

    I think that is Jin Yong's purpose
    Last edited by Loke-Gao-Zhu; 11-08-06 at 07:52 PM.

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    Senior Member Bai Qi44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyH
    I don't think anyone cares about those two chapters...even if they do they'll most likely refer it more to the ROCH side than the HSDS side.

    That's why I said "technically speaking" because those two chapters are in the novel HSDS, not ROCH.
    青山不改,绿水长留. 请啊!

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  17. #17
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surferket
    A Z3F does not fit into the GJ/YG family story at all since Z3F is a total stranger. That family theme went off tangent with HSDS ZWJ and the only loose connection back to the GJ/JY family line lies only in the swords and their secrets within. That plus the end-of-story appearance of the Lady in Yellow.

    A more fitting interlude to join the first 2 novels to HSDS would be to focus on GX after YG/XLN left the wulin, and her travels and eventual development of her own martial arts and the forming of the Emei sect. Then, Z3F can come into the picture as Emei and Wudang had close connection thru these 2 heroes.
    The romantic play between these 2 strong willed characters would be interesting, even if they will never be paired.
    It is expected that Guo Xiang is the lead female role for ZSF story as Huang Rong is for Gwok Jing. But it is only a onesided love story. Since the story takes place when all the people of LOCH/ROCH still alive and with ZSF possibly meeting or fighting them, the transition from ROCH to ZSF story will flow nicely, allowing HSDS to connect with the Condor Series as a whole without feeling there is this big gap that make not really part of the trilogy.

    Yup again, you are correct, Guo Xiang will be the family connection. In my earlier reply, I chose the name of this missing novel "The Rise of Wudang and Emei" So it isn't just the story of ZSF but also of Guo Xiang.

  18. #18
    Senior Member Surferket's Avatar
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    Your timeframe is way off. Check this post:

    http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showpost...7&postcount=15

    Quote Originally Posted by Bai Qi44
    No, it's not. There's a 13 year difference between the end of LOCH and the start of ROCH and there is only a 3 year difference between the end of ROCH and the start of HSDS. Z3F (ZKB) was only 16 at the start of HSDS. He was 13 at the end of ROCH. The first two chapters of HSDS takes place only 3 years after the YG, XNL, GJ, etc... met Z3F and Kwok Yuan at Hua Shan event. There's a large unfilled gap between when Z3F was 16 and when he turned around 90.

  19. #19
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surferket
    Your timeframe is way off. Check this post:

    http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showpost...7&postcount=15
    He really isn't. The *real* story of HSDS doesn't begin until seventy-seven years after the end of ROCH, it's true, but the first few chapters of HSDS do take place a mere three years after the end of ROCH. We can treat those chapters as an extended prologue to HSDS proper, or maybe as a kind of epilogue to ROCH, but those chapters are still there.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Bai Qi44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surferket
    Your timeframe is way off. Check this post:

    http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showpost...7&postcount=15

    No again. Your timeline is way off if you think HSDS started when Z3F was 90. You should always go by the novel, not something someone wrote. Besides, the post you gave me clearly had the statement "He was already ninety by the time HSDS proper started, so seventy-seven years had passed"

    HSDS proper in this case means the main storyline of HSDS, not when HSDS began. The intro to HSDS happened way before Z3F was 90. HSDS started when Z3F was only 16, not 90.

    Why don't you check the first two chapters of HSDS instead of constantly miscorrecting me. http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=888

    If you still want to correct me after reading that, then I suggest you buy a pair of glasses.
    Last edited by Bai Qi44; 11-11-06 at 08:43 PM.
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