The Ming Cult's Five "Sang" Men - what does "sang" mean?

[Ken Cheng]

In the Ming Cult, Pang the Monk, Can't Say Monk, the Iron Crown Taoist, Chow Deen, and Lang Him were part of a group called the "Five 'Sang' Men." What does "sang" mean in this context? In the Cantonese pronunciation of the word, the only meaning of "sang" I know refers to "town" or "city." I don't think their group is known as "Five Town Men," however (I am tempted to call them the "Village People" - five oddly dressed guys who always hang out together).

[Huang Rong]

In the Ming Cult, Pang the Monk, Can't Say Monk, the Iron Crown Taoist, Chow Deen, and Lang Him were part of a group called the "Five 'Sang' Men." What does "sang" mean in this context? In the Cantonese pronunciation of the word, the only meaning of "sang" I know refers to "town" or "city." I don't think their group is known as "Five Town Men", however (I am tempted to call them the "Village People" - five oddly dressed guys who always hang out together).

I think 'Sang' in cantonese = 'San' in mandarin = 'Idle' (adj) in English.
5 san ren (5 散人 ) = 5 idle men of the Ming cult. ^.^

[Candide]

Five Lazy Sobs. OK replace Sobs with whatever's appropiate. "Idle" is a weird translation of "San".

[Ken Cheng]

That's an odd description for them. Those five guys were hardly lazy; they were very active in helping out in the reorganization of the Ming Cult.

[Suet Seung]

That's an odd description for them. Those five guys were hardly lazy; they were very active in helping out in the reorganization of the Ming Cult.

Perhaps because they're active in helping the Ming cult, that they're being lazy towards their religious roles? Just helping you ponder.

[Ken Cheng]

Perhaps because they're active in helping the Ming cult, that they're being lazy towards their religious roles? Just helping you ponder.

I still think they should be called the Village People. They can sing a song called, "M-I-N-G."

I feel another song parody coming.

[Candide]

That's an odd description for them. Those five guys were hardly lazy; they were very active in helping out in the reorganization of the Ming Cult.

They were lazy in the sense of being unambitious. They did not want to play any part in the power struggle in the cult, especially after YDT's untimely death.

[Ken Cheng]

They did not want to play any part in the power struggle in the cult, especially after YDT's untimely death.

I thought Chow Deen hated the idea of Yeung Siu possibly becoming Cult Leader, and opposed Yeung Siu at every turn.

[Candide]

That's personal, not political. He just hated Yang Xiao, full stop.

[Pacifian]

There are two meanings to san3 ren2:

1. The first meaning simply refers to people who are useless and scattered all over. Clearly, this isn't the right meaning in the HSDS context.

2. The second meaning refers to people who aren't needed by the world/society. Many retired scholars gave themselves the term san3 ren2 after the Sung Dynasty. Of course, the term applies to more than just scholars. There are other people who self-proclaim themselves as san3 ren2.

I suppose meaning number 2 should be the correct one here.

[Ken Cheng]

Hmmm. According to that interpretation, then, perhaps they should be known as the Five Hermits?

Herman's Hermits?

I get a pop music connection out of everything these days.

[Pacifian]

Hmmm. According to that interpretation, then, perhaps they should be known as the Five Hermits?

Herman's Hermits?

I get a pop music connection out of everything these days.

Not true. Hermits hide themselves, don't they? "San3 ren2"s don't. The world is practically their home, they are free to go anywhere they like, and aren't restricted to certain boundaries/norms. The "san3" here is more towards the meaning of "unfettered" than simply "idle".

[Ken Cheng]

I'm starting to think maybe the Five Hippies would be the way to go.

These hippies definitely don't advocate peace, love, and flower power, though.

From their depiction in HSDS '86, though, I wouldn't be surprised if the whole lot of them smoked pot.

[Suet Seung]

I'm starting to think maybe the Five Hippies would be the way to go.

These hippies definitely don't advocate peace, love, and flower power, though.

From their depiction in HSDS '86, though, I wouldn't be surprised if the whole lot of them smoked pot.

Ken, I finally just figured it out. You're weird.

[Ken Cheng]

Ken, I finally just figured it out. You're weird.

Actually, I'm a heretic, but same difference, I suppose.

And no, I don't smoke pot. I just act like I do.

[Huang Rong]

a hippie is a young person while 'san ren' is often a middle-aged one.
lol, anyway, it seems that hippie is the most suitable word for 散人. ^.^

[Ken Cheng]

a hippie is a young person while 'san ren' is often a middle-aged one.
lol, anyway, it seems that hippie is the most suitable word for 散人. ^.^

Most of the original hippies are old fogeys now.

[junzi]

Wasn't Duan Yu's mum Dao Baifeng known as Yu Xu San Ren or something?

So 'san ren' means a religious person?

[Pacifian]

Wasn't Duan Yu's mum Dao Baifeng known as Yu Xu San Ren or something?

So 'san ren' means a religious person?

'San ren' is generally a term several people gave themselves to tell others they are now free from any - societal or national - restraints or inhibitions of the usual life they had.

'San ren' doesn't mean religious people, but Chinese religions tend to have something to do with their followers 'letting go' of the busied, hurried lifestyle, to lead a secular one. As seen in the case of Dao Baifeng, Dao Bai Feng clearly wants nothing to do with the usual life she had - having to love the man who had numerous lovers outside. Leading a secular lifestyle is a form of being uninhibited by normal customs, therefore many religious people do use the phrase 'san ren' to show their unwillingness to be involved in the 'worldly' stuff.

Retired scholars and poets use the term too. Famous ones include Lu Gui Meng's 'Jiang Hu San Ren' and Zhu Liu Qin's 'Bing Hu San Ren'.

[owbjhx]

In the Ming Cult, Pang the Monk, Can't Say Monk, the Iron Crown Taoist, Chow Deen, and Lang Him were part of a group called the "Five 'Sang' Men." What does "sang" mean in this context? In the Cantonese pronunciation of the word, the only meaning of "sang" I know refers to "town" or "city." I don't think their group is known as "Five Town Men," however (I am tempted to call them the "Village People" - five oddly dressed guys who always hang out together).

I'd translate "wu san ren" as "The Five Dissidents". "Dissident" pays some lip service to the meaning of the "san" character, while also alluding to the group's behaviour (they're a bunch of comic characters, after all) and to their political status as a sort of Ming splinter group (having fallen out with Yang Xiao during a leadership struggle 10 years previously).

As for Dao Baifeng's title ("yu xu san ren"), I'd translate that as "The Hermit of Jade Emptiness".