View Poll Results: Which side would win? Keep in mind Jin Yong wrote Quanzhen+OYF=unbeatable

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  • Ouyang Feng + 4 Masters of Quanzhen

    8 29.63%
  • Sweeper Monk + SPT + Murong Longchen + 4 DGSD Elites + Z3F + DFBB + QGQB + S.G. ZBF + 3 XY Elders

    19 70.37%
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Thread: Who Would Win II?

  1. #1
    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Default Who Would Win II?

    As a testament to Jin Yong's marvelous writing, his fineprint reads: No matter how high Huang Yaoshi's martial arts, he could not hope to cope with the combined forces of Ouyang Feng plus 4 Masters of Quanzhen. This literally means that even if Huang Yaoshi's martial arts were 100 times better, he would nevertheless be defeated by the combined forces of OF+4MoQ.

    Now, I want to know if the SPCNET community agrees with Jin Yong or if we have another opinion. Do you think there is a chance that someone, or better yet, someFIFTEEN, could possibly beat the the CFoOF+4MoQ?

    A poll is coming.
    Last edited by PJ; 02-01-07 at 04:26 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by CC
    So what if 1000 arrows are targetted at our wuxia hero? LHC's missile breaking stance can deflect thousands of projectiles in 1 stance and send them back to the enemy. The more arrows the better!

  2. #2
    Moderator Ren Wo Xing's Avatar
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    Clearly, OYF+the Quanzhen masters. This is canon and confirmed to be in the book, so there's nothing else to say.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    What can I say if Jin Yong wrote that in the novel?
    Ouyang Feng + 4 QZ masters ftw! LOL
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-01-07 at 04:42 AM.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  4. #4
    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    What if it was Team A: OYF + 4 QZ Masters vs Team B: OYF + 7 QZ Masters?
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

  5. #5
    Senior Member wang23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CC
    What if it was Team A: OYF + 4 QZ Masters vs Team B: OYF + 7 QZ Masters?
    Four is definitely better than seven.

  6. #6
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    I took the nonconformist route.

    With all due respect to Jin Yong, who was the modern master of wuxia when my father was still in elementary school, common sense sometimes *does* need to trump even the author's words.

  7. #7
    Senior Member yittz's Avatar
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    But team two has ZBF - his sword skill is unparalleled in the JY universe, how can he lose...now I am confused.

    On a serious note, it does suggest no one single person in LOCH can defeat OYF+4QZ.

    Never thought OYF + 4 QZ would be described as a peak of perfection in being uncopable.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Bangs's Avatar
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    Although JY did mention such a line, we have to understand what he really tried to imply. In that case, he must've meant that HYS as a person has a limit and that if HYS has maxed out his capabilities, he won't be able to win against OYF+4 Quanzhen Masters. Sure he didn't mean that HYS has more potential than 5 sweeper monks combined.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    yeah, i totally agree with u, Bangs, your explaination really enlightened my mind.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  10. #10
    Senior Member yittz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bangs
    Although JY did mention such a line, we have to understand what he really tried to imply. In that case, he must've meant that HYS as a person has a limit and that if HYS has maxed out his capabilities, he won't be able to win against OYF+4 Quanzhen Masters. Sure he didn't mean that HYS has more potential than 5 sweeper monks combined.
    In which case it suggests HYS in ROCH is weaker than LOCH OYF and 4QZ. Remembering that 7 QZ without formation will be slaughtered by a LOCH great, so 4 is even less of a threat - does that mean little improvement of HYS through ROCH. Remember GJ was doing fine against a great and 3 fighters above QZ.
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  11. #11
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Well, though your Chinese is 100 times better than mine, PJ, I think in this case you misunderstood Jin Yong's words.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jin Yong chapter 25
    黄药师功夫__再高__,也不能前挡四子,后敌西毒
    IMO he did not mean that:
    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    No matter how high Huang Yaoshi's martial arts, he could not hope to cope with the combined forces of Ouyang Feng plus 4 Masters of Quanzhen.
    but:
    Even if Huang Yaoshi's martial arts level __was doubled__, he would not be able to cope with the combined forces of the 4 Quanzhen Masters at his front and Ouyang Feng at his back.

    Correct me if I'm wrong. .
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-01-07 at 09:13 AM.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  12. #12
    Senior Member yittz's Avatar
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    But if his MA was doubled, surely he would be able to cope with one half and one bit.

    I think it can be intepreted as "Even with HYS's kungfu so high, he can not cope with ..." even though the words don't mean no matter how high.
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  13. #13
    Senior Member AnhHung's Avatar
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    Perhaps it is wiser for us to concentrate on the intention of the (s)words, rather than the literal meaning of the (s)words.
    You do know that it is just fiction, dont you?

  14. #14
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yittz
    But if his MA was doubled, surely he would be able to cope with one half and one bit.
    well, even with HYS's doubled MA, i think he wouldn't be able to __at the same time__ cope with the 4 Quan Zhen Masters at his front, and __sustain__ Ouyang Feng's deadly palm at his back.
    This situation was not like an MA-doubled-Huang Yaoshi was freely fighting with the combination of the 4 Masters and Ouyang Feng, since Ouyang Feng *suddently* lauched his attack.
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-01-07 at 09:14 AM.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  15. #15
    Senior Member yittz's Avatar
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    Ah, maybe no one can sustain a sudden OYF sneak attack regardless of how high their martial arts if they preoccupied?

    In which case double MA HYS also makes sense.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by CC
    What if it was Team A: OYF + 4 QZ Masters vs Team B: OYF + 7 QZ Masters?
    Wow, what a sick and twisted question. The only way this is possible is if the other new 3 QZ are a VERY BIG hassle to the rest that they need protected.

    For instance, I think Yeung Gor could easily beat Yeung Gor and a baby.

  17. #17
    Senior Member LuNaR's Avatar
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    oyf and the 4 quanzheng... i mean u cant go agaisnt the author. team B is is overrated anyways. like the old saying, u can have 10000 troops but u can only use 1000 troops in the battle field.
    SAN FRANCISCO GIANTS 2010 and 2012 CHAMPS

  18. #18
    Senior Member duguxiaojing's Avatar
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    JY uses this line frequently, this is not the first time which ive seen this phrase...although I cannot think of a specific example...
    =(
    wow..04-08....4 years just like that..time flies..

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    As a testament to Jin Yong's marvelous writing, his fineprint reads: No matter how high Huang Yaoshi's martial arts, he could not hope to cope with the combined forces of Ouyang Feng plus 4 Masters of Quanzhen.
    On a serious note, would this imply at least that Sweeper Monk would be unable to beat that group.

    It seems JY imply not one single person (no matter how high in martial arts) can cope with OYF and company. So if we take Sweeper Monk (majority here agrees he is number one in martial arts) against that group, would it imply the same thing.

    OYF+4 QZ is better than SM?

  20. #20
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    But then, JY also said that XZ would never be disadvantaged in any situation. So XZ = OYF + 4 QZ!

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