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Thread: The Ultimate Consolidated Discussion Pertaining to LONG DISTANCE ATTACK (LDA)

  1. #1
    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Default The Ultimate Consolidated Discussion Pertaining to LONG DISTANCE ATTACK (LDA)

    This is one controversial baby. I want to discuss it more and see if we can reach any new conclusions.

    One strange thing, if this information is correct, is that no one who witnessed a LDA ever thought "wow, the range of the attack is beyond my capability." Even much weaker bystanders never thought this. And yet, even for a tiny detail when Xiao Yuanshan used a freaking WHIP, Jin Yong made Xiao Feng think that "I could not do what [my father] did." So why no one ever thought they were incapable of LDA in DGSD or SPW? I know that Yin Tianzheng gasped when he thought of the possibility of Song Yuanqiao being capable of LDA, but in DGSD or SPW no one seems to be surprised or impressed by the ranges.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    lda is like sword god zhuo bu fan, everyone just get all excited about it but it is completely overrated. i think lda is no different than a normal palm attack, maybe it just give u some time to dodge after using a long distance attack, but thats about it.
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    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    I think Being more powerful in MA doesn't mean that you can launch a Longer-DA,
    Since Fang Zheng and Fang Sheng seemed not to be able to deliver their Palm energy farther than Great Yin Yang Palm Yue Hou did.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

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    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR
    lda is like sword god zhuo bu fan, everyone just get all excited about it but it is completely overrated. i think lda is no different than a normal palm attack, maybe it just give u some time to dodge after using a long distance attack, but thats about it.
    yeah, and a gun which has 100m range is exactly like a gun w/ just 20m.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    A gun which has 100m range is exactly like a gun w/ just 20m.
    I think it's rather unreasonable to compare LDA with gums.
    To execute LDA, a fighter has to spend a lot of his energy, besides, the impact force of LDA (qi) travels slower than a bullet, therefore the opponent can dodge and wait till the LDAer runs out of energy.
    IIRC, while fighting in the ice cellar of the Xixia palace, both Tianshan Tonglao and Li Qiushui didn't use LDA, whereas they were probably the Gods of LDA?
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-01-07 at 11:22 PM.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

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    Senior Member S Beaver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    yeah, and a gun which has 100m range is exactly like a gun w/ just 20m.
    the problems is you have no idea if the person is actually trying to fire a gun...or has a gun but chooses not to use it and favors throwing a piece of rock instead
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    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    LDA was used in the ice cellar. LQS launched her Bai Hong Zhang at TSTL. In any case, it was a cramped place and those 2 were in ***** fight hair pulling mode.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    One theory I would give my opinion on is that LDA speeds seem to be about equal to the speed of a martial artist.

    In fact, LDA speed might be about equal to the speed of the guy who launched it. i.e. Higher inner energy = higher physical speed = faster LDA speed.

    For example : XF and his triple Kang Long You Hui seemed to move forward at about the same pace.

    Sweeper Monk when injured and carrying 2 persons was reduced to about XF's speed, XF launched LDA's but couldn't reach Sweeper (both XF and Sweeper running).

    Yun Zhonghe, although running away, could not outspeed XF's LDA. But he was carrying someone, so not a fair example.

    LQS, chasing after XZ, her palm strikes couldn't catch up.

    In general, it seems that if you throw an LDA at a target running away, the LDA speed is normally insufficient to catch the fleeing target.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    yeah, i agree with you: LDA speed = LDAer speed.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

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    Senior Member Xiao Feng's Avatar
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    In a fight, having the advantage of range is good. Being able to hit from a bigger distance, is definitely an advantage, hence the use of weapons which are there to extend the arms of a fighter. But of course, if the weapon is too cumbersome to use it becomes ineffective and therefore pointless.

    Same thing with LDAs. They are an extension of a strike and as I've said earlier, having range is good. The problem with range is that, the bigger the distance, the more ground to cover i.e. more time for opponent to dodge. In the event of a fight with someone really good (and fast), extreme range becomes less effective, because it takes more to execute and the probability of hitting is low. So getting up close and personal may be a better choice. Unless you wish to evade combat or keep the opponent within a safe distance.
    Last edited by Xiao Feng; 02-02-07 at 04:02 AM.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CC
    One theory I would give my opinion on is that LDA speeds seem to be about equal to the speed of a martial artist.

    In fact, LDA speed might be about equal to the speed of the guy who launched it. i.e. Higher inner energy = higher physical speed = faster LDA speed.

    For example : XF and his triple Kang Long You Hui seemed to move forward at about the same pace.

    Sweeper Monk when injured and carrying 2 persons was reduced to about XF's speed, XF launched LDA's but couldn't reach Sweeper (both XF and Sweeper running).

    Yun Zhonghe, although running away, could not outspeed XF's LDA. But he was carrying someone, so not a fair example.

    LQS, chasing after XZ, her palm strikes couldn't catch up.

    In general, it seems that if you throw an LDA at a target running away, the LDA speed is normally insufficient to catch the fleeing target.
    Or is it because LDA speed = extent of inner energy
    and LDAer speed = extent of inner energy??

    Han SOlo

  12. #12
    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Han Solo
    Or is it because LDA speed = extent of inner energy
    and LDAer speed = extent of inner energy??

    Han SOlo
    Same thing/same result I guess.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huang Rong
    To execute LDA, a fighter has to spend a lot of his energy
    We don't know that LDA exhausts more energy than SDA (short distance attack). What you're implying is, every time the Greats were involved in a fight, they were never using their maximum power, that's why we don't see LDA in Condor Trilogy?

    besides, the impact force of LDA (qi) travels slower than a bullet, therefore the opponent can dodge and wait till the LDAer runs out of energy.
    If the opponent can simply dodge the LDA and win, then Evil #4 Yun Zhonghe, Linghu Chong, Guo Xiang, Murong Bo etc would not have been threatened by LDA at all. Yes, it can be dodged sometimes, like when Zhao Qiansun was pulled out of Qiao Feng's palm wind, but the fighter using LDA is not going to just fire LDA all day until he runs out. He has other tricks in his bag which should meet or exceed the non-LDA opponent.

    I hated the scene in DGSD 2003 in which Xiao Feng's triple LDA looked like a slow motion cloud of fart. By the time it reached Ding Chunqiu, he indeed could have just evaded easily (and did?). But in the novel the LDA was not escapable.

    IIRC, while fighting in the ice cellar of the Xixia palace, both Tianshan Tonglao and Li Qiushui didn't use LDA, whereas they were probably the Gods of LDA?
    We don't know if they were using LDA or not. Their movements were simply too fast for Xuzhu's naked eye to fathom.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Senior Member ChronoReverse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    I hated the scene in DGSD 2003 in which Xiao Feng's triple LDA looked like a slow motion cloud of fart. By the time it reached Ding Chunqiu, he indeed could have just evaded easily (and did?). But in the novel the LDA was not escapable.
    While I mostly agree with your points, I'll have to note that XF arrived at about the same time as the LDA since he merged three of them. That was also the reason why the force of that LDA was so out of the ordinary.

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    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Duan Yu's laser beams were so fast that Murong Fu had no choice but to brandish his weapons to save his life.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

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    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    I hated the scene in DGSD 2003 in which Xiao Feng's triple LDA looked like a slow motion cloud of fart. By the time it reached Ding Chunqiu, he indeed could have just evaded easily (and did?). But in the novel the LDA was not escapable.

    .
    Actually, if we think realistically, WTF was XF thinking at that point in the novel? I mean, if I was DCQ and I was holding Ah Zhi and this huge dragon palm wave is crashing right in, the first thing I would do is throw the bloody b***h towards the incoming wave to absorb some of the force.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CC
    Actually, if we think realistically, WTF was XF thinking at that point in the novel? I mean, if I was DCQ and I was holding Ah Zhi and this huge dragon palm wave is crashing right in, the first thing I would do is throw the bloody b***h towards the incoming wave to absorb some of the force.
    the LDA was too fast for Ding to react like that?
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

  18. #18
    Senior Member Han Solo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    We don't know that LDA exhausts more energy than SDA (short distance attack). What you're implying is, every time the Greats were involved in a fight, they were never using their maximum power, that's why we don't see LDA in Condor Trilogy?
    Logically, it should.

    LDA would require more energy as your energy would need to travel a greater distance.

    Energy is inversely proprotionate to distance.

    But i'm sure you may find examples on th enovels to argue this point too.

    Han SOlo

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    Senior Member CC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    the LDA was too fast for Ding to react like that?
    If Ding had time to throw Ah Zhi (IIRC, XF caught her in mid-air) and raise his palms and jump back in defence, he sure would have time to throw Ah Zhi forward. And if Ding was totally caught flatfooted, since he was holding Ah Zhi, the palm strike could have easily hit Ah Zhi if Ding just moved a bit.

    Unless the Kang Long You Hui could be retractet somehow, it doesn't make sense. Or XF was being too rash.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

  20. #20
    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Han Solo
    Logically, it should.

    LDA would require more energy as your energy would need to travel a greater distance.

    Energy is inversely proprotionate to distance.

    But i'm sure you may find examples on th enovels to argue this point too.

    Han SOlo
    What I was envisioning is: imagine scenario #1 in which you and I are fighting with a distance of 30 feet between us; I generate an attack at you and it travels 30 feet; that's LDA. Now, imagine scenario #2 in which you and I are fighting with a distance of 5 feet apart; I fire the same attack at you with the same strength but it only travels 5 feet; that is NOT LDA. Both attacks required the same amount of energy and strength.

    In that scenario (limited distance, which could happen a lot in fights), LDA does not require any more energy than non-LDA.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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