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Thread: Was Li Mochou a nice demure lady before her love life failed?

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    Senior Member Extremer88's Avatar
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    Post Was Li Mochou a nice demure lady before her love life failed?

    Li Mochou became a person filled with hatred, anger and jealousy because of her failed love life and also due to the fact that Lin Chaoying only imparted the Jade Maiden Skill to Xiaolongnu and not to her.

    I can't recall. Was it mentioned in the novel that Li Mochou was a nice, gentle or demure lady before all this happen (can't imagine that if she really was)? Or was she like this (filled with hatred & evil) since young?

    Note: Lin Chaoying is not Li Mochou & Xiaolongnu's teacher. Sorry for the error.
    Last edited by Extremer88; 05-02-07 at 07:35 AM.
    ..ext88

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    Senior Member odbayarb2000's Avatar
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    Lin Chaoying wasn't the teacher of XLN and LMC.
    Their teacher was Lin Chaoying's maid.
    In the novel, it was mentioned several times that LMC's teacher exiled her from sect after found out LMC's evil side.
    But I am not really sure about why her evil side appeared ?
    I guess it's because of her love life.

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    Senior Member Extremer88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by odbayarb2000 View Post
    Lin Chaoying wasn't the teacher of XLN and LMC.
    Their teacher was Lin Chaoying's maid.
    In the novel, it was mentioned several times that LMC's teacher exiled her from sect after found out LMC's evil side.
    But I am not really sure about why her evil side appeared ?
    I guess it's because of her love life.
    Oops, I forgot their teacher. There was somebody in between Lin Chaoying and LMC/XLN. The era between Lin Chaoyin and LMC/XLN was too long and would be impossible for them to even had seen each other. Thanks for clarifying my error man.
    ..ext88

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    Default Aunt Li

    Li Mochou was a psychopath. Nobody could do the things she did without being, at some level, rather deranged. However, from Jinyong's direct descriptions of her personality, and also from what can be implied from her behaviour, she probably wasn't "filled with hatred and evil" since youth. In fact, I'd argue that JY's depiction of her - as being someone with a rather sentimental side - was kinder than his depiction of, say, Guo Fu. Maybe JY was being indulgent or incorrect, but it's a sympathetic portrayal.

    In Chapter 27, JY wrote that LMC "wasn't evil by nature. It was just that, after having her heart broken, she hated the world; her hatred and pain made her eccentric, and her eccentricity in turn made her ruthless, belligerent and violent." LMC's epitaph in Chapter 32 was also similarly understanding. In Chapter 22, Yang Guo - not always the world's most forgiving guy - thought of LMC: "Her behaviour was so vicious and extreme, but this must have been because of a time when she had to go through terrible suffering...he couldn't help feeling a little pity for her."

    JY made a point of demonstrating how, under the horrendous, mass-murdering exterior, there was rather a lot of painful humanity. The most obvious example is the whole Guo Xiang episode, but it wasn't the first time she behaved maternally: she did take in Hong Lingbo and Lu Wushuang, after all (admittedly, she ended up sacrificing the former in an act of stupidity, but at least showed remorse about it afterwards - which is more than can be said for certain other characters), and tried to dissuade Gongsun Zhi from poisoning Gongsun Lu'e. She was sentimental, being moved by Cheng Ying's flute-playing and the tale of Feng Mofeng, and admiring YG's devotion to Xiaolongnu. And she liked a good cuddle!

    None of this excuses LMC's crimes, but it does suggest she might well have been nice, gentle and demure before something clicked in her head.

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    Quote Originally Posted by odbayarb2000 View Post
    Lin Chaoying wasn't the teacher of XLN and LMC.
    Their teacher was Lin Chaoying's maid.
    In the novel, it was mentioned several times that LMC's teacher exiled her from sect after found out LMC's evil side.
    But I am not really sure about why her evil side appeared ?
    I guess it's because of her love life.
    Didn't she get exiled first before meeting what's his name.

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    She seemed to have some latent ambition even before the Luk Tzin Yeun incident.

    Becoming a powerful person in wulin was among Lee Mok Sau's goals.

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    Senior Member batmankiller's Avatar
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    No she got exiled for disobeying her master and being with that guy.. you're not allowed to be married in the AT

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    Registered User JamesG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by owbjhx View Post
    Li Mochou was a psychopath. Nobody could do the things she did without being, at some level, rather deranged. However, from Jinyong's direct descriptions of her personality, and also from what can be implied from her behaviour, she probably wasn't "filled with hatred and evil" since youth. In fact, I'd argue that JY's depiction of her - as being someone with a rather sentimental side - was kinder than his depiction of, say, Guo Fu. Maybe JY was being indulgent or incorrect, but it's a sympathetic portrayal.

    In Chapter 27, JY wrote that LMC "wasn't evil by nature. It was just that, after having her heart broken, she hated the world; her hatred and pain made her eccentric, and her eccentricity in turn made her ruthless, belligerent and violent." LMC's epitaph in Chapter 32 was also similarly understanding. In Chapter 22, Yang Guo - not always the world's most forgiving guy - thought of LMC: "Her behaviour was so vicious and extreme, but this must have been because of a time when she had to go through terrible suffering...he couldn't help feeling a little pity for her."

    JY made a point of demonstrating how, under the horrendous, mass-murdering exterior, there was rather a lot of painful humanity. The most obvious example is the whole Guo Xiang episode, but it wasn't the first time she behaved maternally: she did take in Hong Lingbo and Lu Wushuang, after all (admittedly, she ended up sacrificing the former in an act of stupidity, but at least showed remorse about it afterwards - which is more than can be said for certain other characters), and tried to dissuade Gongsun Zhi from poisoning Gongsun Lu'e. She was sentimental, being moved by Cheng Ying's flute-playing and the tale of Feng Mofeng, and admiring YG's devotion to Xiaolongnu. And she liked a good cuddle!

    None of this excuses LMC's crimes, but it does suggest she might well have been nice, gentle and demure before something clicked in her head.
    From Chapter 32: "Wu Santong and his two sons, Lu Wushuang and Cheng Ying had a very deep animosity toward her, and had always wanted their revenge. But now that she was dead, they did not feel a single bit of joy in their hearts. Huang Rong remembered how the demoness – despite her evil and cruel character – had taken care of her little Guo Xiang with love and kindness for many-many days. She then lifted the baby up, put her little hands together, and waved them toward the blazing fire as a final gesture of respect toward the ill-fated woman."

    Redemption in the end?
    Last edited by JamesG; 05-02-07 at 01:41 PM. Reason: I re-editred this paragraph in the translation just now.

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    Senior Member kyss of the sword's Avatar
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    she had a bad temper, very guo fu like. she blamed people unreasonably and over reacted to everything.
    THE KYSS OF THE SWORD IS DEADLY BUT EXQUSITE
    he's the strongest in history but he's the disciple.
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/histor...ciple_kenichi/

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    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesG View Post
    From Chapter 32: "Wu Santong and his two sons, Lu Wushuang and Cheng Ying had a very deep animosity toward her, and had always wanted their revenge. But now that she was dead, they did not feel a single bit of joy in their hearts. Huang Rong remembered how the demoness despite her evil and cruel character had taken care of her little Guo Xiang with love and kindness for many-many days. She then lifted the baby up, put her little hands together, and waved them toward the blazing fire as a final gesture of respect toward the ill-fated woman."

    Redemption in the end?
    I wouldn't say she redeemed anything. People just felt sorry for her.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyss of the sword View Post
    she had a bad temper, very guo fu like. she blamed people unreasonably and over reacted to everything.
    That seems to be a necessary character trait for Ancient Tomb Sect members.

    Maybe it's required or something.

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    Senior Member sheraldine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    That seems to be a necessary character trait for Ancient Tomb Sect members.
    no lah... its a man who started the ancient tomb thingy, a woman merely took over... and guo fu is not a disciple... wonder where she get all her traits, who u think, guo jing or huang rong?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sheraldine View Post
    no lah... its a man who started the ancient tomb thingy, a woman merely took over... and guo fu is not a disciple... wonder where she get all her traits, who u think, guo jing or huang rong?
    A man built the building, but a woman started the organization.

    Gwok Fu inherited all the bad traits of her parents. She got her father's slow mind combined with her mother's more willful aspect. It's almost as if the Gwok couple's bad traits all crystallized into their eldest daughter.

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    Senior Member HuangYushi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Gwok Fu inherited all the bad traits of her parents. She got her father's slow mind combined with her mother's more willful aspect. It's almost as if the Gwok couple's bad traits all crystallized into their eldest daughter.
    Basically, a spoilt brat. She should have been spanked before she was 5, but Huang Rong and even Ke Zhen'e doted on her! Sheesh....
    Jin Yong's Ode to Gallantry [侠客行].
    Quote Originally Posted by atlantean0208
    what about SPT, I need my SPT fix ASAP, pretty pleaseeeee...
    Soon ... SOON!

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    Quote Originally Posted by HuangYushi View Post
    Basically, a spoilt brat. She should have been spanked before she was 5, but Huang Rong and even Ke Zhen'e doted on her! Sheesh....
    I think there was more going on with Gwok Fu than just the usual parental spoiling. Many kids are spoiled when they're little, but eventually grow up to be decent people. Gwok Fu never did. She might actually have some kind of developmental disorder.

    Ah, but that's applying modern scientific knowledge to wuxia...which seldom goes well.

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    If you were to ask me, Guo Fu turned out the way she did probably because her parents were too busy defending the city, allowing her to literally act like a little princess and demanding stuff. Who dares say no to the daughter of the biggest hero in the city/country?

    Add on two guys who are willing to bend over backwards just to make her happy, it is actually amazing Guo Fu didn't turn out to be even more of a tyrant.

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