Would Hung 7 Gung kill any of Wong Yerk See's disciples if he had to?

[Ken Cheng]

The way relationships worked in wulin, if one has a friend in wulin, one must also respect his students as well. After all, the teacher-student relationship in wulin society (and Chinese society in general) was considered parallel to that of parent and child.

Here's a hypothetical: let's say that Mui Chiu Fung and Chan Yeun Fung were in North Beggar Hung 7 Gung's territory, killing dozens of people to practice their 9 Yum White Bone Claws, including many beggars from the Beggar's Union. In this case, could Hung 7 Gung rightfully kill Mui Chiu Fung and Chan Yeun Fung without offending his good friend East Heretic Wong Yerk See (teacher to Mui and Chan)? Or would Hung 7 Gung have his hands tied because the two evildoers happen to be students of his friend?

[CC]

There is some room for a middle ground here. You don't have to kill them. Crippling or capture and hauling them back to Peach Blossom Island is a choice.

[owbjhx]

The way relationships worked in wulin, if one has a friend in wulin, one must also respect his students as well. After all, the teacher-student relationship in wulin society (and Chinese society in general) was considered parallel to that of parent and child.

Here's a hypothetical: let's say that Mui Chiu Fung and Chan Yeun Fung were in North Beggar Hung 7 Gung's territory, killing dozens of people to practice their 9 Yum White Bone Claws, including many beggars from the Beggar's Union. In this case, could Hung 7 Gung rightfully kill Mui Chiu Fung and Chan Yeun Fung without offending his good friend East Heretic Wong Yerk See (teacher to Mui and Chan)? Or would Hung 7 Gung have his hands tied because the two evildoers happen to be students of his friend?

I don't think Hong Qigong was afraid of offending anyone, particularly if there was injustice in the air (and no distracting food). He certainly wasn't afraid of offending Huang Yaoshi on Peachblossom Island (Chapter 18). If he was happy to insult and mock HYS face-to-face (in HYS's own home!), and angrily accuse him - when he reminisced indulgently about his beloved, departed wife - of "dragging up that dead old bag to scare us", he'd surely be willing to act in an even more disrespectful manner towards HYS's disciples. Knowing his righteous streak, and also his disdain for the pomposity and reciprocal ego-stroking of wulin, he probably wouldn't 'watch from the sidelines, hands-in-sleeves'; and if he was forced to kill, he certainly wouldn't be squeamish about doing so (as his big speech in Chapter 39 makes clear).

[Ken Cheng]

I don't think Hong Qigong was afraid of offending anyone, particularly if there was injustice in the air (and no distracting food). He certainly wasn't afraid of offending Huang Yaoshi on Peachblossom Island (Chapter 18). If he was happy to insult and mock HYS face-to-face (in HYS's own home!), and angrily accuse him - when he reminisced indulgently about his beloved, departed wife - of "dragging up that dead old bag to scare us", he'd surely be willing to act in an even more disrespectful manner towards HYS's disciples. Knowing his righteous streak, and also his disdain for the pomposity and reciprocal ego-stroking of wulin, he probably wouldn't 'watch from the sidelines, hands-in-sleeves'; and if he was forced to kill, he certainly wouldn't be squeamish about doing so (as his big speech in Chapter 39 makes clear).

I certainly agree that Hung 7 Gung wouldn't be afraid of Wong Yerk See. After all, their martial arts are about equal: Wong Yerk See likely can't injure Hung 7 Gung without sustaining injury himself (and vice-versa).

But Hung 7 Gung clearly valued his friendship with Wong Yerk See, and held the other in high regard. It makes me wonder if that consideration of friendship would give Hung 7 Gung pause if he had to act against Wong's disciples (a distinct likelihood had Mui and Chan not fled to Mongolia).

And for that matter, I wonder if Wong Yerk See would have understood and not let it come between his friendship with Hung 7 Gung, or if the infamously touchy "East Heretic" would have taken offense even knowing that Hung 7 Gung was in the right.

[CC]

And for that matter, I wonder if Wong Yerk See would have understood and not let it come between his friendship with Hung 7 Gung, or if the infamously touchy "East Heretic" would have taken offense even knowing that Hung 7 Gung was in the right.

I am sure he would have taken offence. Its just him.

[batmankiller]

I certainly agree that Hung 7 Gung wouldn't be afraid of Wong Yerk See. After all, their martial arts are about equal: Wong Yerk See likely can't injure Hung 7 Gung without sustaining injury himself (and vice-versa).

But Hung 7 Gung clearly valued his friendship with Wong Yerk See, and held the other in high regard. It makes me wonder if that consideration of friendship would give Hung 7 Gung pause if he had to act against Wong's disciples (a distinct likelihood had Mui and Chan not fled to Mongolia).

And for that matter, I wonder if Wong Yerk See would have understood and not let it come between his friendship with Hung 7 Gung, or if the infamously touchy "East Heretic" would have taken offense even knowing that Hung 7 Gung was in the right.

I actually think HYS would have no problem if it was someone like H7G's calibur injure/kill his disciples if they did indeed do something 'wrong.' And although I'm sure HYS is a heretic, he'll probably understand what's right and wrong if his disciples were out raiding a Beggar's Clan base. Although we saw how HYS reacted when he found GJ and MCF in LOCH in which GJ injured MCF and I'm not sure if HYS knew it was GJ that killed his other disciple. But the point I'm trying to bring up is that, HYS said although his disciples were wrong and should have died many times over anyways, he felt dis-honored that an adolescent like GJ's calibur was able to kill/defeat his disciples like that. I'm not sure if this was from his hate with the 7-Freaks, his shifus but I'm not entirely convinced that was the whole reason. But in any case someone like H7G killing a disciple of his if they were in fact doing something wrong.

I think the way HYS sees it is..HYS=H7G. Therefore:
H7G killing disciples=HYS killing his disciples

[Ren Wo Xing]

Hong Qigong would've given HYS face; he didn't even kill or attack Ouyang Ke when he could've! Probably haul them off to Taohua Dao.

[batmankiller]

Hong Qigong would've given HYS face; he didn't even kill or attack Ouyang Ke when he could've! Probably haul them off to Taohua Dao.

OYK wasn't doing anything on the same level say practicing Nine Yine Bone Claws on Beggar's Clan disciples. This would be disrespectful and clearly a sign of hostility towards H7G. OYK "supposedly" kidnapped and molested a few girls but he didn't kill anyone and he backed off once he say H7G.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Considering HQG ripped the friggin' HAIR out of Lingzhi Shangren for doing something similar and kicked his *** pretty hard, and that in addition to kidnap and rape, OYK had also insulted and assaulted Beggar Clan members, INCLUDING a member whom HQG had personally taught a stance of the XL18Z for overwhelming bravery...

[Ken Cheng]

Considering HQG ripped the friggin' HAIR out of Lingzhi Shangren for doing something similar and kicked his *** pretty hard, and that in addition to kidnap and rape, OYK had also insulted and assaulted Beggar Clan members, INCLUDING a member whom HQG had personally taught a stance of the XL18Z for overwhelming bravery...

Notably, however, Hung 7 Gung did spare both their lives.

[Ren Wo Xing]

But he didn't even touch Ouyang Ke, and actually saved his life when Huang Rong had tricked him and was about to kill him with her needles. He was giving old Poison tremendous face, which is my point.

[Ken Cheng]

But he didn't even touch Ouyang Ke, and actually saved his life when Huang Rong had tricked him and was about to kill him with her needles. He was giving old Poison tremendous face, which is my point.

If he'd do that out of consideration for West Poison Au Yeung Fung, for whom Hung 7 Gung had *no* feelings of camaraderie or friendship at all, then it stands to reason he'd do at least as much for Wong Yerk See?

[batmankiller]

If he'd do that out of consideration for West Poison Au Yeung Fung, for whom Hung 7 Gung had *no* feelings of camaraderie or friendship at all, then it stands to reason he'd do at least as much for Wong Yerk See?

But the example I'm using is if MCF massacred a beggar's clan union group

[shenlong]

There is some room for a middle ground here. You don't have to kill them. Crippling or capture and hauling them back to Peach Blossom Island is a choice.

Agreed, he can easily defeat them and leave them laying in wait while he pays a visit to HYS.

[Ren Wo Xing]

He'd probably capture them, drag them back to Peach Blossom Island, toss'm in front of Huang Yaoshi, and scold Huang Yaoshi in coarse language and ask'm what he's going to do about his wayward disciples.

[Ken Cheng]

That's one great thing about Hung 7 Gung: he was one of the few people in LOCH who would dare tell Wong Yerk See off to his face.

[Felix]

That's one great thing about Hung 7 Gung: he was one of the few people in LOCH who would dare tell Wong Yerk See off to his face.

Aren't the other Greats the same?

[Ken Cheng]

Aren't the other Greats the same?

Au Yeung Fung faked cordiality to Wong Yerk See at first because he wanted something from him (Wong Yung's hand in marriage for his nephew/son Au Yeung Hak, and the 9 Yum Jen Ging for himself). Au Yeung Fung also didn't care one way or another about Wong Yerk See's personal life or choices.

After the First Mt. Hua Sword Tournament, 1 Deng didn't see Wong Yerk See again until the end of ROCH...and the humble, gentle former Emperor Deun Chi Hing was never the judgmental type.

Chow Bak Tung also didn't care about Wong Yerk See's personal life.

[hyoyatika]

He'd probably capture them, drag them back to Peach Blossom Island, toss'm in front of Huang Yaoshi, and scold Huang Yaoshi in coarse language and ask'm what he's going to do about his wayward disciples.

This.

Especially if it is MCF and CXF involved; HYS has been hunting them for years.