A step into the past - 寻秦记 - by Huang Yi

[xlandhenry]

Thank you yeongwee for the nice update!

With her distressed state of mind before the late King's funeral, letting me invite Princess and crown prince to the palace to stay for a few days will allow you to gain the friendship of the landowner (meaning the Empress Dowager).

I guess the phrase in bold was translated from "稍尽地主之谊" right? It is a common phrase in Chinese which actually means "let us be the host to treat you well" or something similar. Yes it's very hard to translate it precisely, so don't be frustrated, we enjoy your translation and we're looking for more from you!

[yeongwee]

I guess the phrase in bold was translated from "稍尽地主之谊" right? It is a common phrase in Chinese which actually means "let us be the host to treat you well" or something similar. Yes it's very hard to translate it precisely, so don't be frustrated, we enjoy your translation and we're looking for more from you!

Yes you are right =) Yeah, really struggled with this one. Thanks for the tip, really appreciate it. And the encouragement too. Truth be told I'm glad to be learning some Chinese out of this =)

[kohchun]

Bro, can I post in the unabridge section yet? Or you still have someways to finish editing?

[gqonmars2]

Thanks yeongwee for the great work.

I am really confuse with all the names and relations. So let me see if I got this straight.

Madam Zhuang' Son is suppose to be king.
Li Yanyan, a number 2 hottie behind Lady Ji was married to the dead king chu. Which makes Li Yuan the Imperial Uncle.

So was Madam Zhuang and Li Yanyan married to the same king? This is the only reason that Madam Zhuang' Son can be crown price.

[hoangd]

Thanks a bunch for the translations yeongwee!

[Han Solo]

Can i request for a list of characters, in english and chinese?

Getting a bit confusing with the new changes.

Thanks,
Han Solo

[yeongwee]

Bro, can I post in the unabridge section yet? Or you still have someways to finish editing?

Let me sort out the confusion over names and relations first. Will get back to you.

[yeongwee]

Can i request for a list of characters, in english and chinese?

Getting a bit confusing with the new changes.

Thanks,
Han Solo

Ok, I'll try to make it clearer with qualifications on the names next time.

Dian, or Yunnan is a vassal state of Chu with its own system of royalty. The King of Dian used to be Great General Zhuang until the rebellion by Li Ling. Hence Zhuang Baoyi, being the grandson, is the rightful Crown Prince of Dian. After Shaolong's heroics, the people in Chu acknowledge Baoyi and refer to him periodically as little crown prince 小储君 or heir apparent. He is usually mentioned in the same sentence as Princess 王妃, which is Madam Zhuang.

Li Yanyan is the Empress Dowager 太后 of Chu. Li Yuan is the Imperial Uncle 太国舅 of the presently unnamed two year old Crown Prince 储君 of Chu.

I've added the qualifiers in the post so it looks clearer. Someone take a look and see if its ok?

[yeongwee]

Alright Kohchun, if there is no other comment, I think we can post the previous chapter into the unabridged thread.

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Book Sixteen Chapter 01 - Empress Dowager Yanyan

Amongst the palaces Xiang Shaolong has seen, the scale of the Chu palace is second only to that of the Xianyang palace, but it is the most tightly guarded.

The palace city is surrounded by thirty foot high walls with an elaborate tower in each of the four corners. The walls are completely encircled by a fifty foot wide moat with clear waters that allow one to see the bottom. The most formidable are the wooden stakes that stick out of the middle of the moat, making it difficult for one to swim across. There are two city gates which can be raised or lowered for traffic.

Behind the high walls are layers upon layers of palace halls and rooms which are mostly either part of the outer Royal Court or the inner palace courtyard. The central enclosure is bounded by an inner wall with two bell drum-towers. An inner palace gate is set in the link-way between the outer Royal Court and the inner courtyard.

The overall layout is symmetrical about a central axis, with a main street connecting the North and South city gates and the inner palace gate. Eight large palace halls and close to sixty courtyard houses are laid out tidily around the central axis on both sides of the main street, with marble fishponds, foot bridges, running water and ancient trees reaching the sky, magnificent and handsome.

Xiang Shaolong and Li Yuan entered the palace through the North entrance. They traversed a large square and a bridge over a transverse brook before reaching the two main palace halls 'Political Discourse' and 'Rites and Ceremonies'. Both halls were built on white stone terraces with encircling paths and railings. The atmosphere was solemn and magnificent.

Of the six other smaller palace halls, four were part of the outer Royal Court and two were part of the inner palace courtyard. They were all named after characters from the Chu mythology. The outer Royal Court halls were named 'Fire God', 'River Goddess', 'The God of Punishment' and 'Fate'.

The inner courtyard halls were named 'Fragrant Martyr' and 'Witch'.

As he was listening to Li Yuan's introductions, the hall which left the greatest impression on Xiang Shaolong was the 'Witch' Hall. Simply going by these names, it can be seen that amongst the nations, the Chu people were the most ingenious and romantic. One could forget about such audacious and innovative names for palace halls in the other states.

At the same time, his heart was charged with electricity.

Earlier, Li Yuan had raised the issue of killing Lord Chunshen, then side-tracked to another topic, apparently to give him time to digest this hard-to-swallow proposal. He thus recalled Li Yuan's worries.

Lord Chunshen has wielded power for a long time after all, with a thousand lackeys under his wing. He has a lot of prestige in Chu, is strong in every department, and has hard stems and deep roots.

If Li Yuan kills him personally, he could incite unrest. He therefore has to find a scape goat, that man being Xiang Shaolong.

Once he reached Shouchun, he had unyieldingly chased away the Li Chuangwen who had forcibly seized the Dian King's Mansion, appearing to be completely oblivious to the consequences. In Li Yuan's eyes, he looked like a heroic and straightforward person.

If he could prompt Xiang Shaolong to assassinate Lord Chunshen, he could push all accusations onto Wan Ruiguang. In this way, he could also neutralize the Zhuang family's attempt to reclaim their country and even take Madam Zhuang for himself, killing three birds with one stone. There was no stratagem that was more malicious than this.

Those who stood on the side of Chu all wished to use Li Ling's hand to flatten the vassal state and bring it back under Chu's control*. It appears that Li Yuan, Lord Chunshen and Li Ling were like snakes and mice in the same nest, merely paying lip service to the beauty Madam Zhuang!
* We need to remember that the vassal states had stopped abiding by Chu after King Xiaolie took over, and were subjects in name only.

The horse carriage entered the inner palace gate into the inner palace courtyard. This was where the Chu King handled daily government affairs and lived his daily life. The main buildings were the two palace halls 'Fragrant Martyr' and 'Witch', and six palaces** to the East and West. Each palace was composed of four courtyard houses. There were also three gardens, the 'Imperial Garden' on the main street and the East and West Gardens on the East and West streets. The scenery was harmonious and boundless.
** Ok so there is the whole complex which is called the 'Palace'. Within the Palace there are many 'palaces'. To simplify everything, we will call everything 'palace'. The context should be sufficient to distinguish the two.

Li Yuan was clearly learned, explaining the folklore behind the names of the palace halls one by one. His style of conversation was elegant and filled with an enchanting charisma. It is no wonder that even though her heart belonged to him, Xiang Shaolong, and even knowing that Li Yuan was not a good guy, Madam Zhuang was unable to restrain her emotions with him.

At this point, he was talking about the River Goddess and the Witch, and with a laughing voice said: "Our two most beautiful goddesses. the River God and the Witch, do not inhabit Chu's borders, but are from Han's Luo River and Qin's Mount Wu respectively. Laughing with the lips and eyes, indistinct and abstract as spirits, inhabiting distant rivers and mountains, it is fascinating to think about."
(Ok so the Witch 巫女 is from Mount Wu 巫山. I can't really figure out whether it should be Lady Wu from Mount Wu or the Witch from Witch Mountain. Anyone?)

Xiang Shaolong said: "Regarding the matter about Lord Chunshen that Imperial Uncle mentioned…." Li Yuan patted his own brows amiably and said: "Lets discuss this again at a later date. I think Brother Wan should first spend more time to clearly recognize Lord Chunshen's true face and verify that I, Li Yuan, am not slandering a good person. Brother Wan can then make his decision. Brother Wan should nonetheless remember that this is a matter between us men. If the ladies knew about this, not only will they reveal it in their countenance, it will cause them to worry all day, doing more harm than good."

Xiang Shaolong silently praised this brilliant move, and naturally nodded his head in agreement.

Li Yuan is trying to deceive him, he is also trying to deceive Li Yuan, tit-for-tat, both sides should not have any cause to grumble.

At this moment, the horse carriage was following the East road. The question was where was Tian Dan's location?

Li Yuan laughed and said: "I have an official residence outside the palace that is ten times the size. I prefer to stay within the palace nonetheless, and I spend the large proportion of my time here.

Xiang Shaolong mused: the real reason is that you want to be close by to control Li Yanyan.

As the guardian opened the carriage door, Xiang Shaolong collected his disparate thoughts and followed Li Yuan down.

Li Yuan and Xiang Shaolong sat down within the main hall as host and guest. A pretty servant maid proffered some fragrant tea.

As Xiang Shaolong's eyes took a sweep of the place, he realized that Li Yuan was a man of taste.

In the direction of the Royal Court and the central axis is a row of eighteen doors with louvre windows. The pond on the terrace was adorned with miniature pavilions and rock mountains, and was forded by a stone bridge. The courtyard was wider than five hundred paces, and planted with Camellias and Chinese Cinnamon. It was just before summer and the Camellias were in full bloom. With the smell of cassia and tangerines floating in the air, the red and white strived with each other, creating a colorful scene of Spring.

The furniture in the hall were all made of intricately carved fragrant pear wood, with the seats were covered with brocade. All kinds of decorative ancient porcelain and engraved screens could be found everywhere. Xiang Shaolong knew that his taste was not at this level.

If not for the fact that he had obtained Ji Yanran's affections first and that they had shared all kinds of extraordinary circumstances, he might really have lost to Li Yuan in that contest for Ji Yanran.

Because the North hall faced away from the Sun and was close to the pond, it was cool and refreshing, relieving the summer heat.

As Xiang Shaolong and Li Yuan sat calmly in the middle of the hall enjoying the fragrant tea, for a moment he felt it difficult to treat this apparently honorable, bright and talented man as an enemy.

To think that this chap was so formidable, feigning closeness as family and brothers to attack the heart of this forsaken and homeless man. Of course he couldn't 'disappoint' him.

As he was about to feign thankfulness, Li Yuan clapped his hands lightly and said in a crisp voice: "Brother Wan should take a bit of time to observe the situation, then think over my story. Ai! Li Yuan is not afraid of having deep conversations with relative strangers because of righteous indignation for my Great Chu's future, nothing else."

Following his clapping, four well proportioned beauties wearing the Chu dress and veiled caps came from a side door with dancing steps. As they arrived in front of the two men, they knelt, paid their respects and with a graceful subservient posture, sat down within arm's reach of the two men.

The veils covering their faces caused them to be even more enchanting.

Only now does Xiang Shaolong realize that without Yanran, people will have an excellent way to bribe him.

He could't help having a cold sweat wondering what would have happened if he hadn't obtained Ji Yanran. It is all thanks to the fact that Li Yuan only knows the poems and songs of Chu but does not know any aphorisms like 'absolute power corrupts absolutely' nor any 'sweet honeyed stories'.

Li Yuan said: "When we seal friendships, if its not with beautiful women then its with gold. These four women come from different lands, each having windy passions, each being one out of a thousand women, and each being virgins who have never tasted sexual intercourse. Brother can take their veils off one by one, see which is the most pleasing to the eye and take that one as my meeting gift." Xiang Shaolong exclaimed in his heart 'formidable!', Li Yuan could be the most adept at psychological tactics amongst the people he had met.

With the opportunity to remove the veils of all the women and to select one, his curiosity was piqued and he felt the high level arousal of violating other people's private areas.

Even though he had no intention of accepting the beauties, he still felt a strong impulse to unmask the women for a look.

Of course he couldn't do this.

With a sinking countenance, he said: "I appreciate Imperial Uncle's kindness, but I, Wan Ruiguang, do not care for anything other than reclaiming my country."

On hearing this, Li Yuan was not angry but was pleased instead. Laughing out loud and chasing away the four women, he said: "Don't know if Brother Wan knew that the certain Li was deliberately testing you, seeing if Brother Wan would be distracted with sex. Since it is this way, I am even more relieved."

He clapped his hands again, and the pretty maid servant brought fine wine and food. Both men took a small swallow from the small wine cups and started talking freely.

Li Yuan spoke rapidly, continuously asking after the situation in Dian, expressing great concern. Thankfully Li Yuan was even more ignorant of Dian affairs than he was, and whenever Xiang Shaolong was unable to answer, he casually fabricated some exotic custom to bamboozle Li Yuan. Li Yuan also could not find any gaps in his story. In those days when he was undergoing military training, he had gone to many parts of China. Hence he recognized their terrain and culture, and could give a passable discourse.

As they were halfway through the meal, a sentry reported that the Empress Dowager had arrived.

Xiang Shaolong had a fright and was about to retreat when Li Yuan calmly and unhurriedly instructed his men to remove the food and wine, and then led him behind a screen and said: "Brother Wan can hide here. When you hear me ask about helping you reclaim your country, you will know who is getting in the way."

Xiang Shaolong asked in a low voice: "What if I am discovered by the Empress Dowager?" Li Yuan slapped his chest in guarantee and said: "When younger sister and I speak, there is never anyone else around. If there is any issue, I will bear all responsibility. I won't let Brother Wan suffer any grievance. But remember to just keep quiet and listen, do not look."

The last time as Dong Horse Fanatic, he had to play a vulgar hero. This time Wan Ruiguang has been seen as a brave and selfless hero by Li Yuan. Xiang Shaolong could only pretend to foolishly and blankly accept this absurd arrangement. With the jingle of girdle ornaments, the incomparably delicate and graceful woman who had mesmerized King Xiaolie arrived.

With the sound of closing doors, he heard the footsteps of the imperial guards retreating outside the door.

As Xiang Shaolong recalled Lord Longyang and Madam Zhuang's description of Li Yanyan, how could he abide by Li Yuan's instructions? He placed his eye on the screen aperture, looking towards the center of the hall.

His one look took his breath away.

He could not believe that he would see a person whose beauty and demeanor were both comparable to Ji Yanran and Qin Qing.

To be honest, she was still half a step below Ji Yanran in terms of charm and beauty, and falls short of Qin Qing's grandeur and elegance. Nonetheless she has a whiff of that 'seep into the bones' kind of universally moving, frail and feeble look that causes all who meet her to sympathize with her. At this moment, she prettily stood at the center of the hall with a lightly crinkled brow. As long as one is a man, one will have a strong urge to rise up and embrace her in sympathetic and tender love. She is the kind of person that will cause honorable men to desire to pull her to a couch in search of happiness but not be able to bear adding to her the little more injury; the kind of woman who will overturn nations.

Madam Zhuang was right. Her refined and elegant-as-jade appearance was shrouded by an insipid wisp of indescribable sorrow, appearing as if there is nothing left in this world that can cause her to regain her happiness. Li Yanyan's head sported a cloud bun. Even her fringe was made like a cloud, placed on top of her long delicate eyebrows which reached her temples, really fitting the description 'cloud bun thick obvious fragrance dense eyebrow dye'. (I think this is some kind of classic look)

The hair on her temples are loosely combed in a curvy style, thin and translucent, and dimly discernible like cicadas' wings. This further emphasized her consummately beautiful almond-shaped face and her sorrowfully beautiful eyes.

Slim and graceful, with a delicate body in balance. Coupled with a phoenix crown and an emerald dress, this gave her a larger than life, hard to surmount, aloof and remote, immortal beauty.

She was adorned with all manner of ornaments, but the most eye catching piece was the necklace hanging from her powdered neck and sitting on her silky bosom. The upper tier was made from twenty plus jewel embedded gold beads while the lower tier held a piece of dew-drop shaped jade as the anchoring ornament, reflecting the sparkle from the jewel encrusted phoenix crown on her head, sparkling and translucent, dazzling and brilliant, but not at all diminishing her delicate and refined essence that transcended all riches and honor.

Xiang Shaolong couldn't help feeling shocked at her beauty.

If she was willing to mount the couch with him, Xiang Shaolong would be sure to do it immediately.

At this moment, Li Yuan came behind her and gently helped her remove her outer robe, exposing her gold-lined black long dress decorated with delicate phoenix motif embroidery. Her waist was bound with a jade belt, displaying a grand and magnificent attitude.

As Li Yuan's fingers touched her fragrant shoulders, this so-named Empress Dowager's delicate body shuddered visibly, and she even lowered her gaze with a very strange expression.

Xiang Shaolong's heart jolted, thinking that the two of them are not brothers and sisters, but also realizing that if this was the case, how could they have fooled Lord Chunshen?

Even if one wanted to, it was not possible to pass oneself off as someone of Li Yanyan's nationally renown class of beauty.

As Li Yanyan's plump and smooth sexy lips trembled lightly, she said: "Why is Elder Brother here? I made an appointment with Xiu'er to come see the latest embroidery!"

With a sweet and clear voice that carried a jingling and magnetic tone, heaven has truly been kind to her.

As Xiang Shaolong has gone through these many years of setbacks and calamities, he can actually meet outstanding beauties like Madam Zhuang and Yingying and remain calm and show no interest like an old meditating monk. But this time as he is stealing a look at Li Yanyan, he knows he is about to lose his battle.

At the same time, he had a vague thought that perhaps Li Yuan wanted to obtain Ji Yanran simply because the Talented Lady Ji was the only one who could take Li Yanyan's place in his heart.

Could it be that the two brothers and sisters have an unmentionable relationship?

It was a given in this era that a husband has many wives.

When women are married to men of status and rank, some of their older and younger sisters and even nieces will follow to the groom's house as concubines, not to mention maid-servants as part of the dowry.

Even more discriminating, when a monarch marries off a daughter, lords of the same clan or even close friends will send some of their women over as gifts to be concubines.

Besides this, the aristocracy and ministers may bring any woman they fancy into the palace. It is obvious that they will have many concubines.

Families with many wives are chaotic, with fratricidal fighting and confusion over precedence happening easily.

It is very likely that Li Yuan and Li Yanyan have the same father but different mothers. A talented man matches a beautiful woman, not to mention that Li Yuan is a wolf with a savage heart, desiring to use Li Yanyan to emulate Lu Buwei's devious plot. He even caused Lord Chunshen to think that he is old but still vigorous in mind and body, giving rise to a son in his old age, then switching her to marrying King Xiaolie this other muddle-head. One can imagine how once King Xiaolie met Li Yanyan, he forgot even his father's surname and given name. How would he know that the 'miracle' in her body is actually concocted by Li Yuan? If Xiang Shaolong had not found out about the relationships between Li Yuan, Li Yanyan, Lord Chunshen and King Xiaolie from Zhao Mu, and also understood Li Yuan's unscrupulous character, he would never have been able to arrive at this shocking deduction with just this one act between two people and their momentary expressions.

As he thought about how Li Yuan would rather have killed him than let him have the opportunity to see the two of them alone, Xiang Shaolong's breath quickened unconsciously.

As Li Yuan ushered Li Yanyan to a seat, he gently said: "Xiu'er is presently embroidering in the East wing. It is rare for us to have a chance to talk, let elder brother and Yanyan exchange a few words, ok?" With these words, Xiang Shalolong knew that even thought it appeared that Li Yuan had run into Li Yanyan by accident, it was actually arranged deliberately to allow himself to listen in on some conversation that is slanderous to Lord Chunshen, to seal himself as the tool to assassinate Lord Chunshen.

This is because Li Yuan should have known Li Yanyan would have come after lunch to see Guo Xiu'er's embroidery. This perverse and sleep depriving relationship must have been difficult to bear, that is why this most powerful person in Chu condescends to come here. It could be seen that her relationship with Guo Xiu'er is very good.

Li Yanyan sighed and said: "Speak!" Li Yuan pretended to tremble in fear in front of this sister of his, gave a dry cough, cleared his throat and said: "I wish to discuss the matter of the Dian Princess mother and son's request for troops to help them reclaim their country."

Li Yanyan coldly said: "Elder brother must have fallen for the chaste Princess."

Li Yuan, knowing that "Wan Ruiguang" was listening, became uneasy and unhappily said: "How can Yanyan look upon Elder Brother this way? I am but thinking on behalf of Great Chu. The late king has just passed away, if we remain unmoved by the Dian Princess mother and son's request, it could provoke the other vassal states' desire to secede. If they lean towards Qin, Chu will be in danger!"

Xiang Shaolong had a good laugh, Li Yuan was giving such a fervent speech, he is really going through a lot of trouble on his behalf.

Li Yanyan was silent for a while, and laughed dully saying: "This is not something for you or I to decide. We must consult the generals and ministers, if not there will be controversy. Has elder brother raised this with Lord Chunshen?" Once King Xiaolie passed away, Lord Chunshen immediately became the person in the Chu court with the most decisive role in both military and civil matters. It was also because of this, that Madam Zhuang toiled to rush to Shouchun to plead for Lord Chunshen's benevolent assistance. How could she know that Lod Chunshen is the one in the background trying to eliminate the mother and son?

Li Yuan played the savior, and said in an upright and unafraid manner: "Of course I have, but Lord Chunshen is adamant and determined to use Li Ling to control the vassal state. Madam Zhuang aside, he is also looking to eliminate the rest of her party. Ai! If Li Ling becomes dominant, do you think that he will follow the King's orders? That is why Elder Brother has to raise this issue with the Empress Dowager."

This is the first time he has addressed Li Yanyan as Empress Dowager.

The Xiang Shaolong who was peeking in rapt attention secretly exclaimed 'formidable!', no matter whether this speech is real or fake, when Li Yuan delivered it to the Chu Empress Dowager, even the false turned real. If he was the real Wan Ruiguang, he would definitely had believed without a doubt, dying with the horizontal stroke, following Li Yuan's orders to fight his fight.

Li Yanyan muttered irresolutely to herself for a while, then unhurriedly said: "I requested for Elder Brother to invite the Dian Princess mother and son to the palace for a few days. How is that coming along? If they come here, then nobody will be able to harm them. Ai! The widow and the fatherless child leads one to pity."

Xiang Shaolong was moved in his heart, and as he listened to Li Yuan explaining Madam Zhuang mother and son's reason for declining, mused that Li Yanyan's intention was actually so good. Looks like all her past actions have been forced out by the Li Clan which is headed by Li Yuan, no wonder she is so unhappy.

As he was still in perplexed thought, he heard Li Yanyan's gentle voice saying: "Elder Brother, you must go see the Dian Princess immediately. No matter what you do you, you must get the mother and son to come into the palace together with all her people. By no means must we allow them to come to harm. Zhuang Jiao has made matchless contributions to our Great Chu. With their past loyalty, no matter what we must show them a little sympathy!" Li Yuan secretly celebrated for having achieved his goals, and only after getting up did he realize that Li Yanyan had no intention of getting up. He was puzzled and asked: "Isn't Yanyan going to meet Xiu'er?" Li Yanyan dully replied: "I would like to sit here alone to contemplate some issues, nobody is to disturb me."

Li Yuan couldn't help turning his head and glancing at the screen, scaring Xiang Shaolong into withdrawing his head quickly.

Li Yanyan was displeased and said: "Why is Elder Brother hesitating?" The next sound was of the opening and closing of the doors. One could imagine how frightened and distressed the Li Yuan was as he was compelled to leave.

Xiang Shaolong was also suffering. If this beautiful woman wants to sit for half a day, he would have to be cooped up there for the same period of time. Li Yanyan's voice sounded out: "No matter who you are, come out for me immediately!"

Once Xiang Shaolong heard this, he was instantly soaked in sweat. If he is beheaded by Li Yanyan just like that, it would certainly be most pointless.

[littleli]

Li yanyan will definitely fall for xiang shaolong...

Thanks very much yeongwee.

[SkyWalker]

Thanks for the another great update yeongwee!

Is there any doubt that Li Yanyan will fall madly in love with XSL? He'll conquer yet another great beauty!

[tweety365]

I don't think there is any woman that doesn't have the hots for XSL in this story, which hardly makes sense. But this is fictional, so I try my best to overlook the flaws.

[crydee]

Thanks for the update and hardwork yeongwee. You and Justin make a good combo!! We appreciate it.

btw
Quote: " This further emphasized her consummately beautiful talon-shaped face (I'm sure none of us can understand this)"

I think this word meant if you look at the beauty side way(not face to face)her face is "talon shape..."

[yeongwee]

Thanks for the update and hardwork yeongwee. You and Justin make a good combo!! We appreciate it.

btw
Quote: " This further emphasized her consummately beautiful talon-shaped face (I'm sure none of us can understand this)"

I think this word meant if you look at the beauty side way(not face to face)her face is "talon shape..."

That makes sense =) Still I can't help feeling that if I'm a woman, the last thing I want to be associated with is a talon It just sounds too ferocious!

[Jean]

That makes sense =) Still I can't help feeling that if I'm a woman, the last thing I want to be associated with is a talon It just sounds too ferocious!

Does the chinese word say 爪 or 瓜? I suspect it's the latter. 爪 (zhua3) means claw/ talon while 瓜 means melon, and 瓜子脸 is usually meant to describe the face shape of pretty ladies. 瓜子 is melon seeds, so the shape of the face is oval with a sharp chin.

However a better word to use might be almond shaped face, since it sounds nicer than the direct translation of melon seed face.

[yeongwee]

Does the chinese word say 爪 or 瓜? I suspect it's the latter. 爪 (zhua3) means claw/ talon while 瓜 means melon, and 瓜子脸 is usually meant to describe the face shape of pretty ladies. 瓜子 is melon seeds, so the shape of the face is oval with a sharp chin.

However a better word to use might be almond shaped face, since it sounds nicer than the direct translation of melon seed face.

Talented Lady Jean! You are right! Yes yes melon shaped faces. Now that you mention it I do know this expression, just couldn't make the connection. Ha ha, now you know how little Chinese I use on a day to day basis =)

The script that I used had it as 爪 but we all know that they are all full of mistakes due to the OCR. I can just imagine how this mistake could have occurred.

[efflix]

love following this thread - now i am learning chinese too! thanks jean and yeongwee for helping me learn a new phrase too

[yeongwee]

Have another query. I've been seeing a lot of the term 爷 (Ye2), which literally means grandpa. But in this context its used as an honorific denoting one's benefactor or patron. So Wan Ruiguang calls Li Yuan 太国舅爷 for Imperial Uncle Ye2. Just wondering whats a good English equivalent. I was thinking of Lord, but that has already been used for 君 as in 春申君 for Lord Chunshen. All suggestions welcome

[xlandhenry]

Have another query. I've been seeing a lot of the term 爷 (Ye2), which literally means grandpa. But in this context its used as an honorific denoting one's benefactor or patron. So Wan Ruiguang calls Li Yuan 太国舅爷 for Imperial Uncle Ye2. Just wondering whats a good English equivalent. I was thinking of Lord, but that has already been used for 君 as in 春申君 for Lord Chunshen. All suggestions welcome

The 爷 here doesn't have a very clear meaning, it is often used after the title of government officer or some gods to show the humbleness of the speaker and respection to the listener. You may use "master" if you really want to translate it word for word, but I think Imperial Uncle is already an awkward title, so maybe there's no need to add to that.

Some example of the use of 爷: 阎王爷 老天爷 官爷 etc.

And btw, the word 哀家 is used when a queen or empress dowager is refering herself, just the same as a king calls himself 寡人 or 朕.

[Jean]

国舅 is actually the brother of the dowager/ empress, and would be the uncle/ brother-in-law of the emperor.

so I assume 太国舅 would then be the Granduncle of the emperor, and ye would be more of a term of respect? There's not really an english equivalent in terms of title that I know of, but maybe the closest would be Imperial Granduncle.