Why didn't Yeung Gor kill the Golden Wheel Monk at Chung Yeung Temple?

[Ken Cheng]

It's been a long time since I've done a Yeung Gor-bashing thread.

OK, maybe not Yeung Gor-bashing, exactly, but criticizing one particular choice of his.

When Yeung Gor confronted the Golden Wheel Monk and the Cheun Jen 6 Disciples at Chung Yeung Temple, he was prepared to slaughter whomever it was that had critically injured Little Dragon Girl. OK. Fine. That's understandable. No problem there.

But here's what gets me.

Yeung Gor was prepared to kill the Golden Wheel Monk (who was at his mercy after being injured by Little Dragon Girl's jade bee needles), but as soon as Little Dragon Girl told Yeung Gor that it hadn't been the Golden Wheel Monk who had injured her, but the Cheun Jen 6 Disciples, Yeung Gor let the monk go.

Uh, WTF?!

OK, sure...the Golden Wheel Monk wasn't the one who injured Little Dragon Girl. The monk was still the one, however, who had threatened Yeung Gor's life on numerous previous occassions...who'd threatened the lives of the Gwok family, Yeung Gor's fellow martial artists (including quite a few friends such as Chu Tze Lau and Lo Yau Gerk)...and who was menacing the people of Seung Yeung. Here was a chance to kill the monk..and he passed it by because the monk wasn't the one who had injured Little Dragon Girl on that occassion?

That's like saying:

"ARRRGGH! You injured my Goo Goo! I'm going to kill you, you evil monk!"

but then,

"Oh, wait a minute...you didn't injure my Goo Goo? That's OK then. Sure, you tried to kill me and Uncle Gwok and his family before, threatened my friends, and menaced the people of Seung Yeung, BUT ALL THAT IS OK AS LONG AS YOU DIDN'T HURT MY GOO GOO! You can go now. No hard feelings."

WTF?

Yeung Gor is not a bad person, really, but for a hero, his sense of priorities can be awfully screwed up sometimes.

[Felix]

Yeung Gor was prepared to kill the Golden Wheel Monk (who was at his mercy after being injured by Little Dragon Girl's jade bee needles), but as soon as Little Dragon Girl told Yeung Gor that it hadn't been the Golden Wheel Monk who had injured her, but the Cheun Jen 6 Disciples, Yeung Gor let the monk go.

Based on the ROCH83 adaptation, I always thought it was a cheap shot on Little Dragon Girl's part with the needle thing.

Perhaps Yeung Gor let GWM go on that.

[Ken Cheng]

Based on the ROCH83 adaptation, I always thought it was a cheap shot on Little Dragon Girl's part with the needle thing.

Technically, it was, but desperate times call for desperate measures. I might blame Little Dragon Girl for a dozen other things, but I don't blame her for that...especially when the Golden Wheel Monk is known as a bit of a cheap shot artist himself.

I think Yeung Gor might have relented only because Dat Yee Ba, with whom he had been friendly, begged for the Golden Wheel Monk's life. If I were in Yeung Gor's position, however, I don't think I would have passed on the chance to finish off the monk then and there (for everything he had done up to that point and everything he likely would do if he survived to fight another day). It would have been a bit of a cheap shot, yeah, because the monk had already been injured by the jade bee needle, but I could have forgiven Yeung Gor for that one.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Combination of cheap shot + Da Er Ba begging for his master's life. After seeing how Huo Du just ran away like a coward, and how Da Er Ba was single-handedly trying to resist the weight of his heavy iron sword even though it was killing him, YG was moved.

Remember, at this point in time, he thought that it was most likely that him and XLN were both going to die. People behave differently at the precipice of death.

Who would have thought that Huo Du didn’t plan to save his master but only to seek his own retreat? He called out: “Shi Ge [Apprentice Brother], little brother will go back to Tibet and diligently practice martial skills. After ten years I will certainly look for this Yang boy and avenge you and master!” As he said that, he turned around and leapt away as if flying.

Da’erba was duped by his apprentice brother; he was unable to control his anger. He also remembered that Yang Guo was his reincarnated big apprentice brother, how could he heartlessly wrong their master like this? He loudly said: “Da Shi Ge [Big Apprentice Brother], please spare little brother’s life. Wait for me to save the master and search for that scum [heart of a wolf & lung of a dog] of a disciple so I could break him into ten thousand pieces. After that I’ll voluntarily throw my life into Da Shi Ge [Big Apprentice Brother]’s hand. At that time you’ll kill me or cut me, little brother won’t even dare to frown.”

Yang Guo listened to him mumbling a long speech, he naturally didn’t understand. However, Huo Du narrowly escaped death but this person was loyal and did right by his master. He actually understood. Yang Guo saw that his expression was earnest and respected him as a true man who was not too smart. He also saw Xiao Longnu’s tender eyes gazing at him. Suddenly his thought to kill and take revenge was dissipated, only feeling that it didn’t matter if all the lifetime grudges were not resolved. He immediately lifted his black iron sword and said: “You are released!”

Go read the translations, Ken. I explained why you should, in the other thread (the paratroopin' Samarkand thread).

[PJ]

Ren Wo Xing is correct.

There are other instances where people let other people go out of pity. For example at the end of ROCH, the Greats let the thieves of 9 Yang Shen Gong off the hook (they never found out from the thieves where the manual was), partly because they thought the thieves-gorilla relationship was touching!

[Ken Cheng]

Ren Wo Xing is correct.

There are other instances where people let other people go out of pity. For example at the end of ROCH, the Greats let the thieves of 9 Yang Shen Gong off the hook, partly because they had a touching relationship with the pet gorilla!

Did they really let these guys off the hook, however? Maybe they didn't personally kill Siu Seung Tze and Wan Hak Sai, but Yeung Gor did teach young Cheung Gwun Bo (the future Cheung 3 Fung) the moves necessary to mortally wound them.

[Ken Cheng]

But what I'm still driving at is the fact that as long as the Golden Wheel Monk hadn't injured Little Dragon Girl, Yeung Gor was willing to forgive everything else the monk had done. Had things gone differently, and Little Dragon Girl had told Yeung Gor that the monk had been the one who injured her, don't you think Yeung Gor would have lopped off the monk's head with the Heavy Iron Sword, Dat Yee Ba begging or not begging?

It just bugs me that Yeung Gor was willing to forgive everything else the monk had done as long as it did not pertain to Little Dragon Girl. The message therein on Yeung Gor's part is "The rest of you people don't matter to me; only my Goo Goo does."

Which has *always* been my biggest sticking point with the guy.

[PJ]

Did they really let these guys off the hook, however? Maybe they didn't personally kill Siu Seung Tze and Lui Mor Singh, but Yeung Gor did teach young Cheung Gwun Bo (the future Cheung 3 Fung) the moves necessary to mortally wound them.

In fact, they were easily let off the hook. Yin Kexi received no real injury (Zhang Junbao was too young to do any damage), while Xiao Xiangzi got injured because he tried to attack Jueyuan and got bounced back. At the same time, the gorilla was being chased by the condor. Everyone thought it was a pitiful scene, so they just let the thieves go without getting the manual.

The way that Xiao and Yin walked off with the gorilla, is very similar to the way that Golden Wheel Monk walked off with Daerba. Both scenes evoked pity and people just didn't want to pursue further action.

[Ken Cheng]

At the same time, the gorilla was being chased by the condor. Everyone thought it was a pitiful scene, so they just let the thieves go without getting the manual.

Is that scene as comical as it sounds? Oh, how I wish one of the adaptations would actually depict that scene...actors in cheap gorilla and condor suits included!

[JamesG]

But what I'm still driving at is the fact that as long as the Golden Wheel Monk hadn't injured Little Dragon Girl, Yeung Gor was willing to forgive everything else the monk had done. Had things gone differently, and Little Dragon Girl had told Yeung Gor that the monk had been the one who injured her, don't you think Yeung Gor would have lopped off the monk's head with the Heavy Iron Sword, Dat Yee Ba begging or not begging?

It just bugs me that Yeung Gor was willing to forgive everything else the monk had done as long as it did not pertain to Little Dragon Girl. The message therein on Yeung Gor's part is "The rest of you people don't matter to me; only my Goo Goo does."

Which has *always* been my biggest sticking point with the guy.

You really should be saying: 'Curse you Jin Yong for writing it that way!'

[PJ]

But what I'm still driving at is the fact that as long as the Golden Wheel Monk hadn't injured Little Dragon Girl, Yeung Gor was willing to forgive everything else the monk had done. Had things gone differently, and Little Dragon Girl had told Yeung Gor that the monk had been the one who injured her, don't you think Yeung Gor would have lopped off the monk's head with the Heavy Iron Sword, Dat Yee Ba begging or not begging?

If GWM had actually injured Xiao Longnu, I don't know whether Yang Guo would have forgiven him if Daerba begged. But I do know this: In DGSD, Xiao Feng was comitted to killing whoever caused his father's death, and he didn't know if he would spare Duan Zhengchun even if Ah Zhu begged him not to kill her father. So, I reckon it's just human nature to avenge.

Hey, we're back to usual business with character bashing, just like it's always been prior to the recent slowdown. Is this a sign that wuxia discussions are about to come back in style?

[Ken Cheng]

If GWM had actually injured Xiao Longnu, I don't know whether Yang Guo would have forgiven him if Daerba begged. But I do know this: In DGSD, Xiao Feng was comitted to killing whoever caused his father's death, and he didn't know if he would spare Duan Zhengchun even if Ah Zhu begged him not to kill her father. So, I reckon it's just human nature to avenge.

Hey, we're back to usual business with character bashing, just like it's always been prior to the recent slowdown. Is this a sign that wuxia discussions are about to come back in style?

I hope so. The last few months here have been dull.

I'm not faulting Yeung Gor for his desire to avenge. Heck, if somebody had injured my hypothetical fiancee, I'd probably be nursing a few vengeful ideas myself. My problem is with Yeung Gor's *selective* urge to avenge. It's not as if Little Dragon Girl was the only person that Yeung Gor was close to whom the monk had threatened. Just a few weeks earlier, the monk had nearly killed the Gwok family, among other people whom Yeung Gor would call friends. Where was Yeung Gor's outrage then?

[Ren Wo Xing]

I hope so. The last few months here have been dull.

I'm not faulting Yeung Gor for his desire to avenge. Heck, if somebody had injured my hypothetical fiancee, I'd probably be nursing a few vengeful ideas myself. My problem is with Yeung Gor's *selective* urge to avenge. It's not as if Little Dragon Girl was the only person that Yeung Gor was close to whom the monk had threatened. Just a few weeks earlier, the monk had nearly killed the Gwok family, among other people whom Yeung Gor would call friends. Where was Yeung Gor's outrage then?

Ken, I mean this in the nicest possible way, but did you read the translation I'm posted? XLN never even spoke during his battle with JLFW, much less convince YG not to harm him because JLFW didn't harm her (especially since JLFW DID hurt her as well; she was sliced in the front by his wheels, and took a palm in the back by the Quanzhen elders). There is no such thing as a Yang Guo's 'selective urge to avenge'. It really completely does not apply here. Sounds like more misinformation from TVB.

http://wuxiapedia.com/novels/jin_yon...k_3/chapter_26

At this juncture, Fawang’s golden wheel had sliced her head-on; Quanzhen Five Master’s “Seven Star Rally” pummeled her in the back. The attack was supposed to keep Nimoxing at bay, but the Indian short man had already suffered the bitter taste of the pile driver. So he had no second thoughts of matching it and evaded to the left. The attack was alternatively expended upon Xiao Longnu’s garment.

http://wuxiapedia.com/novels/jin_yon...k_3/chapter_27

[pannonian]

I hope so. The last few months here have been dull.

I'm not faulting Yeung Gor for his desire to avenge. Heck, if somebody had injured my hypothetical fiancee, I'd probably be nursing a few vengeful ideas myself. My problem is with Yeung Gor's *selective* urge to avenge. It's not as if Little Dragon Girl was the only person that Yeung Gor was close to whom the monk had threatened. Just a few weeks earlier, the monk had nearly killed the Gwok family, among other people whom Yeung Gor would call friends. Where was Yeung Gor's outrage then?

YG always tended towards forgiveness whenever given the slightest reason to, except for cases relating to XLN. His dad's death was slightly different, in that he'd been mulling over for years, but he was willing to drop even that on reflecting that GJ was probably better to him than any father could be (shades of Yang Kang and Wanyan Honglie). He forgave GF on a whim, and he cared little else either about whatever anyone did to him. It probably comes from XLN's teachings, since she was a very forgiving person (especially for wuxia). When XLN was around, or if XLN added her plea, he was willing to forgive just about anything.

[Ken Cheng]

Ken, I mean this in the nicest possible way, but did you read the translation I'm posted? XLN never even spoke during his battle with JLFW, much less convince YG not to harm him because JLFW didn't harm her (especially since JLFW DID hurt her as well; she was sliced in the front by his wheels, and took a palm in the back by the Quanzhen elders). There is no such thing as a Yang Guo's 'selective urge to avenge'. It really completely does not apply here. Sounds like more misinformation from TVB.

http://wuxiapedia.com/novels/jin_yon...k_3/chapter_26



http://wuxiapedia.com/novels/jin_yon...k_3/chapter_27

Here's how it went in ROCH '83:

Yeung Gor arrived not knowing who had injured Little Dragon Girl, only that she had been gravely wounded and that the only people powerful enough to inflict that particular kind of injury on her were the Golden Wheel Monk and the Cheun Jen 6 Disciples. At first, his wrath was directed towards them both, as he didn't know which had injured Little Dragon Girl. After the Mongol mercenaries attacked Yeung Gor, however, he focused his wrath on them, momentarily ignoring the Cheun Jen Sect Taoists. He was just about to finish off the Golden Wheel Monk when Little Dragon Girl told him, "No...it wasn't him." At that point, Yeung Gor spared the Golden Wheel Monk and refocused his wrath on the Cheun Jen Sect Taoists.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Freakin' TVB. I think the reason you dislike YG so much is because of its stupid portrayal of him all throughout

[Ken Cheng]

Freakin' TVB. I think the reason you dislike YG so much is because of its stupid portrayal of him all throughout

Based on TVB's depiction of him, wouldn't *you* dislike him too?

I mean, Andy Lau is one of the nicest, most likeable people in the Asian entertainment industry, but not even he could make the character palatable to me as written in the script.

[PJ]

My problem is with Yeung Gor's *selective* urge to avenge. It's not as if Little Dragon Girl was the only person that Yeung Gor was close to whom the monk had threatened. Just a few weeks earlier, the monk had nearly killed the Gwok family, among other people whom Yeung Gor would call friends. Where was Yeung Gor's outrage then?

I think you have the wrong information again.

but as soon as Little Dragon Girl told Yeung Gor that it hadn't been the Golden Wheel Monk who had injured her

Didn't happen in the book. In the book, Yang Guo saw who injured Xiao Longnu. It was the combination of Golden Wheel Monk + Five Masters of Quanzhen.

In that event, Yang Guo's priority was not to avenge. He just wanted to LEAVE IMMEDIATELY with Xiao Longnu. He would rather not deal with any of these other people any more.

However, people would not let them go. People continued to pick fights with Yang Guo.

It's not true that Yang Guo spared GWM due to GWM not associating with Xiao Longnu. It was Yang Guo who challenged GWM to a duel, based on their past grudges.

At the moment when he had the GWM under his mercy, Yang Guo looked at Xiao Longnu, and his desire to avenge immediately vanished. Again, he just wanted to be with her and nothing more. This, coupled with his admiration for Daerba's loyalty, caused him to dismiss GWM.

In summary: Yang Guo just wanted to be with his loved one; he did not want to fight anyone, but people threw themselves at him; in the end, he didn't kill anyone who tried to hurt him.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Based on TVB's depiction of him, wouldn't *you* dislike him too?

I mean, Andy Lau is one of the nicest, most likeable people in the Asian entertainment industry, but not even he could make the character palatable to me as written in the script.

Never watched the TVB stuff

PJ, beat you to it

[PJ]

Freakin' TVB. I think the reason you dislike YG so much is because of its stupid portrayal of him all throughout

Indeed.

The real Yang Guo, as written in the novel, is a decent and likable guy.