LOCH 82, is it really all that?

[Ian Liew]

As an overall serial, I preferred the 94 version to the 82 version, although on individual performances, Tsang Kong, Yeung Chak Lam, Lau Siu Ming and Chun Wong far far outshone Lok Ying Kwan (looked way too camp, and needed a beard or something), Chu Tit Woh (he was good, but seemed a bit too comical and didn't have Yeung's ultimate evil villain feel to him), Newton Lai (he was a good actor, but didn't have that regal feel which Yideng required - and Lau Siu Ming had it) and that horrid horrid Wayne Lai.

Mu Nianci in the 94 version was rather bad as well, although I didn't find Gallen that bad (of course, Miu Kiu Wai was much better). Huang Rong was quite decisive for me, though. Maybe because I watched Athena as a hot-blooded male in his early 20s, and Barbara while I was in primary school, but my dream Huang Rong will always be Athena. I'm happy with both Guo Jings, and Felix Wong remains, to this day, one of my favourite actors ever.

Music-wise, LOCH 94 can't even hope to smell the dust of LOCH 82, for sure. LOCH 82 has a lot of things which remain firmly in my memory - Mei Chaofeng's laugh, the Dragon Palms CGI, my hero Austin Wai in a much expanded role, Roman Tam and Jennifer Yen's repertoire of wonderful songs, Kenneth Tsang's cool character and those Mongolian war scenes which were destined to be recycled a million time during the 80s. I also have to say that I can't remember any particularly memorable scenes in LOCH 94 (other than the scene where Guo Xiaotian dies).

Despite all the individual good things about LOCH 82, it's held together by a draggy plot filled with unnecessary filler subplots created purely to allow us starstruck 80s fans to see more of our favourite actors and actresses. Storylines were twisted - I still don't see the point of Huang Yaoshi trying to revive his wife and all that - while the extra long scenes of nothing but just crying talking slowly and saying obvious things in reply to rhetoric questions just got to me. LOCH 82 was a wonderful piece of art for its time, but it really should remain there. It's good to watch it once in a while to remind yourself how great those actors were in their prime, and how good the music was, but it's not as watchable as LOCH 94. If I wanted to introduce a friend to LOCH, I'd take 94 anytime, but show 82 after that, in a take-the-mickey kind of way to show how corny things used to be. In 94, the story took precedence over the acting, in 82 the story was nothing more thn a platform for the actors to do their stuff. If you loved them you loved it.

[pannonian]

How do you rate 2003 in relation to 82 and 94?

[flyingfox2002]

I saw the 82 version when I was around 10, don't remember much of it except interestingly Felix Wong's odd looking teeth - probably before he had enough money to see a dentist... and the stock footage of the 18 Palms whenever GJ uses it Other than that I also remember YK - I think Mr. Miu was what made that series stick out in so many people's minds - especially females. I had to look at screencaptures to remember how the other characters looked.

Never saw the 94 version, and don't care to. I have TVBitis. Watching TVB stuff makes me wanna go postal on my TV.

I own the '03 version on VCD, I've seen it about 3 times since its release. I compared it only to novel, not to the other two series. The first time I saw it, I was disappointed in HR and YK, and the acting to me "seemed" stiff. I did love the 7 Freaks, and I warmed up to H7G after being annoyed at his debut. (Actually H7G's portrayal is quite accurate... but after the classic '82 version, I doubt many people would give the '03 actor credit... but well I am doing it here, he was excellent)

The second time I saw the '03 version, I changed my mind about HR. Her performance was certainly understated, and in places where she should sing her lines, she recited it in a really bland way. But overall I give her a 7 out of 10. Gj's portrayal was ok. Didn't quite show enough emotion. YK was simply too non-handsome looking. I dunno why the hell he was cast as YK. Acting-wise he was actually not bad at all. It's just that Zhou Jie simply could not overcome his miscast. And you can't beat the quality of production in the Mainland series. I am not one who enjoys watching 10 men armies fight or staring at fake trees and rocks or looking at the same location again and again, so I appreciated the beautiful background and the resources devoted to the '03 series.

Anyway I gave a more complete review of it before, so won't write anymore here. Overall LOCH was not as bad as some people say, but it's not close to perfection. 6.5 out of 10.

[almo89]

Music-wise, LOCH 94 can't even hope to smell the dust of LOCH 82, for sure. LOCH 82 has a lot of things which remain firmly in my memory - Mei Chaofeng's laugh, the Dragon Palms CGI

haha it's all about the dragon palms CGI. It was so cheesy that it was awesome

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ngTRCOZQ7KU

[Ken Cheng]

haha it's all about the dragon palms CGI. It was so cheesy that it was awesome

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ngTRCOZQ7KU

I've read that TVB didn't even *try* to depict the Hong Lung 18 Palms in the '94 edition, except for one infamous occassion wherein it was portrayed with dozens of hands appearing out of Gwok Jing's back, and then his arms stretching out a la Mr. Fantastic of the Fantastic Four. I've never seen the scene in question, but the description, if accurate, is enough to make me not want to.

And this, above all, makes LOCH '94 unforgivable to me: apparently, Gwok Jing DIDN'T FIGHT IN THE SECOND MT. HUA SWORD TOURNAMENT! WTF?! Gwok Jing fighting two Greats to 600 combined moves in the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament was supposed to be the payoff for the audience's having followed his long, arduous growth as a martial artist. TVB actually took that golden moment away in LOCH '94?!

That would be enough to sink the series, in my opinion.

[almo89]

I've read that TVB didn't even *try* to depict the Hong Lung 18 Palms in the '94 edition, except for one infamous occassion wherein it was portrayed with dozens of hands appearing out of Gwok Jing's back, and then his arms stretching out a la Mr. Fantastic of the Fantastic Four. I've never seen the scene in question, but the description, if accurate, is enough to make me not want to.

And this, above all, makes LOCH '94 unforgivable to me: apparently, Gwok Jing DIDN'T FIGHT IN THE SECOND MT. HUA SWORD TOURNAMENT! WTF?! Gwok Jing fighting two Greats to 600 combined moves in the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament was supposed to be the payoff for the audience's having followed his long, arduous growth as a martial artist. TVB actually took that golden moment away in LOCH '94?!

That would be enough to sink the series, in my opinion.

It's been a long time since I've seen the 94 version. I vaguely remember Mr. Fanatasic. The only memory I have of it was from the commericial bumper. It was a still shot of him sitting down with his arms stretch out to the side and a bunch of hands appear on the sides.

[Ken Cheng]

It's been a long time since I've seen the 94 version. I vaguely remember Mr. Fanatasic. The only memory I have of it was from the commericial bumper. It was a still shot of him sitting down with his arms stretch out to the side and a bunch of hands appear on the sides.

See, that concept is just FUGLY. It doesn't convey the power and grandeur of Hong Lung 18 Palms at all. It's just...*weird*. The 1982 version's CGI might be laughably primitive by today's standards, but at least it succeeded in conveying the concept that this was an awesome and powerful martial art...not some director's LSD trip.

[kidd]

I don't remember how 18 Dragon Palm was displayed in LOCH94, but I remember someone mention (I don't remember exactly who, but I'm not lying) that LOCH94's Dragon Palm is the closest to the book's description of how 18 Dragon Palm should be.

Update: Just watch the LOCH94 Dragon Palm scene. Yeah, the multiple hands and Mr.Fantastic stunts are there. So, I think the person who said LOCH 94's Dragon Palm is close to the book must be refering to the stances Guo Jing made before the thousand hands GuanYin and Mr.Fantastic stunts. Anyway, those stunts are not as bad as it sounds. It happens just for 2 seconds. You blink your eyes, it's gone already.

But, I remember very clearly the L/R hand technique. It really shows the advantage of L/R technique. It's advantage is not powerx2 but it confuses the opponent because the user uses 2 different techniques at the same time.

[cutiekhmergirl]

Thanks LuNaR for understanding and respecting my opinion
Even though I am a fan of series from the 80's, i still love series from the 90's and today series. I guess LOCH 94 isn't as bad as I made it sound like it was. I never said that I didn't like it, it's just when I'm comparing the 2 theres just that difference.

What I suddenly reliazed was that, in my opinion, the cast from the 82 version all had such superb talents. Each protrayed their character very well and their performances were equally good. Where as the 94, I thought Athena's acting was probably the strongest. I'll give thumbs up to Athena for trying. I mean it's hard taking the role of HR, knowing that you'll always be compared to Barbara. Yet, Athena still tried her best and she was pretty good. Her HR was cute, smart and cunning. If only she was a bit more bratty.

Somebody critisized WWC? LOL, I don't remember seeing anything of the sort. He's one of my favourite supporting actors from the 80's! He porrayed OYK so well!

[i_fotted]

Obviously I'm going to be a bit bias since LOCH 82 is my favorite TVB series of all time.

I don't want to go into details to why I think the 82 version is better than the 94 version or any other version that was ever made, and trust me I have seen every LOCH that has ever made. What I'd like to point out is that in the beginning of LOCH 82, it is rather boring and kind of hard to watch, which I believe is the main reason why new viewers who has already seen the 94 version would find unimpressive. They probably go in expecting to be "wowed" but they are not going to get wowed by the first few episodes. They don't realize that LOCH 82 gets progressively better and better as the series get matured and the unbelievable supporting cast begin to make their appearance.

[i_fotted]

I've read that TVB didn't even *try* to depict the Hong Lung 18 Palms in the '94 edition, except for one infamous occassion wherein it was portrayed with dozens of hands appearing out of Gwok Jing's back, and then his arms stretching out a la Mr. Fantastic of the Fantastic Four. I've never seen the scene in question, but the description, if accurate, is enough to make me not want to.

And this, above all, makes LOCH '94 unforgivable to me: apparently, Gwok Jing DIDN'T FIGHT IN THE SECOND MT. HUA SWORD TOURNAMENT! WTF?! Gwok Jing fighting two Greats to 600 combined moves in the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament was supposed to be the payoff for the audience's having followed his long, arduous growth as a martial artist. TVB actually took that golden moment away in LOCH '94?!

That would be enough to sink the series, in my opinion.

I agree totally. That battle was totally epic, how can they not include that?!!

[Eric923]

Hi guys,

I'm new to this message board but ran across this thread and just wanted to add my two cents.

I recently ordered the Taiseng dvd's of 82 LOCH, 83 ROCH, 86 HSDS, and 86 Duke of Mount Deer. They just arrived yesterday and I've been having a maration. haha

I'm a huge fan of all of Jin Yong's works and ofcourse the shows based on his stuff. I personally like LOCH 82 the best out of all the other versions. Felix Wong really did seem dumb in 82. But the actor who played gwok in the 94 version I found wasn't convincing enough.

Apart from this, the 82 version really took their time to develop the story and settings. If you watch from episode one of the 82 version. You can instantly see the script writers really understood the theme and the cultural and patriotic/national tone of what the novel was trying to say. From the opening theme song in the beginning of 82, to seeing Gwok and Yang's fathers singing Yue Fei's Poem while they're drunk on the streets, to seeing Gwok's father die while protecting the family. You can tell the 82 filmmakers really nailed the theme and feeling of the novel.

And Miu Kiu Wai I found was awesome as Yang Hong.

I personally felt the best lead actors i've seen in Jin Yong adaptations were Andy Lau in Return of the Condor (especially later on in the show), and Tony Leung and Andy Lau in Duke of Mount Deer. Just my opinion.

[tp222]

How do you rate 2003 in relation to 82 and 94?

I think the 2003 version is underrated. I definitely liked the new horses and armies scenes. They were original and added an ancient feel to it. The 7 Freaks were truly freaky, not sure if they were necessarily better than the old ones, but at least they were original. However, it's one thing to make the side characters look "ancient," it's another to make the main characters look like that also. See, if a girl or guy was averaging looking, then I don't think the audience would care how you dress them up. But the main characters, IMO, you gotta try to make them look as good as possible, since you see their face the majority of the time.

Maybe I'm just a sucker for beautiful women, but I thought the 2003 Mei ChaoFeng was great(not sure if her acting is better than the 94 one though.) The claws were definitey a nice addition. The Dugu Giubai turtle was pretty funny, and the concubines when OuYang Feng came to the island were nice, hey whatever necessary to make it original.

Its biggest disadvantage was that if someone had seen the 94 version already, then most of the scenes are pretty much spoiled(it's kind of ironic that the 83 version came first, yet its story was the most original.) They also made the mistake of making ALL of the scenes too gloomy. See, bright scenes have a natural advantage over dark(this goes for costumes as well), by making most of the scenes gloomy-looking, it's putting itself at an unnecessary disadvantage.

The 2003 acting also seemed a bit too tame. Yang Kang couldn't act evil at all, and when he tried, it seemed fake. Someone commented that the 94 Yang Kang was too evil, that's ridiculous. If he's acting evil, then he's doing a great job. After all, villains are supposed to be villains. The 03 version also took out the attempted rape scene altogether, talk about a loss of "excitement"(although to be fair, if one had seen the other two versions, the intrigue would have been gone, so one can understand why they'd skip it altogether, unless they wanted to do something like taking her outer robe off ).

IMO, if you had taken the storyline of the book, with some parts added from the 82 version(like the scenes when Huang Rong was a beggar, those were hilarious), the HR of 94, the acting of the evil guys in 94, the looks of the evil guys in 82(to satisfy the ladies), the Mei ChaoFeng of 2003, the costumes of the 82 version, the background music of 94, and the special effects(like the claws and horses) of 03, add the extra bits and pieces of 03, and you'd have my ideal LOCH(though I'm generalizing here because in truth, there are a lot of details from each series that I'd add as well, for example, like the 03 Dragon Palms effects, and maybe the Mu Nianci of 2003, but change her look so that she'd actually look as pretty as she does in some her of pics, IMO, 03 wasted its two most beautiful women by trying to make them look ancient.)

[tp222]

Obviously I'm going to be a bit bias since LOCH 82 is my favorite TVB series of all time.

I don't want to go into details to why I think the 82 version is better than the 94 version or any other version that was ever made, and trust me I have seen every LOCH that has ever made. What I'd like to point out is that in the beginning of LOCH 82, it is rather boring and kind of hard to watch, which I believe is the main reason why new viewers who has already seen the 94 version would find unimpressive. They probably go in expecting to be "wowed" but they are not going to get wowed by the first few episodes. They don't realize that LOCH 82 gets progressively better and better as the series get matured and the unbelievable supporting cast begin to make their appearance.

Well, actually, I jumped straight into episode 10, knowing that the first 8 or 9 are pretty boring(from the 94 version). I actually liked Barbara's acting as the beggar, but then after she became girl Huang Rong, it just seemed like just another series. Maybe I would have been more interested if she was better looking, or I didn't know how the story turned out.

[tp222]

I've read that TVB didn't even *try* to depict the Hong Lung 18 Palms in the '94 edition, except for one infamous occassion wherein it was portrayed with dozens of hands appearing out of Gwok Jing's back, and then his arms stretching out a la Mr. Fantastic of the Fantastic Four. I've never seen the scene in question, but the description, if accurate, is enough to make me not want to.

And this, above all, makes LOCH '94 unforgivable to me: apparently, Gwok Jing DIDN'T FIGHT IN THE SECOND MT. HUA SWORD TOURNAMENT! WTF?! Gwok Jing fighting two Greats to 600 combined moves in the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament was supposed to be the payoff for the audience's having followed his long, arduous growth as a martial artist. TVB actually took that golden moment away in LOCH '94?!

That would be enough to sink the series, in my opinion.

That's not as bad as 82's scene of Yang Kang being spanked by his mother. I'm sorry, but spanking, with Huang Rong watching? Now that was just totally uncool, and funny(in a, what year are we in kind of way.)

That's one of the reasons that I liked about 94, the actors didn't seem weak or feminine(that's probably why they couldn't expand the storyline, because in doing so, they'd probably have to do some things that make them look excessively weak). That's not to say that they should never cry, because in the scene where Guo Jing discovered his teachers' deaths, I thought he did great, and it was appropriate too. If it weren't for the fact that they copied the story from a book, it'd have been perfect with my style.

[AHMAD]

Can somebody give me the real name of the 7th teacher from LOCH 82 the one from the seven freaks teachers

[pannonian]

Can somebody give me the real name of the 7th teacher from LOCH 82 the one from the seven freaks teachers

Han Xiaoying.

[AHMAD]

Thanks for the reply

[Jirehmy]

I think it's the acting that makes the 80s so memorable.

Check out some of the prominent cast members from LOCH below. Do you remember them?

Kwok Jing - Felix Wong Yat Wah
Wong Yung - Barbara Yung Mei Ling
Yeung Hong - Miu Kiu Wai
Mok Dim Chi - Yeung Pan Pan
Yeong Tit Sum - Patrick Tse Yin
Bao Sik Yeuk - Lee Si Kei
Lee Ping (Kwok Jing's mother) - So Hang Suen
Ma Yoke - Cheung Ying Choy
Yau Chu Kei – Ha Yu
Jeet Beet - Cheung Lei
Wah Jun - Wong Chow See
Ngo Tai Hup – Kong Ngai
Genghiz Khan - Chun Pei
Yuen Ngan Hung Nit - Lau Kong
Mui Chuin Fong - Wong Mun Wai
Au Yueng Hak - Wong Yuen Chai
Hung Jut Kung - Lau Dan
Tong Cheh Wong Yuk See - Tsang Kong
Sai Tuk Au Yeong Fung - Yeung Chak Lam
Low Wan Tung - Chun Wong
Lok Kwun Ying- Wai Tin Zi
Ching Yiu Kap - Chan Sau Chu
Soh Ku - Chan Onn Ying
Kau Cheen Yan - Shek Kin
Nam Toi - Lau Siu Ming
Ying Ku - Tsang Ching Yu

[asiatique2491]

man that was such a good show. LOCH was what got me hooked on wuxia and JY's stories. But i can only watch the shows since i cant read chinese