New Xi You Ji - Journey to the West (Zhang Ji Zhong 2009/2010 version)

**bachtuyet** · 11-09-10, 09:46 PM

wonder when the 2010 version will finish, I'm always fan of this series.

**swtaznlaydee** · 11-11-10, 07:17 AM

$this->handle_bbcode_img_match('http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/5153/3ps10e02212.jpg')

**swtaznlaydee** · 11-11-10, 08:07 AM

**PrinceKrillo** · 11-11-10, 03:57 PM

In terms of production values, this has got to be the most beautifully-filmed, expensive-looking Chinese myth series ... to DATE. However, the ONLY thing that means is that Zhang Ji Zhong got a big fat check and a HUGE budget to produce this thing.

So the trailer proves that this series has very high production values ... it's got the "style" and the "flash." The ironic lack of DIALOGUE only reassures my doubts that his version will have any of the deep philosophy, wise teachings, character development, or emotional drama that this year's greatly underrated Zhejiang version has. You know, the "substance" ... the stuff that actually MATTERS.

Here's a pearl of wisdom right now:

Something can look flashy and expensive on the outside ... but if there's nothing but hollowness on the inside, then it FAILS nonetheless.

Hopefully Zhang Ji Zhong can bring it, but he needs to understand that this isn't one of his lame wuxia series that he's produced/directed in the past. If he has produced this large-scale MYTH series in the same way as his wuxia shows ... then wow, I can tell you right now that it FAILS. The wuxia genre may be all about "fighting" and "action," but that is NOT what Chinese myth is about.

Bottomline, this trailer, as eye-pleasing as it may be, only further confirms my theories that ZJZ has put ACTION (style/flash) over what is MORE important, philosophy and drama (substance/depth).

**SunnySon** · 11-11-10, 04:06 PM

Can't wait for this to come out. Looks awesome.

**swtaznlaydee** · 11-11-10, 10:57 PM

Title: 西游记 (张纪中版)

English Title: New Journey to the West

Cast: Nie Yuan (聂远) as Monk, 吴樾 as Monkey King, 臧金生 as Piggy, 徐锦江, 钱泳辰, 巍子, and way too many to name.

Episodes: 50

Broadcast Period: April 2011

I'm so excited that Ady An (安以轩) will be playing as the White Skeleton Demon! Yay! Other appearances I'm looking forward to is Liu Tao's (刘涛) Guan Yi, William Feng's (冯绍峰) Er Lang Sheng, He Zhuo Yan, Shu Chang, and so many other minor characters!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xrjc0pA-XYM
credit: lalalaiTzME

**bachtuyet** · 11-12-10, 01:10 AM

Anybody know when is this version come out? So want to watch it

**PrinceKrillo** · 11-12-10, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by swtaznlaydee

Episodes: 50

This is no longer accurate. Zhang Ji Zhong stated in a recent interview (you can find the video on YouTube) that they ended up filming 70+ episodes worth of story, 20+ episodes more than the 50 episodes that they had ORIGINALLY planned for.

That means this version will be the LONGEST 西遊記 by far and actually exceeds the Zhejiang version by twenty episodes or so.

**therainhouse** · 11-12-10, 06:41 PM

Yay for substance and style!

**bachtuyet** · 11-13-10, 04:43 PM

Anybody know when this series come out?

**swtaznlaydee** · 11-13-10, 08:22 PM

Originally Posted by bachtuyet

Anybody know when this series come out?

April 2011.

**abc123lol** · 11-14-10, 02:28 AM

Originally Posted by PrinceKrillo

In terms of production values, this has got to be the most beautifully-filmed, expensive-looking Chinese myth series ... to DATE. However, the ONLY thing that means is that Zhang Ji Zhong got a big fat check and a HUGE budget to produce this thing.

So the trailer proves that this series has very high production values ... it's got the "style" and the "flash." The ironic lack of DIALOGUE only reassures my doubts that his version will have any of the deep philosophy, wise teachings, character development, or emotional drama that this year's greatly underrated Zhejiang version has. You know, the "substance" ... the stuff that actually MATTERS.

Here's a pearl of wisdom right now:

Something can look flashy and expensive on the outside ... but if there's nothing but hollowness on the inside, then it FAILS nonetheless.

Hopefully Zhang Ji Zhong can bring it, but he needs to understand that this isn't one of his lame wuxia series that he's produced/directed in the past. If he has produced this large-scale MYTH series in the same way as his wuxia shows ... then wow, I can tell you right now that it FAILS. The wuxia genre may be all about "fighting" and "action," but that is NOT what Chinese myth is about.

Bottomline, this trailer, as eye-pleasing as it may be, only further confirms my theories that ZJZ has put ACTION (style/flash) over what is MORE important, philosophy and drama (substance/depth).

DUDE, I think you need to relax. Like seriously, chill.

I've seen your other criticizing posts about the other versions of JTW and just because they don't have the "deep philosophy, wise teachings, character development, or emotional drama" doesn't mean they can't be enjoyable. Personally, I watched the whole Zhejiang version, I can say I enjoyed it but found it dull and pretty boring at times. Some part were even a bit "jumpy" for me. You know, each to their own. Just because you don't enjoy it because you think all those DEEP and meaningful factors are missing doesn't mean it is an unsuccessful series because other people actually just enjoy the storyline, you know the actual ADVENTURE of the characters. C'mon look at all other drama series, most of them do not have all that philosophy and teachings stuff yet they are still VERY enjoyable because the PLOT itself is GOOD.

AND it is very obvious that they left out all the dialogues from the trailer on purpose. I find it very silly that you would actually be so judging of the content just because of a trailer where they purposely left the the conversations out.

One thing I do agree with you though is that if ZJZ edits this series the same way he did with all his other wuxia series then yeah, this series will FAIL, however epic it may look it is going to SUCK.

**PrinceKrillo** · 11-14-10, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by abc123lol

AND it is very obvious that they left out all the dialogues from the trailer on purpose. I find it very silly that you would actually be so judging of the content just because of a trailer where they purposely left the the conversations out.

Well, it begs the question, what is ZJZ trying to HIDE?

Take a look at the trailers of the other epic myth series. BLD Qian Zhuan, Chuan Shuo (2010), Chinese Paladin 3, etc.

Every single one of their trailers features plenty of dialogue between characters, the absence of which seems VERY odd.

Seems to me that the only reason ZJZ would want to mask the dialogue and make the entire trailer focus on the action/fighting would be because ... that's all his version even has.

However, the revelation that his series will consist of 70+ episodes instead of the originally planned 50 ... changes things quite a bit. That's a 40-50% increase in total number of episodes.

Assuming that his version does cover ALL of the storylines in the novel (whereas the Zhejiang version only covered the most important ones and the ones with teachable philosophy/meaning ... not the stupid, repetitive storylines), then those addition 20+ episodes could mean that his version actually WILL develop the storylines and the characters (not just the CORE characters, but the characters within EACH storyline in the series) just as much as the Zhejiang version did.

Development of characters/story, however, does NOT mean that the emotion or the philosophy will be there.

Originally Posted by abc123lol

I've seen your other criticizing posts about the other versions of JTW and just because they don't have the "deep philosophy, wise teachings, character development, or emotional drama" doesn't mean they can't be enjoyable. Personally, I watched the whole Zhejiang version, I can say I enjoyed it but found it dull and pretty boring at times. Some part were even a bit "jumpy" for me. You know, each to their own. Just because you don't enjoy it because you think all those DEEP and meaningful factors are missing doesn't mean it is an unsuccessful series because other people actually just enjoy the storyline, you know the actual ADVENTURE of the characters. C'mon look at all other drama series, most of them do not have all that philosophy and teachings stuff yet they are still VERY enjoyable because the PLOT itself is GOOD.

Obviously you are unaware that Wu Cheng En originally WROTE Journey to the West as a philosophical allegory. The journey of the monks to India is a metaphor for a person's own journey towards spiritual and philosophical enlightenment in life. That's the POINT of the novel. He WROTE the novel to be philosophical and filled with Taoist and Buddhist teachings at every turn.

The reason why most people nowadays aren't even aware of that is because all of the past adaptations of the series are complete and utter failures and don't even come close to grasping the idea of the novel or its philosophical concepts ... probably because the producers and the writers themselves are too inept to grasp the philosophical wisdom behind the novel.

The Zhejiang version is the ONLY version to date in which the producers were actually smart enough to realize the whole damn point of the epic story to begin with.

It's really much too early to give ZJZ that kind of benefit of the doubt and to assume that he has actually grasped the point of the novel or will produce the series to portray the philosophical wisdom that it is SUPPOSED to. Because the fact of the matter is, all past versions have done is cater to children, immature idiots, and retarded people. Lucky for them, this world is filled to brim with those.

**abc123lol** · 11-14-10, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by PrinceKrillo

Well, it begs the question, what is ZJZ trying to HIDE?

Take a look at the trailers of the other epic myth series. BLD Qian Zhuan, Chuan Shuo (2010), Chinese Paladin 3, etc.

Every single one of their trailers features plenty of dialogue between characters, the absence of which seems VERY odd.

Seems to me that the only reason ZJZ would want to mask the dialogue and make the entire trailer focus on the action/fighting would be because ... that's all his version even has.

However, the revelation that his series will consist of 70+ episodes instead of the originally planned 50 ... changes things quite a bit. That's a 40-50% increase in total number of episodes.

Assuming that his version does cover ALL of the storylines in the novel (whereas the Zhejiang version only covered the most important ones and the ones with teachable philosophy/meaning ... not the stupid, repetitive storylines), then those addition 20+ episodes could mean that his version actually WILL develop the storylines and the characters (not just the CORE characters, but the characters within EACH storyline in the series) just as much as the Zhejiang version did.

Development of characters/story, however, does NOT mean that the emotion or the philosophy will be there.

Obviously you are unaware that Wu Cheng En originally WROTE Journey to the West as a philosophical allegory. The journey of the monks to India is a metaphor for a person's own journey towards spiritual and philosophical enlightenment in life. That's the POINT of the novel. He WROTE the novel to be philosophical and filled with Taoist and Buddhist teachings at every turn.

The reason why most people nowadays aren't even aware of that is because all of the past adaptations of the series are complete and utter failures and don't even come close to grasping the idea of the novel or its philosophical concepts ... probably because the producers and the writers themselves are too inept to grasp the philosophical wisdom behind the novel.

The Zhejiang version is the ONLY version to date in which the producers were actually smart enough to realize the whole damn point of the epic story to begin with.

It's really much too early to give ZJZ that kind of benefit of the doubt and to assume that he has actually grasped the point of the novel or will produce the series to portray the philosophical wisdom that it is SUPPOSED to. Because the fact of the matter is, all past versions have done is cater to children, immature idiots, and retarded people. Lucky for them, this world is filled to brim with those.

Nope, I'm very much aware of the fact that Wu Cheng En wrote JTW as a philosophical allegory and I have actually read part of the original novel as well. I found the novel to be pretty boring and repetitive.

I was just trying to say that not everyone cares about all these deep and philosophical meanings that sometimes series or whatever tries to teach us. Therefore, it is not an important factor for some of the audiences if ZJZ actually develops all those elements in the series. Maybe ZJZ and other producers who remade JTW wanted the PLOT and the interesting story of the adventure. The DEEP meaning behind everything in the whole adventure isn't the primary concern to them if it is still enjoyable to the audience. We don't have to learn from EVERYTHING we watch. Why else do people enjoy all other drama series and movies? Tell me how many of them actually do TEACH you anything? If you don't agree with that then you are saying that more than half of the population on this earth are retarded idiots? If so then I don't have much to say more than that you are pretty ignorant and there's no further reason to debate.

Oh, and regarding the trailer, yes, I believe he left out the conversations because yes, he wanted it to look cool. BUT I don't think that means he is hiding anything.
Personally, I enjoyed all those myth series that you mentioned. Not everyone like you wants to be philosophical and always trying to learn things when they are trying to relax and enjoy a simple series/movie.

**bachtuyet** · 11-15-10, 12:29 AM

Somehow that much episodes equivalent to dragging & boring. I hope he doesn't copy other version & cut & skip around the story. Other version tend to do that a lot. Director believe the audience already watch this series zillion of time so the cut & skip the certain part of the story make it worse than it is

**PrinceKrillo** · 11-15-10, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by bachtuyet

Somehow that much episodes equivalent to dragging & boring.

Spending just one episode telling a story and then moving on to the next one is what makes them boring and pointless. The stories and the characters need to be DEVELOPED in order for anyone to actually CARE about them. This is why the 1986 version was a failure. Every single storyline was put into one episode, it was incredibly repetitive and pointless.

The Zhejiang version was MUCH smarter going about this. It spent only a short amount of time on smaller storylines, but spent 3-4 episodes developing the characters/plot in the larger storylines (Pan Si Ling, Huo Yan Shan, Nü Er Guo, etc.).

And guess what? THOSE storylines that they spent 3-4 episodes developing are the ones that people LIKE and the ones that people REMEMBER. Shocking ... isn't it.

In the Zhejiang version the audience ends up caring MORE about THOSE characters (such as Wang Li Ke's Queen of Nü Er Guo, Diana Pang's Spider Demon, Han Dong's Golden Ray Taoist, etc.) than about those stupid, bald monks. JTTW is a sausagefest to begin with, that's why the producers of the Zhejiang version were smart enough to put the focus on the FEMALE roles in the series and hired fantastic FEMALE actresses to portray them. Just for the record, all of the good storylines in the show have strong female roles or female demons. Half of the storylines with male demons are boring, repetitive, and unmemorable.

Just from the ZJZ trailer I can tell that ZJZ did NOT put the focus on the female demons, like the Zhejiang version did. What an idiot.

Bai Gu Jing, the Spider Demons, Women's Country, Xiao Er Cheng, Huo Yan Shan, Lady Earthflow, and the Jade Rabbit in India are some of best stories in the series b/c of the STRONG FEMALE prescence. There is yin to balance out the already one-sided yang of the four, ugly monks.

Really, who in the hell cares about half of the lame, ugly male demons in the series? They suck, and their storylines are crap as well. Yellow Wind Demon? Gold and Silver Kings? Yellow Brows? The Lion, the Elephant, and the Roc? The Leopard Demon? The Dog-Dragon? The Tortoise-Dragon? The three Rhinos? Saint of Nine Spirits? They all SUCK hard. Their storylines are boring, repetitive, and pointless.

So glad the Zhejiang version skipped past most of those storylines, while developing and focusing on all of the good ones. KUDOS.

If ZJZ had any brains or maturity at all (or wasn't a total sexist), his trailer would have focused on all of the WOMEN roles in the series. Focusing on the female roles brings in BOTH male and female audiences. Focusing on that idiot Sun Wu Kong fighting crazily with a bunch of ugly male demons is only interesting to children and immature morons. I didn't even see Shu Chang in the trailer at all. All I saw were a bunch of ugly, lame, male demons. FAIL.

Do you really think the Bao Lian Deng Trilogy, Chinese Paladin, Liao Zhai Zhi Yi, or Chuan Shuo (2010) would have been nearly as enjoyable without all of the FEMALE prescence? Without all of the FEMALE roles? THAT's what people (both male AND female) respond to. No one wants to watch a sausagefest of a series. Except immature idiots and little boys. Every single of one of those large-scale myth series has a LARGE female-to-male character ratio. Compared to them, JTTW is a total sausagefest. At least the Zhejiang version went the other way a bit by putting the focus on the female roles and cutting out many of the stupid male ones. ZJZ's version, on the other hand? Puh. Typical. Lame. Fail.

**bachtuyet** · 11-15-10, 03:51 PM

Zhejiang should balance the story line, focus too much on certain can lose audience attention. What he did is following the book & add in his own interpretation w/it not cut the whole things out to drag out certain story line. He shouldn't focus story on on monk, monkey & pig. He should give sandy some character as well. I have seen director do from monkey, monk & pig point of view but never sandy. It will be interesting if he add that in. The series only good as the actors & actress doing it. So hopefully 2010 version is better than some of the old one. Because Dickey version have a lot of famous actors & it turn out horrible.

**PrinceKrillo** · 11-15-10, 06:21 PM

Not to purposely go off on a tangent, but there has always been something very troubling to me regarding JTTW.

Generally speaking, in the world of Chinese Mythology, Nü Wa is hailed as the Ultimate Creator and the undisputed ruler of the Three Realms.

She holds more power and control over the universe than anyone else in EITHER the Taoist or Buddhist Pantheons, including Fo Zu (Buddha), the Jade Emperor, and the Three Pure Ones. Not even Pan Gu himself could have claimed any kind of power over her, during the Age of Creation.

Not even the unrivaled Taoist Judiciary Deity Er Lang Shen (Yang Jian) would dare to defy his grandmother Nü Wa.

And pretty much each of the large-scale myth series that have been produced have centered their epic stories around Nü Wa, as it should be. At the very least, she is hailed as one of INCREDIBLE importance and the center of everything:

1) Bao Lian Deng Trilogy: The Lotus Lantern was created from the light of the very flames that Nü Wa had used to create the mortal world as it is today. This lantern would become the most powerful artifact in the entire history of Chinese mythology and be passed down to Nü Wa's granddaughter San Sheng Mu, eons later in the Shang Dynasty, used to keep the mighty floods of Ruo Shui from destroying all life in the human world. I don't think I need to go over the role that the lantern plays in the rest of the trilogy, it is CENTRAL to the storyline. Aside from the Bao Lian Deng, Nü Wa was also responsible for setting the Mandate (Law) of Heaven from when she organized Heaven, and then later when Yang Jian wanted to bring forth the NEW Law of Heaven, it was revealed that she had left that eons ago inside Hua Shan, where San Sheng Mu had been imprisoned, and that it would emerge when the "time was right." The original series ended with this revelation that EVERYTHING was in the hands of Nü Wa's original plans for the Three Realms.

2) Feng Shen Yan Yi: Apparently Nü Wa has influenced even actual history (and not just myth & lore) as well. Towards the beginning of the novel, she decides to punish King Zhou of Shang and bring an end to his reign and to the Shang Dynasty. With a simple wave of her hands, she sets into motion all of the events that transpire during the entire story. If she hadn't made that decision, then Yuan Shi Tian Zun of the Three Pure Ones would not have had any reason to create the Feng Shen Bang and give it to his disciple Jiang Zi Ya, eventually leading to the creation of 365 gods for Heaven. He and King Wu of Zhou would never have had to wage war against Shang Zhou Wang, and subsequently warriors such as Yang Jian and Ne Zha would never have been involved. So in essence, Nü Wa was completely responsible for the fall of the Shang Dynasty, because SHE decided it would be so.

3) Chuan Shuo (2010): Well, first of all ... many of the most important characters in this series are actually Nü Wa's own children ... the Jade Emperor (Yu Di), the Yellow Emperor (Huang Di), the Demon Emperor (Mo Di), and the Hundred Flowers Fairy (Hua Shen). Since this series encompasses all of the legends and history of the Three Kingdoms & Five Emperors and Xia Dynasty time period, it also tells of Nü Wa's earliest and most well-known stories (some through flashbacks). Nü Wa is a MAJOR character in this series, even though she doesn't actually, physically appear until towards the end. She appears towards the end at a critical moment in order to stop her son Mo Di from completing his scheme of exacting revenge on his siblings and ruining the Three Realms for good. Long before this actual point, though, Nü Wa was shown creating the first humans out of clay, naming her husband and brother Fu Xi as the first of the Three August Ones, and of course, mending the sky after Gong Gong lost his battle to Zhu Rong and smashed his head against the pillar of Mt. Bu Zhou (and just an FYI, I'm Team Gong Gong all the way. I still think the folklore should have had him kick Zhu Rong's *** all over the curb).

4) Chinese Paladin: Nü Wa is the only authentic figure from Chinese myth that is mentioned in EVERY SINGLE installment in this franchise. Every single installment of Chinese Paladin does feature or WILL feature a direct descendant of Nü Wa, such as Zhao Ling Er in CP or Zi Xuan in CP3. Also, her descendants are treated as "special beings" born in the mortal world with the responsibility of sacrificing their selves for the greater good. In addition, Nü Wa was also the one who left behind the fabled elemental orbs (Ling Zhu) that are featured prominently in Chinese Paladin 3. And because Chinese Paladin is ongoing, her role in future installments is forthcoming.

=========================

So where is Nü Wa in Journey to the West? NOT mentioned. At all. Anywhere. Interesting. What kind of a large-scale myth would fail to include (in any way, shape, or form) the single most important and powerful figure in the entire world of Chinese myth?

The answer is, they didn't have room for her, because Wu Cheng En incorporated WAY too much Buddhist stuff into the story. In fact, of all of the large-scale myth series, JTTW is the one that leans HEAVILY to the side of the Buddhist Pantheon, rather than the Taoist one.

What in the HELL is the deal with that?

Just what exactly was Wu Cheng En trying to imply through his novel? Because it's almost as if he was purposely portraying the gods of the Taoist Pantheon as weak (when an army of 10,000 strong couldn't even take down Sun Wu Kong, although Yang Jian was able to do so by himself ... b/c Yang Jian owns SWK's monkey ***), and the Buddhist Pantheon as strong (Buddha came down and was able to trap SWK with just the palm of his hand).

What a load of horse manure.

In essence, by portraying the two pantheons in such a way, Wu Cheng En is basically saying that India is better than his own country of China, especially making the whole point of the novel that one must "follow Buddhism" in order to find "enlightenment" ... the monks in the storylines were apparently "failed" by Taoism, so they reverted to Buddhism.

The more I think about it, the more I realize how much of an anti-Chinese and anti-Taoist, Wu Cheng En really was. I mean, seriously, you people all realize that protagonist Sun Wu Kong is NOT Chinese, he's from a little island called JAPAN, right?

Wow.

Maybe Wu Cheng En should have denounced his ethnicity and moved to India. Because quite frankly, his novel is borderline BLASPHEMOUS to the Chinese people and to the ancient Chinese philosophies of Taoism.

Huang Di and Yan Di must have been rolling in their graves finding out they had a descendant like him.

Regardless of what Wu Cheng En thought and how he wrote JTTW, here's the REAL deal for everyone who isn't a self-hating Chinese:

- Nü Wa is the most powerful force in the Chinese myth universe, and even Buddha himself would have to bow down in her prescence.

- Er Lang Shen could destroy every single deity in the entire Buddhist Pantheon by himself (blindfolded, with one arm tied down, and half drunk) if he so chose to. We've already seen his power in the BLD Trilogy. And just for the record, Yang Jian has NEVER lost to SWK ... that makes him far superior to that flea-ridden monkey monk.

- JTTW is the ONLY one of the large-scale Chinese myths to imply that Buddhism could ever in a million years be superior to Taoism. In fact, aside from the BLD Trilogy, none of the other series even incorporate ANYONE or anything from the Buddhist Pantheon. As a true Chinese and Taoist, I am GREATLY offended by Wu Cheng En's blasphemous load of bull. Seriously, if he were still alive, I'd tell him to pack his bags and get the hell out of China if that's how it's gonna be.

- The Buddhist Pantheon of deities is SECONDARY to the Taoist Pantheon of gods in the Chinese myth universe, that is a FACT. Taoism is the TRUE religion and philosophy of China, in fact JTTW even tells the story of how Buddhist teachings were SPREAD (like a plague) to China from India.

- Vincent Jiao En Jun is 10,000x better than Hu Ge.

- Gong Gong is superior to Zhu Rong and should have won their mythical bout.

(don't know why I put down the last two ... guess because they just came into my head, and I know that they are TRUE)

**Kurenai86** · 11-15-10, 07:46 PM

@ Princekrillo

Come on... take a deep breath..

RELAX

In the Zhejiang version the audience ends up caring MORE about THOSE characters (such as Wang Li Ke's Queen of Nü Er Guo, Diana Pang's Spider Demon, Han Dong's Golden Ray Taoist, etc.) than about those stupid, bald monks.

Bai Gu Jing, the Spider Demons, Women's Country, Xiao Er Cheng, Huo Yan Shan, Lady Earthflow, and the Jade Rabbit in India are some of best stories in the series b/c of the STRONG FEMALE prescence. There is yin to balance out the already one-sided yang of the four, ugly monks.

Wow... I never though that Tang Monk is stupid or ugly, especially Victor Chen's

. ZBJ is ugly, but I think he himself thinks that he is handsome.
And SWK called himself 'Handsome monkey king' (yeah... as handsome as a monkey can be

). Friar Sand... well, the Zhejiang version is quite handsome too, if you remove his beard and all. Look at this pic

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So where is Nü Wa in Journey to the West? NOT mentioned. At all. Anywhere. Interesting. What kind of a large-scale myth would fail to include (in any way, shape, or form) the single most important and powerful figure in the entire world of Chinese myth?

I think NuWa IS mentioned (eventhough just a little)...
Isn't SWK himself is born from a fragment of 5 colours stone that NuWa used to mend the sky?
So, if Yang Jian is NuWa's grandson, SWK is NuWa's living artifact.
BTW, in Taoism, who really is Yu Di's sister? is she Hua Shen like in Chuan Shuo, or Yao Chi like in BLD JZ?
Please tell me if you don't mind

I mean, seriously, you people all realize that protagonist Sun Wu Kong is NOT Chinese, he's from a little island called JAPAN, right?

That's an eye opening... I've never thought about that... because I rather confused about geography in the Novel

hem... so that's why Japan version is the first JTTW adaptation. And in that version, The Tang Monk is a girl

(when an army of 10,000 strong couldn't even take down Sun Wu Kong, although Yang Jian was able to do so by himself ... b/c Yang Jian owns SWK's monkey ***), and the Buddhist Pantheon as strong (Buddha came down and was able to trap SWK with just the palm of his hand).

Isn't in BLD JZ mentioned that Yang Jian IS the strongest so no one in Heaven could bring him down? And IF SWK is as strong as him... I think that answer the question. In BLD, Chen Xiang can do it too.
And I don't think all of Buddhist Pantheon (if you mean the Arhats and the Boddhisatvas) able to defeat SWK... Only the RuLai can do that. Guan Yin just passed the ring (that placed in SWK's head) and the constricting spell from the Buddha too. ThaiShang LaoJun's diamond ring too can capture that monkey, if you remember it (even when the party met ThaiShang's green rhino, that animal can rob SWK's, and other Deity's weapons with that ring).
And... isn't SWK and Chen Xiang became that strong because they stole and eat immortality pills made by TaiShang LaoJun (SWK eats Wang Mu's peach too)?
WOW, that pills are something, don't you think so?

Maybe the scene when SWK made havoc in heaven is offensive for you, Taoist... it's understanable.

But I think there's inconsistency in JTTW, because in the first part, SWK is so superpower that Heaven's army can't bring him down. But why in the journey, the demons (some are the Taoist Deity's pet) can give the monkey a lot of trouble? Even Chang E's Jade Rabbit!
Is it have something to do with Tang Monk?

In fact, aside from the BLD Trilogy, none of the other series even incorporate ANYONE or anything from the Buddhist Pantheon.

Isn't it because the time line?
Chuan Shuo, FSYY, BLD JZ is BEFORE the Buddha even born... (I don't know about Chinese Paladin, it's just like some parallel world)
and only JTTW and BLD is AFTER the Buddha born.
In the latter timeline (after Tang Dynasty in JTTW), NuWa didn't appear anymore, so I don't know wheter Buddha should bow to her or not. But remember that Buddha is from India, so they (Buddha and Taoist Pantheon) got different realms. Just think about different country's leaders... no one is superior than another. They just have to respect each other. Just because JTTW's setting is in China, but SWK etc is attached to Buddhism, I don't think that Wu Cheng En meant to offense Taoism, if that's what you think.
Can't we just sit and chat with peace just like Tang Monk and Jin Guang Dao Zhang used to be?
Come on, relax... it's just a show anyway.

Do you remember in Huo Yan San story, NeZha represents Taoism side.
And his principles is 'kind to your enemy si cruel to yourself'.
Whether from Tang Monk is 'hatred cannot end with hatred, hatred only ends with compassion'
And... that's the difference between the 2 big religion in China. I don't know much about Taoism, but my father claims he is Taoist and he acnowledge that principles (I know that's NOT the ONLY principles, there's a LOT of it that I didn't know). Is it, in your opinion, true?

And... I think in FSYY, there's a Priests from West (in the few last part, when the heroes have to face Tong Tian). Are they implied as Buddhist? Or Hinduism?

- Vincent Jiao En Jun is 10,000x better than Hu Ge

True! I Like VJ's acting than Hu Ge's, VJ is a lot more than HG. But I Like Han Dong best of all...

**PrinceKrillo** · 11-16-10, 02:21 AM

Originally Posted by Kurenai86

I think NuWa IS mentioned (eventhough just a little)...Isn't SWK himself is born from a fragment of 5 colours stone that NuWa used to mend the sky?
So, if Yang Jian is NuWa's grandson, SWK is NuWa's living artifact.
BTW, in Taoism, who really is Yu Di's sister? is she Hua Shen like in Chuan Shuo, or Yao Chi like in BLD JZ?
Please tell me if you don't mind

Was that from the opening narration of the Zhejiang version? It's been too long since I watched the first episode. I vaguely remember the narrator saying something like that. But even so, I'm pretty sure that she is not mentioned even in the smallest way in any other version of the novel, not sure about the novel itself, but I doubt it.

As far as the "family tree" goes, there are of course different versions of mythology.

So in Chuan Shuo, Hua Shen (Bai Hua Xian) is the Jade Emperor's sister, but Yang Jian is probably not his nephew, because he appears in the series.

But in the BLD Trilogy, Yao Ji is the Jade Emperor's sister, making Yang Jian his nephew, but Bai Hua Xian Zi is NOT related to them.

Since they are two different versions, I just assume that both Hua Shen AND Yao Ji are his sisters, and that they are ALL children of Nü Wa. That way, Yang Jian and San Sheng Mu ARE related to her.

Originally Posted by Kurenai86

That's an eye opening... I've never thought about that... because I rather confused about geography in the Novel

Yes, it is strongly believed that Ao Lai Guo (the island where Mt. Hua Guo is) is meant to be Japan, making SWK actually of Japanese origin. And Niu Mo Wang and the rest of the 72 Demon Kings also of Japanese origin.

Originally Posted by Kurenai86

Isn't in BLD JZ mentioned that Yang Jian IS the strongest so no one in Heaven could bring him down? And IF SWK is as strong as him... I think that answer the question. In BLD, Chen Xiang can do it too.

And... isn't SWK and Chen Xiang became that strong because they stole and eat immortality pills made by TaiShang LaoJun (SWK eats Wang Mu's peach too)?
WOW, that pills are something, don't you think so?

But I think there's inconsistency in JTTW, because in the first part, SWK is so superpower that Heaven's army can't bring him down. But why in the journey, the demons (some are the Taoist Deity's pet) can give the monkey a lot of trouble? Even Chang E's Jade Rabbit!
Is it have something to do with Tang Monk?

Yes, it is ridiculous that SWK can take care of 100,000 Taoist gods himself but cannot defeat a single demon without trouble. However, there IS a scene in BLD Qian Zhuan in which the Jade Emperor mentions how the 365 gods (created from the Feng Shen Bang) were all incredibly powerful prior to the end of the Shang Dynasty but all became weak after becoming Taoist gods and couldn't manage to take down SWK.

Also, as far as Chen Xiang goes, I hate that kid so, so much. And one of the things I hate the most about the original BLD series is how they cheaply made him "as strong as Yang Jian and SWK" just because he downed a bunch of Lao Zi's pills. I actually refuse to acknowledge his so-called "strength." I really hope he gets killed off at the beginning of the sequel series so that I won't have to deal with him for the entire series. His bride Xiao Yu, however, should stay alive and return in the sequel series, I love Shu Chang.

Also, on the wikipedia page, Cao Jun is credited as reprising his role of Chen Xiang in the ZJZ version of JTTW. I really don't understand how or why, but ... it's also got ZJZ playing Lao ZI when it was supposed to be Liu De Kai.

Originally Posted by Kurenai86

Do you remember in Huo Yan San story, NeZha represents Taoism side.
And his principles is 'kind to your enemy si cruel to yourself'.
Whether from Tang Monk is 'hatred cannot end with hatred, hatred only ends with compassion'
And... that's the difference between the 2 big religion in China. I don't know much about Taoism, but my father claims he is Taoist and he acnowledge that principles (I know that's NOT the ONLY principles, there's a LOT of it that I didn't know). Is it, in your opinion, true?

The great thing about Taoism is that nobody tells what to do or how to think, like with all other religions. That's the whole point. You contemplate life and the universe, and YOU figure out your OWN "dao." In other words, YOU figure out what to value in life and how to live and what to believe in.

That was pretty much the final message of the Zhejiang version, the final scene is when Sun Wu Kong turns to the camera and asks whether "YOU have found yours yet." Of course, he said "xin," but it can be taken/translated as "dao." Same difference, really. That whole philosophical thing started all the way from the Bai Gu Jing storyline, when SWK was trying to create a mirror from the rock. It ended with him finally attaining philosophical enlightenment and understanding the importance of self realization. That was him finally achieving "dao," which is what all Taoists and Buddhists alike strive for, and really the whole point of the novel.

Not gonna hold my breath for anything quite so smart or enlightening from Mr. ZJZ's version ... even though it's what he's SUPPOSED to be adapting.

Thread: New Xi You Ji - Journey to the West (Zhang Ji Zhong 2009/2010 version)

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