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Thread: Is it possible for a stronger person in wuxia to lose to a weaker person?

  1. #1
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    Default Is it possible for a stronger person in wuxia to lose to a weaker person?

    ok i think we can all say that guo jing > mei chao feng. but if they fought 1000 times, is it possible for mei chao feng to win at least once?

    consider that this is a fair 1v1 physical fight with no use of tactics at all and neither side improves over time (ex. the losing side DOES NOT learn from mistake), in other words, just think of it as stimulating the battle 1000 times.
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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    It happens all the time in wuxia. Lee Chum Foon, third-ranked in the world according to the Book of Weapons, defeated top-ranked Seung Gwoon Gum Hung, who himself had only recently advanced to the top rank by unexpectedly defeating Old Man Sheun.

    Little Dragon Girl, nowhere close to being a Great, nearly took the Golden Wheel Monk's head off during the showdown at Chung Yeung Temple.

    Kiu Fung broke the Janitor Monk's ribs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    It happens all the time in wuxia. Lee Chum Foon, third-ranked in the world according to the Book of Weapons, defeated top-ranked Seung Gwoon Gum Hung, who himself had only recently advanced to the top rank by unexpectedly defeating Old Man Sheun.

    Little Dragon Girl, nowhere close to being a Great, nearly took the Golden Wheel Monk's head off during the showdown at Chung Yeung Temple.

    Kiu Fung broke the Janitor Monk's ribs.
    wait i thought XLN (after learning the left/right technique) was equal to GWM (before his elephant move thing at the end of ROCH) and if not better.

    kiu fung breaking janitor monk doesnt really count b/c he still lost. imo jin yong always have the stronger side win
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR View Post
    wait i thought XLN (after learning the left/right technique) was equal to GWM (before his elephant move thing at the end of ROCH) and if not better.
    On the quantitative level on which these matters are often judged, the Golden Wheel Monk, being a Greats-level fighter, was certainly more powerful than Little Dragon Girl at any time during ROCH. However, in actual combat, it's not inconceivable that he would actually lose to her. This seems to be a unique defect of the Golden Wheel Monk's fighting judgment and character (his "choke factor," which has been discussed here so many times before). Whereas I can see Little Dragon Girl defeating the Golden Wheel Monk (something which she quite nearly did) using Double Sword Technique via the Left/Right Hand Technique, I don't see it working against, say, East Heretic Wong Yerk See, Chow Bak Tung, or Gwok Jing, who were hypothetically the Golden Wheel Monk's equals.

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    There are many examples of someone using unheard of Kung Fu to beat guys much better... Best Eg, ZZR and her 9Yin. Once ppl saw through the weirdness, shes not pro at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR View Post
    imo jin yong always have the stronger side win
    Not always the case. Examples:

    -A half dead Linghu Chong defeated 15 masked swordsmen in a flash.

    -Linghu Chong, near the end of novel, was easily defeated by Yilin's grandmother, whose kung fu was much lower than Ren Yingying! In fact the grandmother was holding back quite a bit; it was said that if she went all out, Linghu Chong would have been subdued immediately.

    -BLACK WIND DEMON Chen Xuanfeng was killed by child Guo Jing.

    -INVINCIBLE FIST Gui Xingshu + his wife were 2 of the top fighters in DOMD. They were defeated by a couple of imperial guards

    Here is a general observation. Some top fighters nevertheless have a weakness. Linghu Chong's weakness is in barehanded combat. Chen Xuanfeng's weakness is his stomach. Gui Xingshu's weakness is that he is dumb as a brick. IF you exploit a top fighter's weakness, you can put them to a significant disadvantage. And that is how you win against a better fighter.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Yeung Gor also defeated Fok Do at the Heroes' Conference at Luk Family Manor. Pound for pound, Yeung Gor wasn't a better martial artist than Fok Do yet, but Yeung did defeat the Mongolian prince.

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    Not to mention the most famous case of all!

    How can we forget that Xiao Feng is the lord of having a flawless history in Consistently Defeating Stronger Opponents.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ View Post
    BLACK WIND DEMON Chen Xuanfeng was killed by child Guo Jing.
    Of course, this one was more dumb luck/accident than anything. I don't think it could happen twice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ View Post
    Not to mention the most famous case of all!

    How can we forget that Xiao Feng is the lord of having a flawless history in Consistently Defeating Stronger Opponents.
    Before the ascension of Deun Yu and Hui Juk, however, who in DGSD wulin was stronger than Kiu Fung other than the Janitor Monk and the Siu Yiu Sect Elders?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Before the ascension of Deun Yu and Hui Juk, however, who in DGSD wulin was stronger than Kiu Fung other than the Janitor Monk and the Siu Yiu Sect Elders?
    This is more referring to Xiao Feng throughout his career. When he was younger, he defeated a number of superior opponents.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Senior Member Exodus's Avatar
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    XF had a reputation of beating stronger opponents than him at least in the beginning of his career.

    YG also defeated stronger opponents than him as well as GJ in the beginning of their stories.

    people who lost to peple inferior than themselves are ZWJ, DY and GWM the three chokemeisters on the JY universe

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Before the ascension of Deun Yu and Hui Juk, however, who in DGSD wulin was stronger than Kiu Fung other than the Janitor Monk and the Siu Yiu Sect Elders?
    I could see XF beating the SY elders. He should be able to take a lot more damage than those old fogies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus View Post
    people who lost to peple inferior than themselves are ZWJ, DY and GWM the three chokemeisters on the JY universe
    Duan Yu never even learned the basic moves of martial arts, whereas the other 2 had some to extensive training. In overall martial arts, Duan Yu (pre-JMZ absorption) should be 7th or 8th tier in DGSD.
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ View Post
    Duan Yu never even learned the basic moves of martial arts, whereas the other 2 had some to extensive training. In overall martial arts, Duan Yu (pre-JMZ absorption) should be 7th or 8th tier in DGSD.
    remind me pls, did Duan Yu absorb JMZ before or after his fight of 6MSJ VS Murong Fu?

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    Quote Originally Posted by PJ View Post
    Duan Yu never even learned the basic moves of martial arts, whereas the other 2 had some to extensive training. In overall martial arts, Duan Yu (pre-JMZ absorption) should be 7th or 8th tier in DGSD.
    you are right about DY. Still either one of them really have the killer instinct that XF had

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exodus View Post
    you are right about DY. Still either one of them really have the killer instinct that XF had
    Yeah, but who does? We're talking about Kiu Fung here...the KING of killer instinct!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Yeah, but who does? We're talking about Kiu Fung here...the KING of killer instinct!
    OT but king of killer instinct is kobe bryant

    anyways, if mei chao feng fought GJ 1000 times, do u guys think she'll win at least 1 battle?
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR View Post
    OT but king of killer instinct is kobe bryant

    anyways, if mei chao feng fought GJ 1000 times, do u guys think she'll win at least 1 battle?
    Which Gwok Jing? The one who could barely beat her using "silent" Hong Lung Palms, the one who fought two Greats to 600 strokes at the Second Mt. Hua Sword Tournament, or the new Great of the North at the end of ROCH?

    She'd beat the first one a fair share of times. She might sneak in a lucky win against the second one from time to time. I don't give her much hope against the third one (barring some REALLY lucky/unlucky circumstances like the one that killed her husband).

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR View Post
    OT but king of killer instinct is kobe bryant
    The last couple of games, it's looked like the Lakers couldn't buy any killer instinct if they spent all of Jerry Buss' money. Home losses to the Bobcats and Grizzlies? Geeze...

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