Does the existence of characters such as J. Monk/DGKB make a mockery of the Greats?

[Ken Cheng]

Ah the Greats...North Kiu Fung, South Mo Yung...East Heretic Wong Yerk See, West Poison Au Yeung Fung, South Emperor/Monk Deun Chi Hing/1 Deng, North Beggar Hung 7 Gung, Central Divinity Wong Chung Yeung, North Hero Gwok Jing, West Passionate Yeung Gor, Central Mischief Chow Bak Tung...Mo Dong Sect Patriarch Cheung 3 Fung and Ming Cult Leader Cheung Mo Gei.

These figures are fascinating to us because each of them reached the highest pinnacle of martial arts in their eras. They were thus known as "The Greats."

But wait! There were these godly figures such as the Janitor Monk of Shaolin, who could effortlessly fell a Kiu Fung or Mo Yung Bok-level fighter with a single tap...and such as Sword Demon Dook Goo Kau Bai, who apparently was more powerful than any of the men known as "Greats" during the CONDOR HEROES TRILOGY.

Do you think the existence of figures such as the Janitor Monk and Dook Goo Kau Bai makes a mockery out of the whole "Greats" concept? How "great" are our so-called "Greats" if there exist martial artists out there who would destroy them as easily the Greats would destroy low-level fighters?

[jadebunny9]

I don't think so. Being a Great does not mean that there can't be others who are more powerful than you. Now if you were labeled "Superly Duperly Awesomely Insanely the Single-Best-Thing-the-Earth-Has-Ever-Known Great," then I might change my vote.

[Ren Ying Ying]

i think it underlies a great philosophy..."there are people outside of people and there are mountains outside of mountains"...

in other words "don't get cocky b/c there may be others better than you".

think about it. how many times had the main character come out of a battle as a victor simply b/c the opponents underestimated them (usually b/c of age)?

it also seems to be a favorite technique of JY's to introduce lower callibre fighters in the begining and making them seem extremely powerful, but they only turn out to be crap compared to even better fighters.

and btw...the "greats" are but only a title given to these kids by fans.

[Dennis Chen]

I think Nan Di and Dong Xie reached the level of Shi Wai Gau Ren by the end of ROCH.

[ChanceEncounter]

I think Nan Di and Dong Xie reached the level of Shi Wai Gau Ren by the end of ROCH.

If they did, so too did JLFW/JLGS, considering ZBT noticed that he had never felt anyone with as strong internal/force in his life, and he was able to start defeating Yideng even though he was depressed after losing GX.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Ah the Greats...North Kiu Fung, South Mo Yung...East Heretic Wong Yerk See, West Poison Au Yeung Fung, South Emperor/Monk Deun Chi Hing/1 Deng, North Beggar Hung 7 Gung, Central Divinity Wong Chung Yeung, North Hero Gwok Jing, West Passionate Yeung Gor, Central Mischief Chow Bak Tung...Mo Dong Sect Patriarch Cheung 3 Fung and Ming Cult Leader Cheung Mo Gei.

These figures are fascinating to us because each of them reached the highest pinnacle of martial arts in their eras. They were thus known as "The Greats."

But wait! There were these godly figures such as the Janitor Monk of Shaolin, who could effortlessly fell a Kiu Fung or Mo Yung Bok-level fighter with a single tap...and such as Sword Demon Dook Goo Kau Bai, who apparently was more powerful than any of the men known as "Greats" during the CONDOR HEROES TRILOGY.

Do you think the existence of figures such as the Janitor Monk and Dook Goo Kau Bai makes a mockery out of the whole "Greats" concept? How "great" are our so-called "Greats" if there exist martial artists out there who would destroy them as easily the Greats would destroy low-level fighters?

Honestly? I've always felt the whole 'Greats' thing smacked of a huge amount of fanboyism, based primarily upon the popularity of the LOCH/ROCH books.

[ChanceEncounter]

To be honest, I've never seen "The Greats" referenced outside of forum discussion.

These were some of the best of the era, but as the books have shown, there are people out there that can challenge them. And given JY's repeated theme of the vastness of the martial world, it really should come at no surprise that there may just have been someone greater.

[Ren Ying Ying]

To be honest, I've never seen "The Greats" referenced outside of forum discussion.

These were some of the best of the era, but as the books have shown, there are people out there that can challenge them. And given JY's repeated theme of the vastness of the martial world, it really should come at no surprise that there may just have been someone greater.

i thought i've seen "wu jue (无绝)" written somewhere refering to the "greats". though i've never seen a similar term refered to for the likes of the kids in DGSD, HSDS, or other novels.

[the.raven]

more like all the characters in TLBB make a mockery of the Greats. they can shoot ranged attacks from their hands and fingers. even wang chong yang couldnt do any of that. and wu ya zi passed all his internal strength to xu zhu just like that, if only you could learn martial arts by letting someone else do it then giving it to you...

[flamer]

more like all the characters in TLBB make a mockery of the Greats. they can shoot ranged attacks from their hands and fingers. even wang chong yang couldnt do any of that. and wu ya zi passed all his internal strength to xu zhu just like that, if only you could learn martial arts by letting someone else do it then giving it to you...

Wha...? Yideng can do Yiyang Zhi which is ranged, although not quite as epic as Six Meridian Swords. Guo Jing's XL18Z is also ranged and can probably fight an equal match with Xiao Feng.

With the exception of Xuzhu (or the 3 Elders of XiaoYao Sect) and Sweeper Monk, I can't see why any of the Greats will totally lose to any character in DGSD.

[Exodus]

Wha...? Yideng can do Yiyang Zhi which is ranged, although not quite as epic as Six Meridian Swords. Guo Jing's XL18Z is also ranged and can probably fight an equal match with Xiao Feng.

With the exception of Xuzhu (or the 3 Elders of XiaoYao Sect) and Sweeper Monk, I can't see why any of the Greats will totally lose to any character in DGSD.

you got DY who could kill great level fighters easily

[ChanceEncounter]

you got DY who could kill great level fighters easily

And then could turn around and lose to a sub-Great level fighter.

In a fair fight, it's certainly far from guaranteed.

[Ren Wo Xing]

And then could turn around and lose to a sub-Great level fighter.

In a fair fight, it's certainly far from guaranteed.

Not by the end of the novel.

[ChanceEncounter]

Not by the end of the novel.

Even at the end of the novel, he never fully mastered 6MSJ and his victory is far from guaranteed.

[the.raven]

Wha...? Yideng can do Yiyang Zhi which is ranged, although not quite as epic as Six Meridian Swords. Guo Jing's XL18Z is also ranged and can probably fight an equal match with Xiao Feng.

With the exception of Xuzhu (or the 3 Elders of XiaoYao Sect) and Sweeper Monk, I can't see why any of the Greats will totally lose to any character in DGSD.

well according to the descriptions in the books, when Guo Jing strikes his XL18Z at someone from range (or any other great striking with his own skill, for that matter), the victim feels soemthing to the effect of "breathing difficulties". this is quite common in Jin Yong's novels when describing an attack from a powerful person. but people in TLBB can really do serious damage, not just cause breathing difficulties.

an example of xiao feng's skill is he grabbed air, and a sabre lying on the ground gets lifted up by his internal energy and leaps off the ground into his hand, I dont think a similar description of skill is used for Guo Jing.

[flamer]

well according to the descriptions in the books, when Guo Jing strikes his XL18Z at someone from range (or any other great striking with his own skill, for that matter), the victim feels soemthing to the effect of "breathing difficulties". this is quite common in Jin Yong's novels when describing an attack from a powerful person. but people in TLBB can really do serious damage, not just cause breathing difficulties.

an example of xiao feng's skill is he grabbed air, and a sabre lying on the ground gets lifted up by his internal energy and leaps off the ground into his hand, I dont think a similar description of skill is used for Guo Jing.

Yes the breathing difficulty is due to the impending attack, its not the actual strike. Remember Xiao Feng had this as well when he attacked Ding Chunqiu for Ah Zi... DCQ had breathing difficulties and stepped back to avoid damage.

That is a specific skill Xiao Feng used to pick up that sabre （禽龙功), its not part of XL18Z.

Guo Jing could use two different techniques with his two hands... you never get that from Xiao Feng either! oh wait... its not the same set of skills they are using...

[the.raven]

.

That is a specific skill Xiao Feng used to pick up that sabre （禽龙功), its not part of XL18Z.

Guo Jing could use two different techniques with his two hands... you never get that from Xiao Feng either! oh wait... its not the same set of skills they are using...

i know its not part of XL18Z, i'm just saying it shows xiao feng's super duper internal energy power.

regardless of whether guo jing can use 2 techniques at the same time, his internal energy is still not that godly. even though in the condor trilogy guo jing is considered one of the most powerful.

[ChronoReverse]

LDA is technique specific. Besides, XF's "LDA" was a triple melded HL18P attack that he moved along with. As an LDA, it really wasn't much of one.

Now, a certain medium level fighter in XAJH was able to do a proper 15 foot LDA...

[the.raven]

LDA is technique specific. Besides, XF's "LDA" was a triple melded HL18P attack that he moved along with. As an LDA, it really wasn't much of one.

Now, a certain medium level fighter in XAJH was able to do a proper 15 foot LDA...

sorry but what does LDA stand for.

[flamer]

i know its not part of XL18Z, i'm just saying it shows xiao feng's super duper internal energy power.

regardless of whether guo jing can use 2 techniques at the same time, his internal energy is still not that godly. even though in the condor trilogy guo jing is considered one of the most powerful.

The ability to use 禽龙功 is not a measure of his internal energy. Although it is no simple skill, it doesnt show Xiao Feng's internal is higher than Guo Jing's.

LDA= Long Distance Attack.