I knew there was no way in hell.....

[KChill]

...that that little Chinese girl could be 16 years old....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080814/...derage_chinese

[PJ]

He is not a he. Hehe...

anyway... that confused me for a second in the article.

[Ren Wo Xing]

...that that little Chinese girl could be 16 years old....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080814/...derage_chinese

So what, you always knew just by looking at the girl that there was no way in hell she was 16? Stop pretending to be an age psychic! And, for that matter, that stuff is NOT EVIDENCE. Evidence is when you can PROVE something. You only have APPEAL TO AUTHORITY and interviewers. That's not evidence. I think that it's also rude to say things like "I am so certain blah blah blah" just because that's the way it is. Maybe no one else has an issue with arrogance and cockiness when an issue hasn't even been publicly determined and set, but that's my standpoint. The official stance is the one that the IOC takes, and they do have the most authority over this issue. Unless there has been an official stance, I wouldn't make concrete statements like that because I find it really presumptuous and ignorant.

[bellamia]

Lol...Rennie, are you still taking it to heart dear? Anyhow, this story is still unfolding. It seems like people do want to get to the bottom of this. I just saw a segment on CNN that published evidence of previous news articles and documents showing that one or two girls are underage. I'm definitely going to read more into this later tonight when I have more time...though the burden of prove is narrowing in for me.

[Ren Wo Xing]

Lol...Rennie, are you still taking it to heart dear? Anyhow, this is story is still unfolding. It seems like people do want to get to the bottom of this. I just saw a news segment on CNN that published evidence of previous news articles and documents showing that one or two girls are underage. I'm definitely going to read more into this later tonight when I have more time...the burden of prove is narrowing in for me.

Lol, not so much 'to heart' (was grinning from ear to ear as I typed that up), but when I saw this thread, there was no way I could resist, dontchaknow

I do believe that a reason why there is so much attention/focus to this is because the US team lost and the Chinese team won; if China won the silver, this would have gone out with a whimper, not a bang.

[jadebunny9]

Yes, the reason why this is becoming so big is because the US team lost. I really hope they don't find anything though because the Chinese girls worked hard for their medal, even if they might not have been qualified to compete age-wise.

[Ren Ying Ying]

shouldn't this be merged with the other thread? where's ken when you need him

[Trien Chieu]

Yes, the reason why this is becoming so big is because the US team lost. I really hope they don't find anything though because the Chinese girls worked hard for their medal, even if they might not have been qualified to compete age-wise.

Have to agree with you on this. As long as the girl won fair and square, age really doesn't matter to me... It is not the case that underage girls have any unfair advantage...

[jadebunny9]

The problem is...they didn't win fair and square. At least not rules-wise.

This is assuming that they were really underage and had their medals stripped.

[Ren Wo Xing]

The problem is...they didn't win fair and square. At least not rules-wise.

That's a bold statement to make for SOMETHING YOU CAN'T PROVE. Lmao, you think you're all so mighty and great. Why don't you bring it up with the IOC then? It's freaking hilarious how confident and cocky some people think they are.

Sure, go ahead and post your un-defended claims. No one is stopping you. Go and post more about how you want to jump off the Eiffle Tower or anything else for all I care. But you can't stop other people from calling you whiners who can't prove jack either.

You whiny poo-poo head!

[jadebunny9]

Just for that, you're owing me lunch next time.

[bach_ngoc17]

I just think it's such sour grapes that some of these people are crying foul because the Chinese girls won. Nobody has any prove they aren't at least 16 years old. For us Asians we can't be judged by American or European standards to determine age anyways. People have been way off on guessing my age all the time.

[~Dan~]

I just think it's such sour grapes that some of these people are crying foul because the Chinese girls won. Nobody has any prove they aren't at least 16 years old. For us Asians we can't be judged by American or European standards to determine age anyways. People have been way off on guessing my age all the time.

Yes, it's only because the US lost. But....there is A LOT of evidence, but I guess this is still not enough to 'prove' it to you..

[ChanceEncounter]

Have to agree with you on this. As long as the girl won fair and square, age really doesn't matter to me... It is not the case that underage girls have any unfair advantage...

Medically speaking, physically and psychologically, younger girls do have an advantage in women's gymnastic events. And even if that advantage is only marginal, the fact of the matter is that the rule states that they have to turn 16 the year of the Olympic games.

If the IOC does find them guilty of changing the age, then they should definitely come down on them for a blatant violation of the rules. Whether or not the US won gold is not the point. The US is not the only team that has questioned the age of the Chinese girls. And the rule is inflexible; the girl must turn 16 sometime during the calendar year in order to be eligible. If they do not, they are not eligible for Olympic competition and, out of ineligibility, their events must be vacated.

So what, you always knew just by looking at the girl that there was no way in hell she was 16?

Xinhua reported 9 months ago that He Kexin was 13 years old. There are two possible explanations for this:

1.) He Kexin got 3 years older in 9 months time.
2.) Xinhua, the government news agency, reported the wrong age.

Bringing the IOC into this is pointless, because the IOC accepts passports as proof of identity, and the accusations is that the passports were doctored.

[KChill]

I find anyone who denies what they see with their own eyes to be ignorant, either that or just blissfully insouciant. You're probably both. Also, you may not have heard this, but typing in caps doesn't make you post any more insightful.

So what, you always knew just by looking at the girl that there was no way in hell she was 16? Stop pretending to be an age psychic! And, for that matter, that stuff is NOT EVIDENCE. Evidence is when you can PROVE something. You only have APPEAL TO AUTHORITY and interviewers. That's not evidence. I think that it's also rude to say things like "I am so certain blah blah blah" just because that's the way it is. Maybe no one else has an issue with arrogance and cockiness when an issue hasn't even been publicly determined and set, but that's my standpoint. The official stance is the one that the IOC takes, and they do have the most authority over this issue. Unless there has been an official stance, I wouldn't make concrete statements like that because I find it really presumptuous and ignorant.

[PJ]

There goes victim numero uno of Rennie's TTP: Taking The Piss.

[Ren Wo Xing]

I find anyone who denies what they see with their own eyes to be ignorant, either that or just blissfully insouciant. You're probably both. Also, you may not have heard this, but typing in caps doesn't make you post any more insightful.

I thought about your response, KChill, and you know what?

You're absolutely right.

I deeply apologize. Looking back, that post, as well as the one following it, was clearly one-sided and biased. It was also completely disproportional to the statement you made. Moreover, it demonstrated a lack of self-control, and an inability to accept strongly worded statements from others simply because of personal disagreements with its contents. I am forced to absolutely agree with your condemnation, and once again want to express my deepest apologies for such biased, brash, abrasive, insulting, inflammatory, and ignorant commentary.

I hope you will accept my apology.

[KChill]

Lol, not so much 'to heart' (was grinning from ear to ear as I typed that up), but when I saw this thread, there was no way I could resist, dontchaknow

I do believe that a reason why there is so much attention/focus to this is because the US team lost and the Chinese team won; if China won the silver, this would have gone out with a whimper, not a bang.

Rin Tin Tin, calm down dude. I simply stated that I knew she wasn't sixteen and posted the article. I did not imply anything about the validity of China's win. The reason the US lost is the Sacrimony girl who kept falling -- end of story. However, if you look at girl and say you didn't once think she looks too young, you don't get out much.

[KChill]

I thought about your response, KChill, and you know what?

You're absolutely right.

I deeply apologize. Looking back, that post, as well as the one following it, was clearly one-sided and biased. It was also completely disproportional to the statement you made. Moreover, it demonstrated a lack of self-control, and an inability to accept strongly worded statements from others simply because of personal disagreements with its contents. I absolute agree with your condemnation, and once again want to express my deepest apologies for such brash, abrasive, inflammatory, and ignorant commentary.

I hope you will accept my apology.

No prob, man....we still cousins....

[Tei]

You know, the fact that the girls in question had their birthdays listed as the first day of the month for BOTH disputed years 1992 and 1994 suggests to me that probably neither one is accurate. They still could be underage or of age, and we still can't say for sure; the only official sources we have are the passports and statements by the gymnastics federation to go by, and a lack of conclusive evidence to prove otherwise.

That there are inconsistencies in China's media is not surprising and again, raises suspicion, but of course, in an investigation, news sources would not be a viable source of evidence. Investigative reporting can contribute to unveiling some things (ie: Watergate), but only if they can point or lead conclusively (copies, recordings, you know...solid proof that would hold up in an official questioning) to evidence. Relying just on cached websites is not enough. It's too easy to write off xinhua as having made a mistake or faulty sources. That's the problem here and why nothing is resolved, and probably also why people like Karloyi who have the capacity (and motive) to file an official complaint haven't yet.

This whole situation is really regretful. The sad thing is, whether they turn out to be underage OR not, their victory is going to sullied, and they don't deserve that.