Why did Ji Xiaofu not regret being raped by Yang Xiao?

[Guo Xiang]

I think the name Buhui is more of pertaining to the daughter. As in she doesn't regret giving birth to her.

When 'buhui' is put together with rape, it just seems odd. Since rape never has a choice in wanting to be part of the act or not, there should be no regret element in it at all.

[PJ]

When 'buhui' is put together with rape, it just seems odd. Since rape never has a choice in wanting to be part of the act or not, there should be no regret element in it at all.

It seems less odd after we see how much Yang Xiao loved her. I tend to think their "relationship" is similar to an earlier prototype from Jin Yong canon: GOLDEN SNAKE PRINCE Xia Xueyi and Qingqing's mom Wen Yi. The man abducted the woman, but he treated her very well, so they fell in love.

[Ken Cheng]

It seems less odd after we see how much Yang Xiao loved her. I tend to think their "relationship" is similar to an earlier prototype from Jin Yong canon: GOLDEN SNAKE PRINCE Xia Xueyi and Qingqing's mom Wen Yi. The man abducted the woman, but he treated her very well, so they fell in love.

My biggest issue with wuxia romances is that 99% of them could not possibly work in real life.

Would it kill these guys to actually write about a romantic relationship in wuxia that actually, you know, bears *some* resemblance to a real one?

[PJ]

My biggest issue with wuxia romances is that 99% of them could not possibly work in real life.

Would it kill these guys to actually write about a romantic relationship in wuxia that actually, you know, bears *some* resemblance to a real one?

Well, I think Jin Yong's simplification of romance has been well documented here. I personally think he sucks at writing about romance. But the wuxia genre is one big fantasy, so one could argue don't take much issue with romance in wuxia being one big fantasy also.

[Ken Cheng]

I personally think he sucks at writing about romance.

Affirmation of this gives me great peace of mind on several important (to me) fronts.

I admire and respect Jin Yong. I wouldn't have been on this forum for years discussing his works if I didn't, but frankly, some of his ideas are...meh (especially in regards to how romantic relationships work).

It's no personal slight of the man; it's just my honest observation about the way he thinks about this subject.

[Trien Chieu]

My biggest issue with wuxia romances is that 99% of them could not possibly work in real life.

Would it kill these guys to actually write about a romantic relationship in wuxia that actually, you know, bears *some* resemblance to a real one?

What?? 99%?
No doubt that a large percentage of them don't work, but less than 99%. I would say 60-80% of them don't work.
I think couples like Kwok Jing and Wong Yung, Little Fish and Su Ying, Flawless Flower and Xie Xin Lan, Yulu Qi and Kwok Fu, Cheung Mo Gei and Chiu Ming, and Yeun Ching Chi and Wan Ching Ching could work in real life.

[Candide]

My biggest issue with wuxia romances is that 99% of them could not possibly work in real life.

Would it kill these guys to actually write about a romantic relationship in wuxia that actually, you know, bears *some* resemblance to a real one?

99%? Like what, give me an example.

Real life romances are a lot stranger than fiction. I can guarantee you that many of those romances do happen in our world.

[i_fotted]

Was it actual rape? I always thought of it as adultery.

[Ken Cheng]

Was it actual rape? I always thought of it as adultery.

It can't be adultery because neither Yeung Siu nor Gei Hiu Fu was married at the time (Gei's engagement to Yan Lei Ting doesn't count; it's not adultery unless the perpetrator is already married).

It is *definitely* rape, however, because Gei Hiu Fu had not given her consent at the time that the act was committed. Her retroactively deciding that she has "no regrets" doesn't change that.

[kidd]

Affirmation of this gives me great peace of mind on several important (to me) fronts.

How many more affirmations do you need to get complete peace of mind?

I admire and respect Jin Yong. I wouldn't have been on this forum for years discussing his works if I didn't, but frankly, some of his ideas are...meh (especially in regards to how romantic relationships work).

It's no personal slight of the man; it's just my honest observation about the way he thinks about this subject.

Most wuxia novels are like that, not only Jin Yong. A lot of wuxia heroes has lots of girls falling for him for no apparent reason other than he's the hero. At least, Jin Yong heroes has personality. Wong Long Sheng's totally bland and uninteresting heroes has loads of girls with good qualities falling for him at first sight. That's even more unreasonable. But, wuxia is for people who can't be a hero in real life to escape into a wuxia world where they can be a hero through the protagonist.

You have to stop blaming Jin Yong or Diana for your first failed romantic endevour. Something just aren't meant to be. Use it as a growing up lesson.

[kidd]

It seems less odd after we see how much Yang Xiao loved her. I tend to think their "relationship" is similar to an earlier prototype from Jin Yong canon: GOLDEN SNAKE PRINCE Xia Xueyi and Qingqing's mom Wen Yi. The man abducted the woman, but he treated her very well, so they fell in love.

This kind of plot not only happen in wuxia novels (where romance is just a subplot) but in romance novels itself. Heard of the 'bodice ripper' romance? It's quite popular at one time in the 80's in western romance genre. A lady kidnapped by a highwayman who proceed to 'seduce' her and the lady later fall in love with him. Of course, the highwayman will truly fall in love with her and only her (just like Yang Xiao and Golden Snake Prince for their respective ladies) and will be willing to give up anything for her later.

[Candide]

Most wuxia novels are like that, not only Jin Yong. A lot of wuxia heroes has lots of girls falling for him for no apparent reason other than he's the hero. At least, Jin Yong heroes has personality. Wong Long Sheng's totally bland and uninteresting heroes has loads of girls with good qualities falling for him at first sight. That's even more unreasonable.

How is that different to real life? In our world, the vast majority of girls, with or without good qualities, fall for the "heroes". Look at our movie stars, sport stars, wealthy entrepreneurs etc. and the women that fall at their feet. Going down to levels below the celebrities, it's always the guys who have the highest social status (i.e hero-like) that get the best girls. The losers never get the girls. If they're lucky, the girls may "settle" for them later on, but that's not "getting".

Wuxia may be a fantasy, somewhat simplified world but it does reflect our world more than people think.

The guys and girls who think that wuxia romances don't reflect real life often forget that in the world they're living, if they're guys, they aren't heroes and if they're girls, they aren't rare beauties who are also super witty or amazing cooks. It's not wuxia authors' fault. It's just that you're not exactly the ideal they wrote about. And too bad, such ideal men / women do exist in our world; you're just not them!

[Trinie]

Affirmation of this gives me great peace of mind on several important (to me) fronts.

I admire and respect Jin Yong. I wouldn't have been on this forum for years discussing his works if I didn't, but frankly, some of his ideas are...meh (especially in regards to how romantic relationships work).

It's no personal slight of the man; it's just my honest observation about the way he thinks about this subject.

Well, keep in mind that JY's actual "love" life in real life isn't so great either... THerefore, I don't think you should be shocked about how he depicts them in his novels.... Plus, they are wuxia novels so a lot of them are more fantasized and ideal, not realistic.

[Ren Wo Xing]

The guys and girls who think that wuxia romances don't reflect real life often forget that in the world they're living, if they're guys, they aren't heroes and if they're girls, they aren't rare beauties who are also super witty or amazing cooks. It's not wuxia authors' fault. It's just that you're not exactly the ideal they wrote about. And too bad, such ideal men / women do exist in our world; you're just not them!

That pretty much summarizes it.

[kidd]

How is that different to real life? In our world, the vast majority of girls, with or without good qualities, fall for the "heroes". Look at our movie stars, sport stars, wealthy entrepreneurs etc. and the women that fall at their feet. Going down to levels below the celebrities, it's always the guys who have the highest social status (i.e hero-like) that get the best girls. The losers never get the girls. If they're lucky, the girls may "settle" for them later on, but that's not "getting".

But, those that WLS write, the 'hero' doesn't even have social status yet. He's just a newbie in the wulin who happens to be the protagonist. The 'hero' I mean is the protagonist of the novel.

Gosh, you are the one who said in the other thread that we shouldn't blame authors for writing things that 'doesn't happen in real life'. Now you are whining when I said novel is different from real life.

[Candide]

But, those that WLS write, the 'hero' doesn't even have social status yet. He's just a newbie in the wulin who happens to be the protagonist. The 'hero' I mean is the protagonist of the novel.

It doesn't matter so much. Women also have a keen nose for potentials in a man. If a guy appears like he has a chance to make it big, he can also be a chick magnet. The male protagonist in a wuxia novel is usually one with the greatest potentials.

You can see the same reflected in our world with women going after musicians in small bands who have something special, junior sport stars who have the abilities get pro contracts, medical and law students (who may become rich doctors & lawyers) etc.

###

Far often, the readers identify too much with the heroes or their girls in the novels through their personalities alone and forget that they are not in the same league by a long shot when it comes to abilities and looks. The most prominent example here is how Zhang Wuji is often criticized and questioned on why he's able to attract so many top girls. People tend to put it down for him being a male protagonist in a novel written by a male author - yeah yeah male fantasy & all that jazzy sh!t. The kinder folks say that he's kind-hearted, brave and a very very nice guy, hence the girls love him. However, they always fail to realise that he is:

- The #1 fighter in his world, highest inner energy, highest potentials while still at a very young age
- Best medical doctor
- Leader of the biggest organization, has deep connections with one of the major schools in wulin, and also has the respect of all other leaders
- Tall, muscular and good-looking (little less than pretty boy Song Qingshu but still very good looking - product of two pretty parents)

In our world, ZWJ would be like the (admittedly extremely rare) combination of a top sport star + top male model + top entrepreneur + top brain surgeon. Not to mention he's also a very nice guy, kind-hearted and brave as a lion.

Once you've written down such a list, it's quite easy to see that neither of his 4 girls would be even in the same league as his. It's only natural that he should deserve the attention of all 4.

[Candide]

Gosh, you are the one who said in the other thread that we shouldn't blame authors for writing things that 'doesn't happen in real life'. Now you are whining when I said novel is different from real life.

I disagree with you saying that such a scenario doesn't happen in real life. It does, and there's a perfect explanation for it.

[tape]

Yeah, like I've said before, martial arts/inner strength is pretty much equal to money in the modern world. What girl wouldn't fall for the richest guy in the world, or even just some really rich guy, or just the richest guy they've ever met?

If anything, it's a huge advantage and positive trait if you don't want to depict them as just gold diggers. A person with wealth in our society allows you the option of not working, traveling the world, experiencing the finer luxuries in life, along with the whole being kind and loving you forever thing. Wealth just happens to be a really good positive trait. In wuxia, ultra martial arts pretty much allows you to do the same types of things that normal people wouldn't be able to do. Travel without worry, revered where you go, it's a huge, huge plus.

Romance isn't just bullcrap love at first sight oh I love you forever and will love you forever, and it certainly isn't depicted as such in wuxia. All those perfect romances we see, the girl happens to be in love with the most powerful or at the very least in the top 99% of the people in the world in terms of power/prestige. Of course she's gonna stay with him! It's incredibly hard to fall for a poor man when you're accustomed to the company of a billionaire or millionaire.

Anyway, in SPW Yue Lingshan/Lin Pingzhi/Linghu Chong shows a really realistic love/romance triangle thing. It's very real to real life. In fact, there isn't really any unrealistic romances in wuxia story, except Xiao Feng not having the sex drive of fifty tigers and not doing women left and right.

[Candide]

Well there's that theory about Xiao Feng being a closet gay, particularly if you read the part about how much he admired his Jurchen sworn brother's ripped body...

[Guo Xiang]

Well there's that theory about Xiao Feng being a closet gay, particularly if you read the part about how much he admired his Jurchen sworn brother's ripped body...

That's an excellent idea for a M18 fanfiction.