MAJOR ANNOUNCEMENT: I don't hate Yeung Gor anymore.

[Ken Cheng]

Is that a scientifically accurate figure, Ken? Reliable sources inform me that such a degree of concentrated hatred can only be achieved via said person draining a sufficiently large amount of the hatred on tap worldwide that the rest of the world should enter a state of nirvana and form a perfect utopia.

Or, possibly, have an inverse effect and radiate outward, resulting in such oddities as:

1. Global economic meltdown.

2. International terrorist threats.

3. Environmental collapse.

4. God-awful popular music on the charts.

5. Dogs and cats living together.

[PJ]

The irony of starting this thread is that it's resulted in my hating Yeung Gor one-hundred times more than I did before.

Even if Li Mochou returned from the tomb, or if Miejue traveled forth in time, they would nevertheless be impressed with Ken's intense hatred of epic proportions.

[atlantean0208]

Is that a scientifically accurate figure, Ken? Reliable sources inform me that such a degree of concentrated hatred can only be achieved via said person draining a sufficiently large amount of the hatred on tap worldwide that the rest of the world should enter a state of nirvana and form a perfect utopia.

Hey, don't say anything more to Ken, he will just use his *BMSG* to suck the comment, dissolve it and put it into the sea of nothingness.

[LuNaR]

ken... too much hate is not good.

man at first i actually thought u dont hate yg anymore

[PJ]

man at first i actually thought u dont hate yg anymore

Yes, he got us excited for a brief moment.

[shortsight]

Or, possibly, have an inverse effect and radiate outward, resulting in such oddities as:

...

5. Dogs and cats living together.

Well, dogs and cats have been living together for ages. I have a friend who's house have dogs, cats, chickens, ducks, gooses, all living harmoniously within the same compound. There's also a small pond, with lots of fish, and the cats or dogs never jump in. The dogs would even protect the rest of them when foxes prowl on them!

[Ghaleon]

I have a major announcement to make.

I don't hate Yeung Gor anymore.

Yes, after hating this character for nearly twenty-five years, I have decided to call a truce.

The reason? I finally realized something.

He's a fictional character.

Wait: I know what you're thinking - "Ken, that was OBVIOUS from the beginning!" Well, yes and no. Obviously, I knew he was a fictional character in a fictional world from day one.

The problem is, I've always judged him by REAL WORLD standards.

If a guy such as Yeung Gor did the things he did in real life (I'm talking about the negative things, not the heroic, good ones), he'd likely end up in a lot of trouble with a lot of people.

But he can get away with it because he lives in a fantasy world where the rules are different.

Having accepted that, I think I don't need to hate him anymore.

You know what? Screw it.

I don't think I could stop hating Yeung Gor any more than I could stop eating and breathing, and the unexpected results of this thread are proof of that.

My problems these past few days have been, in their own twisted way, because of this damned character again.

I think I might have a *slightly* better grip on my sanity if there's a Yeung Gor to despise and hate.

It's worked for a quarter century; why stop now?

So the hate is back, and it burns brighter than ever.

DEATH AND CURSES TO YEUNG GOR!

So let me sum it up. you hate YG because he causes you trouble (for
some reason or another) and the fact that you judge YG by real world standards?

and on the other hand, you like hui mun keung because he gets away with the things he does in a real life setting? So you find HMK more "cooler"?

[Ken Cheng]

So let me sum it up. you hate YG because he causes you trouble (for
some reason or another) and the fact that you judge YG by real world standards?

Something like that.

It's a resentment coming from the fact that when I was a teenager, I was similar to Yeung Gor in certain ways (not the good ones, I confess), but instead of getting sympathy and respect for it, I got my proverbial butt handed to me time and again.

And I could never understand why...

and on the other hand, you like hui mun keung because he gets away with the things he does in a real life setting? So you find HMK more "cooler"?

Yeung Gor represents the parts of me that I hate in myself.

Hui Mun Keung represents the things I aspire to, and that I can *almost* achieve in some of my better moments.

Kind of weird that that Huang Xiaoming dude (your avatar) played both characters. I've never seen his Yeung Gor, but I've heard bad things about him.

But it was Andy Lau's (an actor I do not dislike) Yeung Gor that got me hating the character, and Chow Yun Fat's Hui Mun Keung that intrigued me about that character.

[Ghaleon]

Something like that.

It's a resentment coming from the fact that when I was a teenager, I was similar to Yeung Gor in certain ways (not the good ones, I confess), but instead of getting sympathy and respect for it, I got my proverbial butt handed to me time and again.

And I could never understand why...

Yeung Gor represents the parts of me that I hate in myself.

Hui Mun Keung represents the things I aspire to, and that I can *almost* achieve in some of my better moments.

Kind of weird that that Huang Xiaoming dude (your avatar) played both characters. I've never seen his Yeung Gor, but I've heard bad things about him.

But it was Andy Lau's (an actor I do not dislike) Yeung Gor that got me hating the character, and Chow Yun Fat's Hui Mun Keung that intrigued me about that character.

Ahhh that makes better sense. but YG didn't get away with everything. he eventually lost his arm What did you feel about Miu Kiu Wai's YH (YG's father)?

Yeah HXM is better in modern series than ancient ones.

Yeah i also like HMK. Sometimes i aspire to live his lifestyle.

to be honest, i don't think anybody living in modern society can get away with the things YG has done (he's pissed off away too many people). the sick part is that YG ends up with all the chicks longing for him and a nice wife to boot (lil dragongirl). that's pure fantasy of course.

[Ken Cheng]

Ahhh that makes better sense. but YG didn't get away with everything. he eventually lost his arm

He lost his arm, and he got his butt physically kicked by some villains, but that's OK because he got the respect of the *good* people, and finally, of all those attractive young ladies.

That last thing, more than anything, probably fuels my resentment for the bastard because in real life, it NEVER happens that way...and the poor bastard who tries to emulate Yeung Gor (or just happens to have similar characteristics) is going to get quite the opposite of what the character did.

What did you feel about Miu Kiu Wai's YH (YG's father)?

I didn't like him or hate him. He was meant to be the villain of LOCH, and he did his job adequately (high marks for the evil part, but lower marks for actually being effective at doing evil).

Yeah HXM is better in modern series than ancient ones.

I was impressed by how well he managed to portray Hui Mun Keung on his own terms. No, he couldn't even hope to approach Chow Yun Fat's original version, but being able to take on the character without embarrassing himself (like Sunny Chan did) or making the character unrecognizable (like Leslie Cheung did) is no mean feat, so the proverbial hats off to Huang for portraying a Hui Mun Keung that was distinctly his, but at the same time, respectful of the role established by Chow.

to be honest, i don't think anybody living in modern society can get away with the things YG has done (he's pissed off away too many people). the sick part is that YG ends up with all the chicks longing for him and a nice wife to boot (lil dragongirl). that's pure fantasy of course.

EXACTLY! And this is perhaps what I hate most about him. I can kind of, sort of overlook some of the other stuff, but this has disgusted me from Day One.

[Ghaleon]

He lost his arm, and he got his butt physically kicked by some villains, but that's OK because he got the respect of the *good* people, and finally, of all those attractive young ladies.

YG has that type of attitude that pisses off lot of guys but which girls are seemingly attracted to. its his playboy/bad boy/rebel/arrogant/kiddy type of personality and stubborn loyalty and stubborn grudges. the thing with those young ladies is that he didn't even want them. what guy has lot of girls longing for him when he doesn't even want them back. that's unfair eh?

That last thing, more than anything, probably fuels my resentment for the bastard because in real life, it NEVER happens that way...and the poor bastard who tries to emulate Yeung Gor (or just happens to have similar characteristics) is going to get quite the opposite of what the character did.

maybe jin yong was living out his yang guo fantasies in ROCH the poor kid who emulated YG probably be beaten up in high school.

Yeah chow yun fatt's HMK is definitely the best portrayal (it's a legendary role). But HXM did a good modern version of HMK. i think HXM was meant for the role because his characters of yang guo and wei xiao bo were poorly received by the wuxia-watching community. he just sucks in ancient costumes (overacts).

EXACTLY! And this is perhaps what I hate most about him. I can kind of, sort of overlook some of the other stuff, but this has disgusted me from Day One.

you might be able to get away with some YG-ness in some situations though. but not many. the real world is much more complicated than a wuxia fantasy one.

[Ken Cheng]

YG has that type of attitude that pisses off lot of guys but which girls are seemingly attracted to. its his playboy/bad boy/rebel/arrogant/kiddy type of personality and stubborn loyalty and stubborn grudges. the thing with those young ladies is that he didn't even want them. what guy has lot of girls longing for him when he doesn't even want them back. that's unfair eh?

Unfair and unreal. I think in the real world, girls would moon over Yeung Gor as long as he remains a character in fiction. If those girls actually started dating such a guy, they'd probably dump his a$$ PRONTO.

Scratch that: on Earth-Reality, that guy wouldn't be able to get a date, let alone be some kind of super chick-magnet.

maybe jin yong was living out his yang guo fantasies in ROCH the poor kid who emulated YG probably be beaten up in high school.

I guess. Yeung Gor only works on paper, or on the television/movie screen. Nobody could do what he does in real life and get away with it, let alone become admired/fawned over.

Yeah chow yun fatt's HMK is definitely the best portrayal (it's a legendary role). But HXM did a good modern version of HMK. i think HXM was meant for the role because his characters of yang guo and wei xiao bo were poorly received by the wuxia-watching community. he just sucks in ancient costumes (overacts).

In that (not the overacting part, though), Huang actually has a great deal in common with Chow. As brilliant as Chow was as Hui Mun Keung, he stinks at doing wuxia drama. His Ling Wu Chung from SPW '84 was completely forgettable, and I didn't find Chow's Lee Mo Bak from CROUCHING TIGER, HIDDEN DRAGON anything special either.

Chow Yun Fat is at his best when playing characters from the 20th/21st Centuries.

you might be able to get away with some YG-ness in some situations though. but not many. the real world is much more complicated than a wuxia fantasy one.

Screw Yeung Gor, man. He's the absolute worst male role model in fiction.

If you have to have a fictional role model, Hui Mun Keung is a much better way to go.

[Ghaleon]

Unfair and unreal. I think in the real world, girls would moon over Yeung Gor as long as he remains a character in fiction. If those girls actually started dating such a guy, they'd probably dump his a$$ PRONTO.

Scratch that: on Earth-Reality, that guy wouldn't be able to get a date, let alone be some kind of super chick-magnet.

He's probably too immature eh?

I guess. Yeung Gor only works on paper, or on the television/movie screen. Nobody could do what he does in real life and get away with it, let alone become admired/fawned over.

i'm wonder if its more his personality that the girls in ROCH fell in love with or more his looks? I think YG is supposed to be handsome and dashing. the one personality trait that girls probably do like is his stubborn loyalty. girls do like loyal guys.

In that (not the overacting part, though), Huang actually has a great deal in common with Chow. As brilliant as Chow was as Hui Mun Keung, he stinks at doing wuxia drama. His Ling Wu Chung from SPW '84 was completely forgettable, and I didn't find Chow's Lee Mo Bak from CROUCHING TIGER, HIDDEN DRAGON anything special either.

Chow Yun Fat is at his best when playing characters from the 20th/21st Centuries.

Yeah both actors seem to play a better role in non-ancient dramas.

Screw Yeung Gor, man. He's the absolute worst male role model in fiction.

If you have to have a fictional role model, Hui Mun Keung is a much better way to go.

Agreed. HMK is kickass. He represents the best in chinese cool. The only thing about him is that i get the urge to smoke lol.

[Ken Cheng]

He's probably too immature eh?

Too immature, too clingy, too emo, too a whole hell of a lot of things that modern girls in the real world would see as HUGE red flags. The women of wuxia are truly blind because they see NONE of these red flags.

i'm beginning to think if its more his personality that the girls in ROCH fell in love with or more his looks? I think YG is supposed to be handsome and dashing.

The looks are a big part of it, but the unrealistic part is how the looks mask the obvious personality flaws. No woman in the real world would be fooled by a handsome face that long.

Agreed. HMK is kickass. He represents the best in chinese cool.

Ironically, he became this character by co-opting the best of Western cool and making it his own.

Chow Yun Fat once said in an interview that to bring the character of Hui Mun Keung to life, he studied the work of classic American actors such as Humphrey Bogart, Cary Grant, Gary Cooper, Gregory Peck, Robert Redford, Paul Newman, and Robert DeNiro and took some of the best features of each to create the Hui Mun Keung character. If you want to act the part of a cool character, these legendary leading men from the Golden Age of American cinema are a good source of inspiration.

[Ghaleon]

Too immature, too clingy, too emo, too a whole hell of a lot of things that modern girls in the real world would see as HUGE red flags. The women of wuxia are truly blind because they see NONE of these red flags.

Oh right, i forgot about the emo and clingy part. Most modern girls would be turned off by that. When YG yells out "guu guuuuuu guuuuu guuuuuu", i think most girls would slap YG in the face and tell him to be more manly and mature.

Maybe back then in the JY-universe, wuxia chicks like emo and clingy guys? LOL. Maybe that was the in-thing back then haha.

The looks are a big part of it, but the unrealistic part is how the looks mask the obvious personality flaws. No woman in the real world would be fooled by a handsome face that long.

Aren't guys fooled by pretty faces (of girls) all the time?

So i guess Andy Lau was considered one of the most handsome back in the TVB golden 80's?

Ironically, he became this character by co-opting the best of Western cool and making it his own.

Chow Yun Fat once said in an interview that to bring the character of Hui Mun Keung to life, he studied the work of classic American actors such as Humphrey Bogart, Cary Grant, Gary Cooper, Gregory Peck, Robert Redford, Paul Newman, and Robert DeNiro and took some of the best features of each to create the Hui Mun Keung character. If you want to act the part of a cool character, these legendary leading men from the Golden Age of American cinema are a good source of inspiration.

Yeah i definitely think Hui Mun Keung is the coolest chinese fictional character i seen. Def a good role model to aspire to

the ironic thing is that HMK ends up being shot to death (and without his girl) while YG ends up living happily with little dragon girl.

[Ken Cheng]

Oh right, i forgot about the emo and clingy part. Most modern girls would be turned off by that. When YG yells out "guu guuuuuu guuuuu guuuuuu", i think most girls would slap YG in the face and tell him to be more manly and mature.

Assuming they don't just flat out DITCH the loser first.

Maybe back then in the JY-universe, wuxia chicks like emo and clingy guys? LOL. Maybe that was the in-thing back then haha.

Meh...I doubt it. Jin Yong created a dozen young hero characters, and none of the others were like Yeung Gor.

Aren't guys fooled by pretty faces (of girls) all the time?

Yep, all the time.

The sick part is that even if the guy is bright enough to know he's being had, he usually *still* can't resist. To recognize is one thing; to resist successfully is something else altogether.

So i guess Andy Lau was considered one of the most handsome back in the TVB golden 80's?

That dude has always been something of a chick-magnet...even now, at nearly fifty years old.

the ironic thing is that HMK ends up being shot to death (and without his girl) while YG ends up living happily with little dragon girl.

Hui Mun Keung's fate, as far as I can tell, is much closer to what actually happens in life than is Yeung Gor's fate.

[Ghaleon]

Assuming they don't just flat out DITCH the loser first.

haha. btw have you tried out other adaptations of ROCH? Louis Koo's portrayal isn't as annoying as Andy's. I bet you you won't hate louis koo's portrayal as much as you did Andy's.

Meh...I doubt it. Jin Yong created a dozen young hero characters, and none of the others were like Yeung Gor.

That's true. I respect Ling Hu Chong the most. The dude is laid-back, very cheerful, not selfish, a happy-go-lucky type of guy. I could easily see why Ren Ying Ying loved him. LHC's personality traits translate well to the real world.

Yep, all the time.

The sick part is that even if the guy is bright enough to know he's being had, he usually *still* can't resist. To recognize is one thing; to resist successfully is something else altogether.

Yeah, dangerous. poison ivy.

Hui Mun Keung's fate, as far as I can tell, is much closer to what actually happens in life than is Yeung Gor's fate.

That's true. that's one of the reasons why his character is endearing. Tragic outcomes tend to leave a lasting impression.

[PJ]

haha. btw have you tried out other adaptations of ROCH? Louis Koo's portrayal isn't as annoying as Andy's. I bet you you won't hate louis koo's portrayal as much as you did Andy's.

Umm dude, I think he *wants* to hold on to the -hatred-, it somehow makes him feel better, so let's just let him have this wish

[Ghaleon]

Umm dude, I think he *wants* to hold on to the -hatred-, it somehow makes him feel better, so let's just let him have this wish

oh he'll probably still hate louis koo's character, but its just that the hatred will be little bit diminished

[Ken Cheng]

haha. btw have you tried out other adaptations of ROCH? Louis Koo's portrayal isn't as annoying as Andy's. I bet you you won't hate louis koo's portrayal as much as you did Andy's.

I've seen parts of the Louis Koo version of ROCH, and I must admit, from what I saw, his Yeung Gor was less annoying than Lau's.

That Lau's Yeung Gor was annoying was not Lau's fault, though. I've seen him in many different roles in different series and movies, and he didn't annoy me in any of those. It's the way the TVB scriptwriters wrote Yeung Gor's character in ROCH '83. TVB was actually fortunate that they did cast the likable Andy Lau as this unlikable character or they might have had a disaster on their hands.

ROCH '95 (Koo version), though having a less annoying Yeung Gor (and correspondingly less annoying Little Dragon Girl), struck me as boring compared to ROCH '83, though. The two main leads were less irritating, but somehow much more boring than their annoying '83 counterparts.

That's true. I respect Ling Hu Chong the most. The dude is laid-back, very cheerful, not selfish, a happy-go-lucky type of guy. I could easily see why Ren Ying Ying loved him. LHC's personality traits translate well to the real world.

My two experiences with the Ling Wu Chung character were Chow Yun Fat's 1984 series depiction and Sam Hui's 1990 film depiction, neither of which left a strong impression on me. I don't think either actor gave the Ling Wu Chung character any real color. I hear Jacky Lui did a good job in SOD '96, however.

Yeah, pretty girls are dangerous. poison ivy.

Some of them aren't even deliberately, maliciously so. They're not out to hurt anybody, but they're just sort of...careless about the effect they have on people.

That's true. that's one of the reasons why his character is endearing. Tragic outcomes tend to leave a lasting impression.

It's the leit motif of THE BUND: life sucks, and then you die.