Heavenly Sword and Dragon Sabre 2009 《倚天屠龙记》 - Deng Chao, Ady An, Liu Jing

[seiken]

ZZR actress is a definite miscast and may be a deliberate attempt to avoid splitting viewers' support for a ZWJ/ZM pairup. No one can feel sympathetic towards this version's ZZR.

I second that. LJ had little screentime from the start, but even when she was on screen I had no sense of her portraying ZZR's 'good side.' She seemed cold from the get go, so much that I failed to notice a change in her character after MJ died.

[Wuxialover]

Heh, I feel the same way. The scenery looks nice and all but the color...always gloomy looking. I hate it, especially when it's supposed to be a happy scene and the everything looks dark. The editing is plain bad.

That's it! That's the word I was looking for, "gloomy".

ZJZ's work is often dark and gloomy, that's what gave me that claustrophobic feeling.

Just watched ep 1. My point remain.

[Haruhi6]

ZJZ also likes his doing having backlighting for characters. I don't mind it sometimes but he over does it. I LOCH it was only done for Mei Chao Feng, but after that he went crazy with it, esp in ROCH. I could not believe how many times I saw people with a backlight and hair blowing in the wind... sometimes it was even in indoor scenes.

HSDS was not so bad, but I def see the backlight at times, it does wash out the faces a bit, and it always looks like night time indoors bc of it, until they go outside and you find out it is day time. But the hair blowing in the wind was toned down. I appreciated that.

[icrayray]

I was just watching ep34(the wedding scene)
Anyone noticed DC's expression, he doesn't seem too happy even though its suppose to be a joyful day for him. Anyone think it's a sign that he still has ZM in his heart even when we was about to marry ZZR? lol I am so rioting for ZM

[forgot password]

i think this is a very good Yttlj adaptation, second only to The Evil Cult.

[NuDaFu]

[QUOTE=Wuxialover]

Originally Posted by dictionary $this->handle_bbcode_img_match('http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif')
Heh, I feel the same way. The scenery looks nice and all but the color...always gloomy looking. I hate it, especially when it's supposed to be a happy scene and the everything looks dark. The editing is plain bad.

That's it! That's the word I was looking for, "gloomy".

ZJZ's work is often dark and gloomy, that's what gave me that claustrophobic feeling.

You would literally suffocate with some of Tsui Hark's films then (especially the more noir kind...my film standard of 'dark and gloomy'). That's why I don't think HSDS09 is all that dark, compared to Tsui Hark's work, it's as bright as day .

Forgot to mention, I loved ZM's little 'itsy, bitsy spider' when she showed her apparent displeasure that ZWJ had brought XZ along for the trip. It would be rude to say nay, but I loved how it was conveyed non-verbally. Oh so arrogrant yet subtle.

Some feel Ady/ZM didn't 'keep to character' after so got obvious in her liking of ZWJ. I don't think so. There were definitely moments where the 'old' ZM was still present, e.g.

click to show/hide spoilers

When ZM is experiencing the pain from White Bone Claw. She definitely looked like she would swear if she was allowed to, and she was damn angry at being in such pain. Usually, one would expect vulnerability and weakness while she is such a state and in the arms of ZWJ. Not this ZM.

From this adaptation, I find ZM not particularly 'mature' in her feelings. Yes, she is willing to die for ZWJ, she obviously cares about him, she supports him unconditionally. But, the way she shows her affection include continously 'picking on him', coveting him almost as if his a favourite toy. When,

click to show/hide spoilers

ZM got ZWJ to admit that he liked her, she was giddy with joy. The expression gave the impression of a kid getting a toy for Christmas rather than a lover receiving confirmation of reciprocation.

I feel ZWJ more or less picks up on this, because he grumps once that,

click to show/hide spoilers

What use that ZM is important to him. From ZM's actions, she doesn't seem to find him important, what with her always scheming against him and causing him such grief.

I found ZWJ so adorable with this comment, because it reflects to me that he is concerned ZM is only 'taking' and not 'giving' in the potential relationship. ZWJ wants to make sure ZM regards him just as much as he does her. Making sure if the lady really likes him...too.

Or maybe it's because I've just recently finished watching Ady's Xi Shi portrayal in 'The Great Revival'. Everything seems slightly less mature compared to that at the moment. May I say, if Ady appeared as Xi Shi in HSDS, it would definitely render ZWJ more or less incoherent the majority of the time spent with her. She's phenomenally stunning as Xi Shi...my new standard for ancient beauty actress. Well, thankfully not I suppose, seeing as not many people are happy with LJ/ZZR anyway, Ady would make LJ look like the wicked witch .

[j2j2j2]

A question about the ending

click to show/hide spoilers

I don't understand why they were celebrating. They didn't win that battle with the Yuan army right?

The only reason they left was because ZM begged her dad and threatened to kill herself.

So what's to stop them from coming back?

Also, I remember in a few adaptations, ZWJ successfully uses the Wu Mi Yi Book to hold back the opposing army, or am I mistaken?

Some feel Ady/ZM didn't 'keep to character' after so got obvious in her liking of ZWJ. I don't think so.

Yeah, I agree. I think once she got to know ZWJ better, then her character started to feel more natural around him, like how she was with her dad in the beginning.

From this adaptation, I find ZM not particularly 'mature' in her feelings. Yes, she is willing to die for ZWJ, she obviously cares about him, she supports him unconditionally. But, the way she shows her affection include continously 'picking on him', coveting him almost as if his a favourite toy. When,

click to show/hide spoilers

ZM got ZWJ to admit that he liked her, she was giddy with joy. The expression gave the impression of a kid getting a toy for Christmas rather than a lover receiving confirmation of reciprocation.

That's an interesting way of viewing it. I can see where you're coming from, but I guess when I saw it I didn't get that feeling.

I felt her attitude was mainly due to her being a princess and always getting what she wanted---like when she clapped her hands at the restaurant and nothing happened

But I do agree that they didn't...

click to show/hide spoilers

really show the inner struggle she faced between her father, her country, and her love of ZWJ.

That's why I've always felt the 2000 version with Gigi Lai did a great job of that. Where after she "betrayed" her family and country, she goes back to accept her punishment.

~~~~~~~

Also, about the end part...yeah, that was weird. It was like one of those horror movies where at the very last second the monster pops out.

Haha...

But it's not necessary a sad ending, just really strange.

[Katherine Yang]

I wonder if it's only me to find the sweet scene between WJ and ZM in peasant disguise kinda exaggerated. I does love the way WJ suddenly kissed on her cheek but they should stop at this instead of WJ acted as he fainted away. That scene I prefer they had little embarrassed like staring at each other then WJ moved away.

And what does everybody think abt the OST of this version? I used to hope they would have some nice sub songs as Xian Jian 3 (Pian ai, Da ying bu ai ni...). However, only the opening theme (Hua xia ying xiong) is good. Ending theme is quite bad and there is no sub songs (just some instrumentals. I guess it's Zhang Ji Zhong's style, right? At least they can put an insert song like LOCH 2008 with "Wo zhi neng ai ni" which is really suited an ancient drama.

[NuDaFu]

A question about the ending


I don't understand why they were celebrating. They didn't win that battle with the Yuan army right?

click to show/hide spoilers

The only reason they left was because ZM begged her dad and threatened to kill herself.

So what's to stop them from coming back?

Also, I remember in a few adaptations, ZWJ successfully uses the Wu Mi Yi Book to hold back the opposing army, or am I mistaken?

I didn't get it either. If,

click to show/hide spoilers

ZM hadn't shown up, begged her father to let them go, ZWJ would be a 'cooked chook' not having a male bonding party with his mates over alcohol.

I think ZWJ does successfully apply Ao Fei's War manual, but at the end of the day, he could not beat the group of Persian? fighters accompanying Yu Yang Wang. It really was ZM who 'saved the day'.

I was disappointed with the scene though. I found it a bit melodramatic with the fire and rain. Ady couldn't get some good moving emotion across the noise and annoyance of the water in her face. I would've preferred none of this and a focus on the emotional part of the sacrifice she was making. In the novel, I remember quite a graphic account of her stabbing a dagger in her chest, and actually letting it sink in a certain depth, to really make her father know she was serious. The scene is a very profound one, yet I don't think they did justice to it with the way it was portrayed in this adaptation.

I was really annoyed with all the 'Ming Boys' partying. I thought it strange that no regard whatsoever was given to ZM's part in it. All the victory and credit went to ZWJ. It's like, duh! A corpse wouldn't be this happy if ZM didn't give up everything to save your hide!

I felt her attitude was mainly due to her being a princess and always getting what she wanted---like when she clapped her hands at the restaurant and nothing happened

That's what I mean about the 'emotional immaturity'. ZM seemed to address her feelings/relationship with the same attitude as being a princess. But then again, being extremely smart can make one prone to a low EQ.

It was like one of those horror movies where at the very last second the monster pops out.

That has to be the best satirical description of HSDS09 ending!

In celebration of the HSDS theme these days, I went out and bought HSDS86! It's been so long, I can hardly remember it.

[loislane]

From this adaptation, I find ZM not particularly 'mature' in her feelings. Yes, she is willing to die for ZWJ, she obviously cares about him, she supports him unconditionally. But, the way she shows her affection include continously 'picking on him', coveting him almost as if his a favourite toy. When,

click to show/hide spoilers

ZM got ZWJ to admit that he liked her, she was giddy with joy. The expression gave the impression of a kid getting a toy for Christmas rather than a lover receiving confirmation of reciprocation.

Are you talking abt the conversation that took after ZWJ took ZM to XX but XX and ZZR were nowhere to be found? Yeah, I did find her reaction to that was a bit weird. I was expecting for her to be more taken aback or be a bit embarrassed about it. But then again this scene follows the novel dialogues to the tee. I guess Jin Yong himself did intend to make ZM's character like that.

Actually most of the scenes in this adaptation really is faithful to the novel so much, that it surprises me a bit. Like that puppet scene in the middle of the town, a scene from the novel that had never appear in any other adaptations, as far as I know.

About the song, the opening is so-so good. And the ending, well... I loved the instrumental version(sunnysnow posted the link before, thanks!^^), but I agree the song itself is quite bad, probably because of Ady's voice

LOL. The ending is plain stupid. I'll pretend it doesn't happen that way XD

[TiffTiff]

I was curious on how ZZR know where ZWJ & ZM were at to pop up like that
The ending show ZM & ZZR in a Mongolian tent that was supposedly ZM's old house??? Was the tent moving, or being hauled by horses??? If it was staying still, then how in the world does ZZR pop out and in the background had moving horses???

I thought some of annoyances in this version includes (Feel free to add to the list ) :

1. The wind blowing actor/actress' hair every time the camera is focusing on them
2. Too much smoke/foggy affect
3. Some extra scenes were too long that it became weird. For example: ZM keep playing with her wine cup at the scene where ZJW first saw her
The tickling feet in midair
Another one was the cat fight, hay throwing scene Snake Island
The scene where ZE and ZWJ united again, ZE hit ZWJ too much because ZWJ thought ZE was dead and buried her

I thought if they could shorten those scenes down to 15-30 seconds rather than 3 minutes, the viewers wouldn't be so annoy . They should use those extra time and focus on the actors/actress' facial expression on emotional scenes.

[yin_shen_quan]

Ep 33:

I have 4 questions:
- Who is the young man who just joined ZWJ and ZM? He calls ZWJ JiaoZhu
- The inn they stayed at looked familiar but it didnt click until YX and the other Ming cult members entered...this is where YX and JXF first met, isnt it?
- Does anyone know the filming location of the high-altitude covered overpass/bridge where the Ming Cult members were? I'm guessing somewhere on Wudang Shan, but I have not been able to track down the name of the exact structure.
- They have not showed Song QingShu going to WuDang to betray them yet. Does that happen in this version?

After seeing more scenes of ZZR...I liked her more when she had fewer lines, but I'm liking how there is yet no indication of what happened that night on Snake Island (we still have yet to see the two swords and ZZR practicing the White Bone Claw). I'm slightly envious of those who are watching HSDS for the first time and are in suspense.

[edit] Never mind, I'm near the end of 33 now. I actually prefer evil ZZR

[Wuxialover]

You would literally suffocate with some of Tsui Hark's films then (especially the more noir kind...my film standard of 'dark and gloomy'). That's why I don't think HSDS09 is all that dark, compared to Tsui Hark's work, it's as bright as day .

Guess it's just my taste then. Sorry.

Like how I'm watching this mostly for Liu Jing. (And of course the story) I know I know, bad taste on the LJ part, say it. But I kind of like her. Perhaps she's not meant for ZZR, but, I don't know, I just kinda have a thing for her.

Judging by how much she's being frown upon here, I'm in the minority.

But if that's how it's gonna go, I'll chop my arm off and become Yang Guo
Oh wait, that's not how it went. Nevermind. heh

[icrayray]

Just finished watching the whole HSDS series. Yea, I am with you guys on the disappointment in the ending, I almost didn't want to acknowledge that ZZR popped out of no where and said something like that.
Well now that the whole series is out, I'm just curious about what you guys think about this HSDS?
Anyone think this HSDS is better than the previous ones?
How about the characters?
I was amazed by ady and DC's acting.
Have never seen any DC series before, HSDS was my first series with him in it but I got to say he did a good job despite all the negative comments on his looks.
And ady's ZM blew me away. My favorite ZM used to be gigi lai from HSDS2000 but after watching HSDS2009, I think I might actually give ady the trophy for the best ZM.
By the way does anyone know if there's a best/favorite ZM poll up in spcnet with Ady in it?

[loislane]

Anyone think this HSDS is better than the previous ones?
How about the characters?

Yup, for me this is the best HSDS adaptation out there.
I loved Deng Chao's portrayal as ZWJ as much as Tony Leung's portrayal, they're a tie as #1 on my list^^
Ady An has stole #1 rank from ZhangMin and Kitty Lai in my list as the Best ZM.

There are some disappointments, of course, but the plus points are alot more, for me, esp. as a fan of the book, I really appreciated the faithful plot details.

But then again, I'm a big fan of ZJZ productions anyway, since XAJH (only his DGSD and RoCH that kinda disappointed me in overall)

[icrayray]

You too loislane? lol people were talking so much about kitty lai and ZhangMin that I thought no one could have beaten them in their ZM portrayal but I guess you and I have the same taste so far for ady as the best ZM.
By the way, so many people were like bashing HSDS saying that it was the worst of the three triology but I find it to be my favorite especially after I watched this one.
I'm with you loislane, I wasn't so impressed with ROCH2006 either.
By the way, anyone know if the director for LOCH was ZJZ or not?

[loislane]

By the way, anyone know if the director for LOCH was ZJZ or not?

LoCH2003
Producer: Zhang Ji Zhong
Director: Yu Min
Action director: Zhao Jian

RoCH2006
Chief producer: Zhang Ji Zhong
Producers: Ma Zhong Jun, Pu Shu Lin, Chi Chen Xi, Tie Fu
Chief director: Yu Min
Action director: Zhao Jian

HSDS2009
Chief producer: Zhang Ji Zhong
Executive producer: Song Ya Ping
Chief director: Zhao Jian
Cinematographers: Yu Min, Guan Jian Xiong

Among his Jin Yong adaptation productions, ZJZ had only chief-directed himself once, and that is for Bie Xue Jian (Sword Stained with Royal Blood). [FYI, the directors for Xiao Ao Jiang Hu has never work for him anymore in his other productions.]

[yin_shen_quan]

By the way, anyone know if the director for LOCH was ZJZ or not?

It depends on which LOCH you are talking about. The newest one (2008) wasnt ZJZ. It was Li Guo Li (in which Yellow Robed Maiden played Mu Nianci).

ZJZ did LOCH back in 2003, but to me his style wasnt really recognizable. It was more earthy (in terms of the palette and cinematography), compared to his signature ethereal settings, so I wouldnt be surprised if you didnt recognize it as his work.

[NuDaFu]

I wonder if it's only me to find the sweet scene between WJ and ZM in peasant disguise kinda exaggerated.

Yep, I found it exaggerated too. Cute and adorable though, but quite out of place.

And what does everybody think abt the OST of this version? I used to hope they would have some nice sub songs as Xian Jian 3 (Pian ai, Da ying bu ai ni...). However, only the opening theme (Hua xia ying xiong) is good. Ending theme is quite bad and there is no sub songs (just some instrumentals. I guess it's Zhang Ji Zhong's style, right? At least they can put an insert song like LOCH 2008 with "Wo zhi neng ai ni" which is really suited an ancient drama.

XJ3 and LOCH08 are considered C-pop. I respectfully disagree that the songs for these dramas are suited to imperial china themes. Chinese instrumentals are supposed to achieve harmony between humans and natural sounds (Daoist). The chinese cultures' way of life has very strong Daoist influences, especially during the ancient times, so, there is nothing wrong with ZJZ creating an 'ancient mood' with instrumentals. C-pop songs are produced by instruments of the modern age, and I don't find the cadence, tempo, or timbre remotely in alignment with a period drama. The very fact that the character "ai" is in the lyrics of the song reflects an non-ancient Chinese attitude. Ancient Chinese society ranked indirectness/subtlety with civility.

I was expecting for her to be more taken aback or be a bit embarrassed about it. But then again this scene follows the novel dialogues to the tee. I guess Jin Yong himself did intend to make ZM's character like that.

I noticed that in some parts, it was quite faithful to the novel too. However, I was comparing against ZM personalities from past adaptations. I don't like the novel ZM much.

There are certainly some situations from the novel that are stirling, and wonderful to be adapted to screen. Characterisation and emotion wise, I always look for new perspectives, because this is plainly an area of weakness, IMHO, from the novels.

I was curious on how ZZR know where ZWJ & ZM were at to pop up like that
The ending show ZM & ZZR in a Mongolian tent that was supposedly ZM's old house??? Was the tent moving, or being hauled by horses??? If it was staying still, then how in the world does ZZR pop out and in the background had moving horses???

ZZR at that point was at a level MA that allowed her to be quite capable of 'whizzing through the air' (Qing Gong...don't know if that's the write Pinyin), so a slowly moving yurt wouldn't have been a problem for her. Although, I don't know if learning Jiu Yin Zhen Jing ups one's Qing Gong. Maybe potentially increasing internal power improves that area of MA anyway? Something to ponder.

The scene where ZE and ZWJ united again, ZE hit ZWJ too much because ZWJ thought ZE was dead and buried her

ZWJ only hit her once, albeit hard. I didn't find this part excessive. It was more or less in spirit with the novel at this point.

I actually was very impressed with the range of emotions that flitted over Ady/ZM's face when ZWJ was throttling her. From shock-betrayal-hurt-submission to dying. It was a masterful emotional performance. Especially when it was obvious she still was recovering from her cold at this point (red nose ).

Guess it's just my taste then. Sorry.

Like how I'm watching this mostly for Liu Jing. (And of course the story) I know I know, bad taste on the LJ part, say it. But I kind of like her. Perhaps she's not meant for ZZR, but, I don't know, I just kinda have a thing for her.

Judging by how much she's being frown upon here, I'm in the minority.

But if that's how it's gonna go, I'll chop my arm off and become Yang Guo
Oh wait, that's not how it went. Nevermind. heh

No need to be sorry, Wuxialover. Your views are equally as valid as everyone else's. Heck, if we all agreed on something, how boring would that be? It would make a forum quite redundant.

I usually root for the underdog too, being a devil's advocate is also very fun. I just happen to prefer ZM over ZZR this time. Not because everyone else is (I usually like going against the crowd rather than with it ). I love Machiavellian personalities, and I associate ZM to be such a personality. I also have a personal preference for ZM because I have Mongolian heritage myself, and have more than been called a 'Mongolian Princess' (though that irritates the eyebrows off me ).

Well, if you chop your arm off, make sure it's not your predominate one . You'll be looking forward to messy writing and eating if you do that...heheheh. Unless of course you are ambidextrous.

I didn't know BXJ was directed by ZJZ himself. I may actually watch it, even though I don't particularly like the storyline.

[icrayray]

thank you loislane and yin_shen_quan for clarifying it for me. Yea, I never really watched LOCH2003 before but I caught glimpses of it and I certainly did not recognize it as ZJZ's work. And sorry for not clarifying which LOCH I was asking about. I was talking about the LOCH2008, thinking it was another ZJZ production. lol I was about to start a discussion on which of the condor triology was the best from the producer ZJZ but I guess I can't now because I didn't watch LOCH2003.