Trapped in China!

[sniffles]

I'm in Beijing and after my trip to the US, I think China is still pretty far behind in actual living standards for the masses compared to other developed nations. US has about 1/4 of China's population but its economy is 3 times as large. It shows how much improvement China needs. Even other smaller developed nations provide a much better standard of living. Its still a good idea to live or study overseas.

The US is a different culture. We Americans just think about things in a different way than people in Asia. I suspect that in order for China to have a living standard more similar to the standards in the US or Western Europe, Chinese people would have to drastically change their way of thinking. I'm not sure that would be a good thing.

The standard of living in the US isn't necessarily better than in China, just different. Sure, it's nice for people to have electricity and indoor plumbing everywhere, but human beings got along just fine without those things for thousands of years.

[Trien Chieu]

The US is a different culture. We Americans just think about things in a different way than people in Asia. I suspect that in order for China to have a living standard more similar to the standards in the US or Western Europe, Chinese people would have to drastically change their way of thinking. I'm not sure that would be a good thing.

How?

The standard of living in the US isn't necessarily better than in China, just different. Sure, it's nice for people to have electricity and indoor plumbing everywhere, but human beings got along just fine without those things for thousands of years.

It's obvious that life in US/Canada/Australia/ect is better than life china/DevelopingCountries. Sure people can live without electricity, car, air condition, ect..., but life is definitely better with it. Life would be suck without a car here in Canada especially during the winter.

[Trinie]

Especially when the average income in developed nations is probably as much as hard-to-get "high-paying" jobs in China, if not more. One can say the prices of goods are cheaper in China but I find its not the case anymore, especially not significantly.

I heard that those high paying jobs in China are VERY competitive as well. ONe of my friends from China told me that hundreds if not thousands of people compete for the same job at times. One of my former classmates was so certain that she will return to China after we all graduate(we all graduated in August 2008). But now she is studying for another degree just so she can stay here longer. I guess life in the US is a lot more attractive then I originally thought. One of my other friends is trying to find a job here or someone she can marry just to stay here. Some are even asking a lawyer to help her fight for a green card to settle here permanently...

About the price of the goods, yea I can see that a lot of companies from China online are charging buyers in the US the same amount if not more in US dollars as sellers in the US charge buyers in the US. Therefore, things in China aren't that much cheaper anymore.

[flamer]

The US is a different culture. We Americans just think about things in a different way than people in Asia. I suspect that in order for China to have a living standard more similar to the standards in the US or Western Europe, Chinese people would have to drastically change their way of thinking. I'm not sure that would be a good thing.

The standard of living in the US isn't necessarily better than in China, just different. Sure, it's nice for people to have electricity and indoor plumbing everywhere, but human beings got along just fine without those things for thousands of years.

I dunno... I would suspect almost everyone in China would agree switching places with the US, in terms of standard of living.

[flamer]

I heard that those high paying jobs in China are VERY competitive as well. ONe of my friends from China told me that hundreds if not thousands of people compete for the same job at times. One of my former classmates was so certain that she will return to China after we all graduate(we all graduated in August 2008). But now she is studying for another degree just so she can stay here longer. I guess life in the US is a lot more attractive then I originally thought. One of my other friends is trying to find a job here or someone she can marry just to stay here. Some are even asking a lawyer to help her fight for a green card to settle here permanently...

About the price of the goods, yea I can see that a lot of companies from China online are charging buyers in the US the same amount if not more in US dollars as sellers in the US charge buyers in the US. Therefore, things in China aren't that much cheaper anymore.

Often these high paying jobs require high qualifications and experience but at the end of the day, its only equal to the... average joe's income in developed nations. Its a pretty sorry state but I suppose thats the same for most developing countries.

[Ren Wo Xing]

The US is a different culture. We Americans just think about things in a different way than people in Asia. I suspect that in order for China to have a living standard more similar to the standards in the US or Western Europe, Chinese people would have to drastically change their way of thinking. I'm not sure that would be a good thing.

The standard of living in the US isn't necessarily better than in China, just different. Sure, it's nice for people to have electricity and indoor plumbing everywhere, but human beings got along just fine without those things for thousands of years.

Oh boy...I have to totally disagree with you here. It somewhat reminds me of the attitude of some anthropologists who, when living/studying tribal cultures, refuse to provide medicine when they are sick or food when they are starving on the grounds that doing so would be 'interfering with their society'. It's the philosophical inverse of the well intentioned but misled paternalistic belief that it was the 'white man's burden' to uplift less developed civilizations, and I think it is just as wrongheaded.

Although culture is important, in the end culture is still fundamentally just an artificial social construct, intended to provide a framework for satisfying people's wants and material needs, be it safety, food, or modern convenience. The only people who think 'preserving culture' is greater than satisfying people's needs are those who have never really wanted for anything. Political disputes and repression aside, there is a reason why the Dalai Lama himself, a man who certainly loves his people, repeatedly says that China has brought many benefits in modernizing Tibet, and that joining the modern, developed world is good for Tibet (he mainly wants more political and religious freedom). There is also a reason why the loudest calls for 'preserving Tibet' and returning it to as it was before China took over and reverse the trends of modernization comes from white faces. The whole 'return Shangri-La to its ancestral roots' thing is just fetishism and another form of objectification.

I think the whole backlash from old school cultural chauvinism has created a philosophy which artificially values culture, especially 'local culture', beyond all reason. Whereas old school paternalism became an excuse for exploiting lesser-developed societies, this inverse 'respect for local cultures' has become an excuse for ignoring the plight of others. In both cases, the specters of 'the white man's burden' and 'native culture' are often mere excuses for people to justify their own actions, be it exploitation or indifference. In both cases, there is an objectification of the lesser developed/modernized societies, and people who presume to speak for 'what they want'.

Not to go off on you in particular, you understand; just expressing my thoughts about this line of thinking as a whole, which annoys me no bounds

[sniffles]

Oh boy...I have to totally disagree with you here. It somewhat reminds me of the attitude of some anthropologists who, when living/studying tribal cultures, refuse to provide medicine when they are sick or food when they are starving on the grounds that doing so would be 'interfering with their society'. It's the philosophical inverse of the well intentioned but misled paternalistic belief that it was the 'white man's burden' to uplift less developed civilizations, and I think it is just as wrongheaded.

Although culture is important, in the end culture is still fundamentally just an artificial social construct, intended to provide a framework for satisfying people's wants and material needs, be it safety, food, or modern convenience. The only people who think 'preserving culture' is greater than satisfying people's needs are those who have never really wanted for anything. Political disputes and repression aside, there is a reason why the Dalai Lama himself, a man who certainly loves his people, repeatedly says that China has brought many benefits in modernizing Tibet, and that joining the modern, developed world is good for Tibet (he mainly wants more political and religious freedom). There is also a reason why the loudest calls for 'preserving Tibet' and returning it to as it was before China took over and reverse the trends of modernization comes from white faces. The whole 'return Shangri-La to its ancestral roots' thing is just fetishism and another form of objectification.

I think the whole backlash from old school cultural chauvinism has created a philosophy which artificially values culture, especially 'local culture', beyond all reason. Whereas old school paternalism became an excuse for exploiting lesser-developed societies, this inverse 'respect for local cultures' has become an excuse for ignoring the plight of others. In both cases, the specters of 'the white man's burden' and 'native culture' are often mere excuses for people to justify their own actions, be it exploitation or indifference. In both cases, there is an objectification of the lesser developed/modernized societies, and people who presume to speak for 'what they want'.

Not to go off on you in particular, you understand; just expressing my thoughts about this line of thinking as a whole, which annoys me no bounds

What, you don't buy the Star Trek Prime Directive?
I don't either. People should be able to have what they want. What I take issue with is the idea that everything about western culture is better. It saddens me that people are willing to abandon their homes and families for a higher-paying job in another country. Although I can't really blame them. Today's global economy is all about capitalism, no matter where you are. And if you can't get what you want where you are, why not go somewhere else?

Boy did we get off-topic!

[Trien Chieu]

I heard that those high paying jobs in China are VERY competitive as well. ONe of my friends from China told me that hundreds if not thousands of people compete for the same job at times.

This is very obvious. The population is so high with few high paying jobs so there is no surprise that they are very competitive. Sadly, sometimes it requires connection in order to land the job.

One of my former classmates was so certain that she will return to China after we all graduate(we all graduated in August 2008). But now she is studying for another degree just so she can stay here longer.

Good luck to her. If she has decent look then I don't think she has problem to land an american boy.

I guess life in the US is a lot more attractive then I originally thought.

Isn't this obvious. Life in Canada is not all that great either especially during winter, but still very attractive. Perhap not as great as the US due to cold weather but still considered a promised land to billions of people.

One of my other friends is trying to find a job here or someone she can marry just to stay here. Some are even asking a lawyer to help her fight for a green card to settle here permanently...

Good luck to her as well. Again, if she has decent look then it's not hard for her to land an american boy.

About the price of the goods, yea I can see that a lot of companies from China online are charging buyers in the US the same amount if not more in US dollars as sellers in the US charge buyers in the US. Therefore, things in China aren't that much cheaper anymore.

Yes, the prices of goods from asia has been rising very fast. They are not that much cheaper than US/Canada anymore. The price of pork in Vietnam is higher than here in Canada. However, the price of vegetables is very cheap back there than here.

Trinnie, if you want to help your friends/classmates then you should introduce them to Ken

[Trinie]

Often these high paying jobs require high qualifications and experience but at the end of the day, its only equal to the... average joe's income in developed nations. Its a pretty sorry state but I suppose thats the same for most developing countries.

That is true, but it depends on the job too. In the US, high qualifications and experience is also required as well so the good and high paying jobs just don't come to you just like that. For example, my major is TESOL and in America I need both a high degree and at least a number of years of experience in order to at least qualify to apply. However, in many countries around the world, I just need to be a native English speaker, have a Bachelor's and they will take me... But I guess that is one sort of rare case so maybe bad example.

Everyone thinks that we don't have to work hard in America and you just sit there and everything comes to you. That is NOT true at all. One time one of my relatives was visiting from Asia and she finally found out that life in America was not as ideal and as easy as she originally thought.

[Trinie]

This is very obvious. The population is so high with few high paying jobs so there is no surprise that they are very competitive. Sadly, sometimes it requires connection in order to land the job.



Good luck to her. If she has decent look then I don't think she has problem to land an american boy.



Isn't this obvious. Life in Canada is not all that great either especially during winter, but still very attractive. Perhap not as great as the US due to cold weather but still considered a promised land to billions of people.



Good luck to her as well. Again, if she has decent look then it's not hard for her to land an american boy.



Yes, the prices of goods from asia has been rising very fast. They are not that much cheaper than US/Canada anymore. The price of pork in Vietnam is higher than here in Canada. However, the price of vegetables is very cheap back there than here.

Trinnie, if you want to help your friends/classmates then you should introduce them to Ken

Thanks for wishing my friend and classmate well... My classmate(not friend, classmate since I don't even like her) already has a boyfriend but he is from China too as well so who really knows. My other friend already has a Chinese-American boyfriend but refuses to admit it due to various reasons... But that is her problem... They are both decent looking. My friend looks better though...

I still really like living in the US a lot, especially California since the weather is really nice too. Life in California is very expensive though. I guess it makes sense since it is the most populated state in America.

[KeongJai]

Do you have any tips that may help her expedite the check?

The immigration people might just be looking for their friend, Mr. Bribe.

[flamer]

That is true, but it depends on the job too. In the US, high qualifications and experience is also required as well so the good and high paying jobs just don't come to you just like that. For example, my major is TESOL and in America I need both a high degree and at least a number of years of experience in order to at least qualify to apply. However, in many countries around the world, I just need to be a native English speaker, have a Bachelor's and they will take me... But I guess that is one sort of rare case so maybe bad example.

Everyone thinks that we don't have to work hard in America and you just sit there and everything comes to you. That is NOT true at all. One time one of my relatives was visiting from Asia and she finally found out that life in America was not as ideal and as easy as she originally thought.

An immigrant's life is never easy.

However high-paying jobs in developed nations pay many times equivalent to those in developing countries, and arguably slightly less competitive.

[Trinie]

An immigrant's life is never easy.

However high-paying jobs in developed nations pay many times equivalent to those in developing countries, and arguably slightly less competitive.

Of course an immigrant's life is NOT easy at all. About the jobs, it also depends on what field you are in, luck, connections, timing,etc..as well. But in today's economy, anyone is lucky to have any job so whoever is employed... Be happy with what you have....