Chinese Wuxia/Period movies

[puff_ng]

This has been on my mind for some years now.

Has anyone else noticed that Chinese wuxia/period movies made in the past few years seem to concentrate on only making beautiful costumes, set designs and scenary to the point of neglecting a good plot, characterisation and action choreography?

Two chief offenders are House of Flying Daggers and Red Cliff. These two were practically all eye candy. There are others but these come to mind first. They try to be artsy but they're not. I found myself putting down copies of Curse of the Golden Flower and The Promise at my local DVD store because it looks to be in the same vein as those films.

I know I'm going to cop a lot of flak for this, but even Hero was a bit overbearing and seemed to try way too hard to visually impress with all it's colours and slow motion. Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon was beautiful but still managed a good plot and action choreography.

It feels like after the large leap in quality of costume and set designs in Hollywood from films like LotR and other period movies (The Last Samurai, Troy, etc.) that Chinese cinema is trying to desperately catch up and prove it's just as good in those departments, to the detriment to the more important aspects of a film.

And is it me or is every second period movie about some genius strategist that appears out of seemingly nowhere to help a beleaguered kingdom or village?

[junny]

Firstly, Red Cliff is not wuxia. Also, it is no more than a Chinese history 101 by John Woo, who is not known for epic-war films. I could go into a rant about the ridiculousness of Red Cliff, but I'll save it. Hero and House of Flying Daggers are by Zhang Yimou, again a director not known for wuxia films and who is better off sticking to his social commentary films, which have more substance and are more heartfelt. IMHO, these two directors have no idea how to tell a wuxia story.

Hero is also not quite wuxia, I prefer to see it as showing events in different perspectives. It is also more visually appealing because the colours tell a story, and most people have interpreted a political message beneath all that glitz. Colours are an important motif in Zhang Yimou's work- see, for example, Red Sorghum and Raise the Red Lantern. I didn't see the whole of House of Flying Daggers, but what I saw was frankly awful - anyway, it's a love story without substance. I did not like Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon, it bored me and Ang Lee has directed better films. I really don't understand the fuss about Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. The choreography was nothing to shout about - you would understand if you've seen wuxia or martial arts films prior to 2000.

It is true, however, that the films you mentioned lack soul and are known more for their visual appeal than a concrete story core. I attribute this in part to the directors' unfamiliarity with wuxia - Chen Kaige though had done period films - and to big budgets, since you tend to lose sight of what's important when you've got more leeway to spend on packaging.

[Cesare]

Oooh, I very much enjoyed Red Cliff (except for the finale and all that fuss about Xiao Qiao, I guess). Superficial? Yeah. But who the hell cares. It had a lot of energy and drive. And it is an eye candy indeed...:-)
Hero is IMHO one of the best Chinese films ever made and there is a lot more to it than meets the eye. Definitely wouldn't call it a soulless film. I even kind of like the political message (the evil, legalist side of me does, anyway). I agree it's not pure wuxia, though.
I am no great fan of CTHD but it is IMHO much better than most Asian viewers give it credit for (it must be one of the most grossly misunderstood films I know).

Junny: Um - what is the proper way of telling a wuxia story? King Hu way? Chang Cheh way? Chu Yuan way? Or perhaps Tsui Hark or Patrick Tam or Hua Shan way?
I am not quite convinced that any of the Zhang Yimou opuses or CTHD were meant to be 100% wuxia, anyway. I'm quite sure that for example CTHD or Hero were not.

I do not mean to say that lack of substance in Chinese wuxia/period films (esp. the large-scale productions) is not a recurring problem (because it is), but I think it's got little to do with "directors not knowing how to tell a wuxia story".
And - as is usually the case with "they don't make them like these anymore" rants - I am tempted to believe nostalgia factor plays a huge role here, too.

[junny]

You are right, though, that there's no one way to tell a wuxia story. I guess what I was going for was the feel - none of them felt like a wuxia story in the remotest sense. Again, I am hard put to explain that. Perhaps Tsui Hark, if I must pick one, since I watched a number of his films. Hero wasn't quite wuxia, so I had relatively little problem with it, I think Zhang Yimou meant it as a political critique and I was fine with it. HOFD was just a sorry love story masquerading as a wuxia film - I just didn't see the need for martial arts to even feature. I still think Zhang Yimou should stick to what he does best - his films pre-Hero were amazing, he really knew how to tell a story, how to make actors work, how to work the cinematography. I just feel he was completely out of depth in his later films. Perhaps you are right, nostalgia plays a part - not nostalgia for how older wuxia films were made, but for the director's older works, which had so much substance.

[Cesare]

Well, we'll agree on HoFD. I have no problem with that "love story in a wuxia package" thing, it's just that the love story doesn't work, for me, anyway. As you put it - it lacks substance. Nothing and nobody to relate to.

[puff_ng]

When did I say the films I mentioned were "pure wuxia"? Notice how I have "wuxia/period" in the title? I meant both wuxia and period movies seem to have leaned towards focusing on visuals more than plot, characters, action choreography, etc.

Now you've just turned this topic to a discussion as what is wuxia and what isn't.

[Cesare]

Junny did...;-p
Anyway - period films, esp. the real real epic ones cost a lot of money and resources and therefore pretty heavily depend on governmental funding. It's not like the filmmakers have a lot of creative freedom with those films. The "official structures" are going to be very particular about such productions' possible interpretations, ideological overtones and whatnot - esp. since China has the tradition of using historical themes, anecdotes and examples to address very contemporary issues.
(BTW, I think the choreography is not that bad. It's not that old-school solid thing but it's got its own merits. Red Cliff choreo IMHO kicked ***.
Sure, cinematography and editing (and CGI) play an increasingly important role, but that's not really a problem as long as the result is good. It's movies. Method is unimportant, the outcome is.)

Basically, I agree with you that Chinese period movies these past few years very often sucked in terms of characterization and plot (or narrative - or both plot and narrative)... But I don't really agree with all the titles you chose as examples... I also don't believe that plot and characterization are in all cases more important than the rest - Hero is a good example that you can make a great film that focuses on more abstract things.
And of course - since these films have been quite trendy these past few years and there has been an awful lot of them, *of course* majority of them kinda sucks. "90% of everything is trash" is a fairly universal rule when it comes to popular trends.

[junny]

When did I say the films I mentioned were "pure wuxia"? Notice how I have "wuxia/period" in the title? I meant both wuxia and period movies seem to have leaned towards focusing on visuals more than plot, characters, action choreography, etc.

Now you've just turned this topic to a discussion as what is wuxia and what isn't.

Well, turn it back, nothing is set in stone. I just read it as period = wuxia, which is not quite true. Anyway, I don't disagree that the period films these days lack soul and substance, but as Cesare pointed out and I also agree, Hero is an exception.

I revisited Red Cliff earlier this week. What a goddamn waste of potential.