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Thread: What if Central Divinity had actively trained in the 9 Yum Jen Ging?

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    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Default What if Central Divinity had actively trained in the 9 Yum Jen Ging?

    Central Divinity Wong Chung Yeung read and digested the 9 Yum Jen Ging, but never actively incorporated it into his own martial arts. Before his death, however, Wong Chung Yeung was already the best living martial artist in the world, having defeated the other Greats at the First Mt. Hua Sword Tournament. Had Wong Chung Yeung continued living, remained in good health, AND actively trained in the 9 Yum Jen Ging, how much more would his martial arts have advanced? Could 9 Yum Jen Ging have enabled him to grow exponentially from his already extremely advanced level, or had he already maxed out his potential and even 9 Yum Jen Ging would not have led him to any more substantial gains?

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    Since WCY was the best among the greats, how come none of his students reach his level or at least other greats level? Did he teach them all this great martial arts? Anyway, he was a sore loser for leaving Lam Chiu Ying.
    Last edited by Trien Chieu; 09-16-15 at 03:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trien Chieu View Post
    Since WCY was the best among the greats, how come none of his students reach his level or at least other greats level? Did he teach them all this great martial arts?
    They started late (in their thirties) and weren't blessed with extraordinary talent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    They started late (in their thirties) and weren't blessed with extraordinary talent.
    Ok, but then why did he not teach them 9 Yum Jen Ging? With that, at least they can improve their skills to a higher level even if they are unable to reach the great level. Other than WCY and Chow Bo Tong, the rest of the taoists are suckers in term of martial art. Other than Chow Bo Tong, the rest are stinking taoists including WCY. They are not likable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Central Divinity Wong Chung Yeung read and digested the 9 Yum Jen Ging, but never actively incorporated it into his own martial arts. Before his death, however, Wong Chung Yeung was already the best living martial artist in the world, having defeated the other Greats at the First Mt. Hua Sword Tournament. Had Wong Chung Yeung continued living, remained in good health, AND actively trained in the 9 Yum Jen Ging, how much more would his martial arts have advanced? Could 9 Yum Jen Ging have enabled him to grow exponentially from his already extremely advanced level, or had he already maxed out his potential and even 9 Yum Jen Ging would not have led him to any more substantial gains?
    The answer depends on what you think 9 Yin can do. It's healing abilities are almost supernatural allowing H7 to revive his powers and YD to recover in months from an injury that should have taken years to heal. Whether this would have prolonged WCY's life is very debatable.

    As for combat usage, if 9 Yin only boosts a person's own art to the max then no WCY would not have benefited much as he had already reached his peak. We can use Eastern Heretic and Golden Wheel Monk as examples, as both were able to stay on a par with characters who had studied 9 Yin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trien Chieu View Post
    Ok, but then why did he not teach them 9 Yum Jen Ging?
    Several reasons:

    1. Again, they lacked the talent for it. Not everybody had the talent necessary to get the most out of the 9 Yum Jen Ging.

    2. No time: not long after Central Divinity gained possession of the 9 Yum Jen Ging, his health took a turn for the worse and he had his posthumous affairs to get into order (including properly disposing of the 9 Yum Jen Ging) before his death.

    3. Wong Chung Yeung was a stickler for propriety, and he was a bit vain, so he didn't want people to think that he kept 9 Yum Jen Ging for himself and his followers and wouldn't share with his wulin peers. It wasn't a good look, at least from his point of view. Not only did he choose not to teach the 9 Yum Jen Ging to his students, but he also forbid Chow Bak Tung from training in the 9 Yum Jen Ging (an edict that Chow surprisingly kept for twenty years until after he met Gwok Jing on Peach Blossom Island). We can debate the merits of this line of thinking all day, but that was Wong Chung Yeung's perception of the situation.

    Other than Chow Bo Tong, the rest are stinking taoists including WCY. They are not likable.
    Wong Chung Yeung, a few flaws aside, came across as righteous and noble. He was a bit dour and often vain, but that was about the worst you could say about him.

    Cheun Jen 7 Disciples - Ma Yuk seemed to be a pretty cool dude; Lau Chui Yin was OK too, though I couldn't tell you what his personality was like...ditto Tam Chui Deun, who died almost as soon as he showed up. Wong Chui 1 was OK. Yau Chui Gei was the hothead, Sheun But Yee was a sourpuss, and Gok Dai Tung guilt-tripped over inadvertently killing Granny Sheun.

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    The whole premise of competing for ownership of the 9 Yin manual was never convincing. It did not have an owner, so why did WCY have to offer it up as a prize? A good argument for the competition would be to forestall a continuous series of challenges for ownership. Given that he won, I don't see any rationale for not passing it on within his circle of students.

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    Senior Member Dirt's Avatar
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    WCY was able to overcome LCY's kung fu with the knowledge of 9Ying. I see no reason why he wouldn't have far surpassed the other Greats had he had time to put his 9Ying knowledge into practice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CFT View Post
    Given that he won, I don't see any rationale for not passing it on within his circle of students.
    His own vanity, which manifested in a form of affected humility. WCY strikes me as an individual who really cared what others thought of him, and he didn't want to be perceived as selfish or favoring his own. It might not make any sense to others, but it fit his character.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CFT View Post
    Given that he won, I don't see any rationale for not passing it on within his circle of students.
    The guy is an idiot. If he is stupid enough to break up with the love of his life Lam Chiu Ying for nothing, what can you expect from him?

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    I guess the perspective is between custodianship and ownership. I'm sure the other greats would have no qualms about practicing it and passing it down, even if it is restricted to the clan leader, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Central Divinity Wong Chung Yeung read and digested the 9 Yum Jen Ging, but never actively incorporated it into his own martial arts. Before his death, however, Wong Chung Yeung was already the best living martial artist in the world, having defeated the other Greats at the First Mt. Hua Sword Tournament. Had Wong Chung Yeung continued living, remained in good health, AND actively trained in the 9 Yum Jen Ging, how much more would his martial arts have advanced? Could 9 Yum Jen Ging have enabled him to grow exponentially from his already extremely advanced level, or had he already maxed out his potential and even 9 Yum Jen Ging would not have led him to any more substantial gains?
    The reason why Wong Chongyang fought at Huashan to begin with was to remove the 9-Yin manual from the Martial Arts society. Martial artists had been killing one another for it for a long time before he came along, and they stopped doing so after he claimed it.

    Wong Chongyang didn't need to learn from the manual because he was already the best, and he forbade his students from learning from it because it would only perpetuate the struggles over it. In fact, he tried to burn it several times, but he just couldn't bring himself to do it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trien Chieu View Post
    Since WCY was the best among the greats, how come none of his students reach his level or at least other greats level? Did he teach them all this great martial arts? Anyway, he was a sore loser for leaving Lam Chiu Ying.
    Wang ChongYang taught Zhou Botong, and Zhou Botong was one of the Greats, so the fault lies somewhere else. In fact, he was the only one of the Greats who taught someone who would be equal to himself. The only minor exception was Hong Qigong and Guo Jing, but Guo Jing got to where he was with a lot of help from other sources.

    1. Again, they lacked the talent for it. Not everybody had the talent necessary to get the most out of the 9 Yum Jen Ging.
    Actually, Quanzhen martial artists are supremely well-suited for learning from the 9-Yin manual. The manual is built on the distilled essence of Taoist martial arts, and is thus completely in line with Wong Chongyang's own Taoist forms. That's why Mei Chaofeng gained so much from just learning a bit of Quanzhen philosophy from Ma Yu and Guo Jing. Wong Chongyang's students would have been amazing if they had learned 9-Yin martial arts. It would have just been an extension of what they had already been learning.

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    Senior Member Dirt's Avatar
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    I still think Zhou Botong would not have become a Great without 9yin. He used it and did so against Yang Guo.

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