Did Mo Yung Fook have sufficient inner power to project LDAs?

[Ken Cheng]

To my knowledge, Mo Yung Fook never projected long distance attacks with his internal energy the way that we observed fighters such as Kiu Fung, Kau Mor Tze, and those even more powerful doing in DGSD. Did Mo Yung Fook ever in fact project an inner power-driven LDA during DGSD? Does he have sufficient inner power to do so?

[Ken Cheng]

By the time DGSD ended, had Mo Yung F'uk acquired the necessary inner power and skill to project long-distance inner power attacks the way that Kiu Fung, Deun Yu, and even people such as Deun Yin Hing and Deun Jing Tsun could? I'm under the impression that Mo Yung F'uk never quite achieved that level of mastery.

[Ken Cheng]

I had forgotten I'd already proposed this topic a while back. Anybody still want to take a crack at it?

[WuxiaMaster]

I don't think Murong Fu skills improved at any point throughout DGSD.

LDA requires high internal energy (e.g. all the chars you mentioned, because they could learn Yiyang Finger), which I believe MRF is much weaker in.

[EdenResident]

MRF is a ****ing joke. His tricks only work against the scrubs. The shifting moves actually even encourage him not to train his internals. I seriously question MRB's parenting skills. Why place such a lofty expectation on him and then completely abandon the guy for pretty much his entire life? And if he's gonna do so, why not arrange some halfway decent masters for him to learn from? The guy is shit and his terrible Gongfu is not even the biggest problem. He has no organizational skills, can't command worth shit, probably knows shit about military tactics, and above all, is dumb as hell. I mean running around trying to impress scrubs in Wulin is definitely NOT the way to restore a whole country! Why not build a ****ing army?

[Ken Cheng]

MRF is a ****ing joke. His tricks only work against the scrubs. The shifting moves actually even encourage him not to train his internals. I seriously question MRB's parenting skills. Why place such a lofty expectation on him and then completely abandon the guy for pretty much his entire life? And if he's gonna do so, why not arrange some halfway decent masters for him to learn from? The guy is shit and his terrible Gongfu is not even the biggest problem. He has no organizational skills, can't command worth shit, probably knows shit about military tactics, and above all, is dumb as hell. I mean running around trying to impress scrubs in Wulin is definitely NOT the way to restore a whole country! Why not build a ****ing army?

I think Mo Yung F'uk knew that he needed an army and had an interest in building one, but he had no idea HOW to go about doing that. His half-baked plan was to sow enough chaos that the Sung, Liao, Hsi-Hsia, Tubo, and Dali would all destroy each other, and he'd emerge from the wreckage to reestablish the Yin Kingdom. It was a half-baked idea at best, though.

[CC]

To my knowledge, Mo Yung Fook never projected long distance attacks with his internal energy the way that we observed fighters such as Kiu Fung, Kau Mor Tze, and those even more powerful doing in DGSD. Did Mo Yung Fook ever in fact project an inner power-driven LDA during DGSD? Does he have sufficient inner power to do so?

2nd Edition, at Shaolin when he had Duan Yu on the ground, he blasted the floor with a palm blast to scare DY into submission. So at the very least he could project say half a body length.

[PJ]

He used his sleeve wind to lift Sang Tu Gong flying into the air. This reminds me of Yang Guo and HYS' toying of 3 Mongolian warriors, except obviously it's much easier to do it to one lower level fighter.

忽听得慕容复叫道：“在这里了！”左手衣袖挥出，向一块岩石卷去，原来这块岩石模样的东西，却是桑土公的背 脊。这人古里古怪，惑人耳目的伎俩花样百出，若不是慕容复眼尖，还真不易发见。桑土公被雄劲的袖风卷起，肉 球般的身子飞向半空。

A few minutes later, Taoist Priest Buping used his "whisk wind" to slow down his descent from midair.

那道人微笑道：“岂敢，岂敢！江湖上都说贫道早已一命呜呼，因此乌先生有些不信，是也不是？”说着纵身轻跃 ，从半空中冉冉而下。本来他双足离开树枝，自然会极快的堕向地面，但他手中拂尘摆动，激起一股劲风，拍向地 下，生出反激，托住他身子缓缓而落，这拂尘上真气反激之力，委实非同小可。

Both feats are not LDA per Kenny's definition, more like LDS. But you have more impressive LDA performed by lower level ppl such as Yinggu, Di Yun, and Great Yin Yang Palm Yue Hou (not to mention Yue Buqun's long distance internal energy transfer) that distort the theory that LDA is internal energy-dependent. Surely there's no way that MRF has less IE than the aforementioned folks. But if he could do it, why didn't he at a time like this:

围在慕容复身旁的众人中退下了三个，换了三人上来。这三人都是好手，尤其一条矮汉膂力惊人，两柄钢锤使将开 来，劲风呼呼，声势威猛。慕容复以香露刀挡了一招，只震得手臂隐隐发麻，再见他钢锤打来，便即闪避，不敢硬 接。

Also, when Huodu (He Shiwo) was about to kill Guo Fu near the end of ROCH, GJ couldn't save her from off stage. Now I don't know how far he was from the stage, but given his important role, it should be in the front. If he could perform LDA, it should have stopped Huo Du. But it took HYS and YG's pebbles from afar to save the day. And yet, to think that someone like Yinggu can possibly do it...

[CC]

Also, when he blasted the floor next to DuanYu's head, it said he cratered the floor. So it wasn't just a shove.

[Snafu3721]

A thought on LDA:

I know there used to be big discussions on LDA, the inner power requirements, the wow factors, etc.

However, perhaps LDA's aren't as impressive or useful as they appear.
So going back to whether or not MRF (or any character for that matter) are able to use LDA's-- perhaps many of them can to some degree, but they don't use LDA's because it doesn't increase the specific user's fighting prowess in any meaningful way; mostly due to that user's skillset.

There are exceptions, but hopefully the idea below makes sense

In Condor trilogy, HYS definitely has LDA. His finger snap is clearly used to inflict damage and can do so from the longest range of all the Greats. Yet, he does not have any superior advantage in any fights. Because all of HYS's LDA's can be nullified by the other Greats via dodging, blocking, or offsetting with Greats lvl chi/techniques. It's like in Street fighter... Ryu and Ken have Hadokens, but it doesn't make them automatically stronger than the other fighters. It provides certain utility in fights, but isn't a measure of their overall superiority or attack base. So a skilled player using Zangief can take out a non-skilled player using Ryu for example.

XF as a user is an exception because he's good at all forms of combat. He's like that Street Fighter player who can use any character and skill kick your arse. So, whether he uses LDA or not isn't a reflection of a LDA's innate superiorirty, it's just another useful skillset that looks amazing when used by XF. Basically a guy who can dominate using Ryu, but if he wanted to, he can school you using E. Honda

As for technique that is an exception to the rule, it would have to be 6MSJ. Because there is no blocking or nullifying this technique other than dodging. It would be like there is a Hadoken that can't be blocked and you have to just jump over it. Hence, the super huge internal energy requirement to learn and master.

[tape]

I think this is a reasonable explanation, but I also think JY just throws out LDAs whenever he thinks it's necessary to establish that a character is reasonably strong. No matter how intricate the martial arts explanation, if things like LDA didn't exist, it's hard to imagine them as these super beings instead of quasi-real fighters.

Plenty of characters strong enough to exhibit LDAs don't do it, but by association or similar feats we can lump them on a general power level. I think LDAs are just one of the few indications JY uses when he wants to say "ok this guy is meant to be pretty strong".

I enjoyed your street fighter reference as I was very competitive in it so many years ago, and it's a good way to think of the Greats being different but equal, rather than making a broad statement that if Yideng can do X with his inner strength, his equal Huang Yaoshi should be able to do the same thing, since one fighter can be much weaker in one area but make up for it in another (though there is a floor to each area).

[PJ]

... but I also think JY just throws out LDAs whenever he thinks it's necessary to establish that a character is reasonably strong.

This is only true starting with HSDS (and took off with DGSD). In the novels before that (among the ones I've read, at least), there's not much evidence that JY equates attach distance with internal energy level or general superiority.

I tend to agree with Kenny's reasoning that logically, attack distance should be indicative of internal energy level. The problem is I don't think JY developed that idea until HSDS/DGSD, so it doesn't really apply to the previous novels.

In any case, I agree that LDA isn't very useful against a foe of similar level. The advantage shines thru when dispatching lower fighters and when there is a distance requirement (such as striking down Evil #4 at Juxian Manor, and the aforementioned saving of Guo Fu).

[CC]

As for technique that is an exception to the rule, it would have to be 6MSJ. Because there is no blocking or nullifying this technique other than dodging. It would be like there is a Hadoken that can't be blocked and you have to just jump over it. Hence, the super huge internal energy requirement to learn and master.

Using your SF analogy again, you can dodge AND parry 6MSJ. Just no 'pull stick back to block'.

But then again, I assume you can say the same thing about a 2nd tier elite throwing a knife at you. Or stabbing you with a sword.