Discussion of 1970s and 1980s TVB Gu Long adaptations

[Yuet Thi]

I'm still slooowly watching The Return of Luk Siu-Fung and the background music is exactly the same as HSDS '86 which makes me feel like I'm watching HSDS '86 once in a while. Just a thought

[mawguy]

i find that the background music got recycled a lot across several series in the 70s and 80s--they are almost like timestamps: i hear them, and i know what decade the series was made! LOL!

[Ken Cheng]

I'm still slooowly watching The Return of Luk Siu-Fung and the background music is exactly the same as HSDS '86 which makes me feel like I'm watching HSDS '86 once in a while. Just a thought

Both series were made and released at around the same time, so it's not surprising that they had similar production values. Even the martial arts choreography styles are similar.

LSF '86 and HSDS '86, however, feel far removed in terms of production style from DGSD '81, LOCH '82, and ROCH '83, which had been made only a few years earlier. One thing that was great about TVB during the 1980s is that it seemed that the studio was always trying to improve the way it did things. It didn't always work out, but it was good to see how hard TVB was trying.

These days, I don't think TVB even tries to be innovative or forward-thinking anymore.

[Ken Cheng]

i find that the background music got recycled a lot across several series in the 70s and 80s--they are almost like timestamps: i hear them, and i know what decade the series was made! LOL!

The 1970s were all about prog rock, so it was no surprise that 1970s TVB directors used a lot of Pink Floyd music in their series.

[kidd]

details about casting, definitely. why do you prefer julian's interpretation? and overall storyline: is it coherent? interesting?

Why I prefer Julian's interpretation? Just like what I said before. He's closest to the Luk Siu Fung I imagine while reading the book. I guess is looks help too (costume and hair). Damien acted well, but, he didn't look like the Luk Siu Fung in my mind while reading the book.

This is not like the usual series. One episode is movie length and one case finish in one episode. Most of the episodes follow the books (with a some modification to fit the episode length), but, there are 2 episodes that are original story (or maybe 3, I'm not sure, since I haven't read Silver Hook Casino, so, don't know if the casino episode is based on it. LSF first met FML in that episode) . I feel that this series is success because it was able to capture the atmosphere and the feel of a Gu Long story very well. It feels very Gu Long. One of the better GL adaptations.

As for casting, I like the casting for Luk Siu Fung (Julian Cheung), Fa Mun Lau (Ken Chang), Yip Goo Sing (Yan Kun). Peter Ho as Simon Snowblower is a bit lacking, but, I feel he fares better than Austin Wai. Fann Wong also make a good Sa Man. She's not very beautiful, but, I feel she's able to capture the essence of the character. The actress who played Seung Goon Fei Yin and Seun Goon Dan Fung is prettier than Mary Hon, but, acting failed. Does not feel like the Seung Goon girls in the novel. Mary Hon does way better. Other characters I don't remember much liao. I guess Ng Ting Nip also did good as Gam Gau Ling. Li Qian acted as Beef Soup which I totally dislike.

[Ken Cheng]

I'm not sure, since I haven't read Silver Hook Casino, so, don't know if the casino episode is based on it. LSF first met FML in that episode.

Luk Siu Fung and Fa Mun Lau first met and became friends when they were children, predating all the novels. Fa's first appearance, however, came in the first novel - THE MYSTERY OF THE GOLDEN ROC KINGDOM'S TREASURE.

Fa Mun Lau had only a brief cameo appearance in THE EMBROIDERY BANDIT (the second book of continuity): he appeared in the same scene that introduced Yip Goo Sing. Fa was absent from THE DUEL (Book 3) and SILVER HOOK CASINO (Book 4). In fact, he didn't reappear until one of the last novels.

[Ken Cheng]

We've all been ripping Austin Wai quite a bit in the thread for his mediocre performance as Sai Mun Chui Sheut in THE RETURN OF LUK SIU FUNG, so I'll say something in his favor: Austin is trained in wushu, and his superior physical training/talent made his martial arts moves in character as SMCS the very best among all the cast of ROLSF. I say that if you're doing a LUK SIU FUNG adaptation, *always* pick the best wushu performer available to play the role of Sai Mun Chui Sheut. In LUK SIU FUNG '76, Wong Yeun Sun was also clearly the best trained in martial arts choreography among the cast (his moves were different from those of all the other actors - more fluid, natural, and dynamic by far). Just as Wong Yeun Sun brought a great physical dynamic to Sai Mun Chui Sheut's martial arts moves in the 1970s series, Austin Wai also brought similar fluidity and grace to the martial arts moves of the character.

[kidd]

Luk Siu Fung and Fa Mun Lau first met and became friends when they were children, predating all the novels. Fa's first appearance, however, came in the first novel - THE MYSTERY OF THE GOLDEN ROC KINGDOM'S TREASURE.

I know the history of their friendship and I know the series take artistic liberty in this history. That's why I'm not sure if the casino episode is based on the novel. It could be they took the casino case and insert their original LSF/FML story in it, but, the case still remain the same.

The series also creates their own original story on Fa Mun Lau's history in the episode 'Iron Shoes'. In the series, Fa Mun Lau was an only child and was blinded by the Iron Shoes guy in his childhood. This is different from FML's background in the novel as FML was the 7th child in a big family.

Fa Mun Lau had only a brief cameo appearance in THE EMBROIDERY BANDIT (the second book of continuity): he appeared in the same scene that introduced Yip Goo Sing. Fa was absent from THE DUEL (Book 3) and SILVER HOOK CASINO (Book 4). In fact, he didn't reappear until one of the last novels.

Fa Mun Lau also appear briefly in 'Ghost Manor' and 'Phoenix Dance 9th Heaven'.

I'm a FML fan. I know all his appearances in the novels. That's why I still have not read 'Silver Hook Casino' until now. No FML.

[Ken Cheng]

The series also creates their own original story on Fa Mun Lau's history in the episode 'Iron Shoes'. In the series, Fa Mun Lau was an only child and was blinded by the Iron Shoes guy in his childhood. This is different from FML's background in the novel as FML was the 7th child in a big family.

Gu Long only gave us a little bit of Fa Mun Lau's background, so adaptation-makers love going nuts filling in his backstory.

In the novels, yes, he was the seventh and youngest son of a wealthy family in Suzhou. In fact, in GOLDEN ROC KINGDOM, Dook Goo Fong mentioned that the Fa Family of Gong Nam owned the most real estate in China, and I've always suspected that Fa Mun Lau is a member of this same Fa Family (which would conveniently explain why he and Luk Siu Fung never ached for cash). Fa Mun Lau's third and fifth older brothers were drinking guests of Yim Teen San on one occasion.

THE RETURN OF LUK SIU FUNG gave Fa Mun Lau another brother who was a doctor...even cast their father as a doctor. In fact, we don't know what trade Fa Mun Lau's father practiced (probably none; he was probably a wealthy landlord).

The official word on Fa Mun Lau's blindness is that he became blind at age seven following a serious illness. Fa Mun Lau does, therefore, have memories of having eyesight during his early childhood.

[Ken Cheng]

...and to be frank, SILVER HOOK CASINO was one of the more boring LUK SIU FUNG stories. A part of the problem is that Luk Siu Fung's usual supporting cast doesn't appear much. Fa Mun Lau, Honest Monk, and See Hung Jak Sing were all absent from this story, and Sai Mun Chui Sheut only puts in a brief appearance at the end to save Luk Siu Fung from the Three Friends of Sui Hon.

[mawguy]

The 1970s were all about prog rock, so it was no surprise that 1970s TVB directors used a lot of Pink Floyd music in their series.

i've always been curious about the background music--i only know them as "wuxia background". does anyone know the sources/original pieces?

[mawguy]

Why I prefer Julian's interpretation? Just like what I said before. He's closest to the Luk Siu Fung I imagine while reading the book. I guess is looks help too (costume and hair). Damien acted well, but, he didn't look like the Luk Siu Fung in my mind while reading the book.

thanks for providing insights! one of these days, when i have a chunk of free time... i will try not to make too many comparisons. LOL!

[Ken Cheng]

i've always been curious about the background music--i only know them as "wuxia background". does anyone know the sources/original pieces?

Wish I knew. I only know that for TVB's 1970s/1980s Early Republic (e.g. 1920s/1930s) and modern era series, Pink Floyd was the "go to" music for BGM.

[mawguy]

The series also creates their own original story on Fa Mun Lau's history in the episode 'Iron Shoes'. In the series, Fa Mun Lau was an only child and was blinded by the Iron Shoes guy in his childhood. This is different from FML's background in the novel as FML was the 7th child in a big family.

In the novels, yes, he was the seventh and youngest son of a wealthy family in Suzhou. In fact, in GOLDEN ROC KINGDOM, Dook Goo Fong mentioned that the Fa Family of Gong Nam owned the most real estate in China, and I've always suspected that Fa Mun Lau is a member of this same Fa Family (which would conveniently explain why he and Luk Siu Fung never ached for cash). Fa Mun Lau's third and fifth older brothers were drinking guests of Yim Teen San on one occasion.

The official word on Fa Mun Lau's blindness is that he became blind at age seven following a serious illness. Fa Mun Lau does, therefore, have memories of having eyesight during his early childhood.

*sigh* i can never remember this level of detail...thanks for the background--so, FML probably had something like scarlet fever or the like? back before anti-inflammatory drugs, those sorts of illnesses could lead to blindness (if not death). i guess we should be thankful it wasn't german measles and in the womb (else, he'd be mentally retarded).

i'm glad that FML wasn't born blind--he couldn't appreciate the beauty of the world as much as he did.

I'm a FML fan. I know all his appearances in the novels. That's why I still have not read 'Silver Hook Casino' until now. No FML.

...and to be frank, SILVER HOOK CASINO was one of the more boring LUK SIU FUNG stories. A part of the problem is that Luk Siu Fung's usual supporting cast doesn't appear much. Fa Mun Lau, Honest Monk, and See Hung Jak Sing were all absent from this story, and Sai Mun Chui Sheut only puts in a brief appearance at the end to save Luk Siu Fung from the Three Friends of Sui Hon.

ahaha, well, i'm a SMCS fan, so i have no interest in re-reading the books that don't have him in them. :P which is why i usually go from book 1 to 3, skipping 2, even though 2 sets up the duel climax in 3. and the rest were rather dull, plot-wise, so i haven't gone back. i know i found beef soup super annoying, so i avoid her books.

it's too bad that book 7 is so different from the 1st 6! i had the same feeling with book 7 of CLH--it's like GL tried to re-write his own canon. bizarre. i still remember the discussion where some went up in arms to discover that CLH fathered a child and then, essentially, abandoned both wife and kid. and as for his death...*rolleyes*

[Ian Liew]

...and to be frank, SILVER HOOK CASINO was one of the more boring LUK SIU FUNG stories. A part of the problem is that Luk Siu Fung's usual supporting cast doesn't appear much. Fa Mun Lau, Honest Monk, and See Hung Jak Sing were all absent from this story, and Sai Mun Chui Sheut only puts in a brief appearance at the end to save Luk Siu Fung from the Three Friends of Sui Hon.

A lot of the supporting cast were absent, but I really liked the way LXF interacted with the new cast. The way he tortured the Three Friends of Sui Hon initially when they were following him, the way Chu Chu played hard to get, the way Ding Xiangyi realised that he was going to die unless she killed off the hostages so that he would have no worries, the way he sadly forgave Ding Xiangyi and fulfilled her last wish (it wasn't just pity, he genuinely appreciated the friendship despite her betrayal), and the way he got really upset with Fang Yufei even though most of the people who had died due to the plot were not really good people.

In the Julian series Fang Yuxiang ended up with Lu Xiaofeng, didn't she? That's not quite her fate in the novel. Her ending was tragic, yet beautifully written at the same time - difficult to forget and you can picture it perfectly in your mind.

SPOILER:
She had a handkerchief which was poisoned, and which she used to poison Bluebeard when wiping his cup or something. Later, when she realised that Fang Yufei had betrayed her as well, she cried, and delibrately used the handkerchief to wipe her tears. The poison then took effect, and her eyes started bleeding. Before she died, she asked Lu Xiaofeng for reassurance that he would definitely kill Fang Yufei, and he promised her that he would. She then dies beside Bluebeard.

It's memorable because of the four girls Ding Xiangyi, Fang Yuxiang, Chu Chu and Chen Jingjing - all four die, and apart from Chu Chu who was quite evil and vicious, the other three all had redeeming points and Lu Xiaofeng was genuinely sad to see them die. I think Fang Yufei's scale of evil did not quite reach the level of some of the other antagonists, but the way he used the girls made Lu Xiaofeng really hate him. The other memorable parts are the appearance of Yu Luosha at the end, and, personally for me, the closure at the beginning which states that Ouyang Qing had to stay behind to recuperate from her injuries, and hence could not be with him. None of that James Bond 1-girl-per-story out of thin air, but it tried to provide continuity. Don't think they ever mention later what happens to her, even in the future novels.

[kidd]

i'm glad that FML wasn't born blind--he couldn't appreciate the beauty of the world as much as he did.

The fact that he was not born blind makes him even more admirable. When you have not experience something, you don't know what you are missing. But, FML has experienced sight and then lost it and still able to appreciate life and live his life happily. That's amazing and that's what made me like him. He didn't let misfortune get to him and bring him down. He didn't lament, he didn't become down and self-pitying. He can still 'see' the beauty of the world.

[mawguy]

The fact that he was not born blind makes him even more admirable. When you have not experience something, you don't know what you are missing. But, FML has experienced sight and then lost it and still able to appreciate life and live his life happily. That's amazing and that's what made me like him. He didn't let misfortune get to him and bring him down. He didn't lament, he didn't become down and self-pitying. He can still 'see' the beauty of the world.

you know, i just realized that a typo made my sentence express the opposite of what i meant! my bad!

i totally agree with you: it's because he'd seen the beauty that life had to offer that made him appreciate it even more after he became blind. i think he was an optimistic person to begin with, so after his debilitation, he learned to treasure everything about life that he could still feel with his remaining senses. he developed a lust for life, so to speak. i've thought about it for myself, and i've decided that, of the five senses, to lose sight would be the worst. while i'd lament at the loss of music and the inability to smell and taste good food, i think i'd be most devastated if i couldn't see. this is, of course, based on the premise that i had an accident that caused the loss rather than something hereditary or congenital.

i still love his lecture to SMCS the first time they met--how he told the proud swordsman off for not stopping, literally, to smell the flowers. ahaha! i think SMCS may have developed a grudging respect for FML on the spot--there aren't too many people in the world willing to stand up to SMCS, methinks. except for LSF, of course, who borders plyaful irreverence toward most people--not disrespect, but he certainly doesn't give a fig for hoity-toity-ness.

[Ken Cheng]

i still love his lecture to SMCS the first time they met--how he told the proud swordsman off for not stopping, literally, to smell the flowers. ahaha! i think SMCS may have developed a grudging respect for FML on the spot--there aren't too many people in the world willing to stand up to SMCS, methinks.

It was one of the most poignant exchanges of dialogue in all of wuxia fiction, and revealed much about these two characters. I think ultimately, both Fa Mun Lau and Sai Mun Chui Sheut walked away from that discussion with an understanding of the other's point of view, but also with an understanding and acceptance of the reasons that each of them would never be able to embrace the other's perspective. They could understand it, but not embrace it.

[mawguy]

We've all been ripping Austin Wai quite a bit in the thread for his mediocre performance as Sai Mun Chui Sheut in THE RETURN OF LUK SIU FUNG, so I'll say something in his favor: Austin is trained in wushu, and his superior physical training/talent made his martial arts moves in character as SMCS the very best among all the cast of ROLSF. I say that if you're doing a LUK SIU FUNG adaptation, *always* pick the best wushu performer available to play the role of Sai Mun Chui Sheut.

just backtracking to this for a moment: are you aware that damian lau has a MA background? he knows taichi and apparently has been teaching "little old ladies" in the park in HK when he's not working.

[Ken Cheng]

just backtracking to this for a moment: are you aware that damian lau has a MA background? he knows taichi and apparently has been teaching "little old ladies" in the park in HK when he's not working.

I didn't know that. Did he already have this background during the 1970s when he was taping the LUK SIU FUNG series?

In the duel between Sai Mun Chui Sheut and Yip Goo Sing in the original TVB LUK SIU FUNG series, it's interesting to compare and contrast Wong Yeun Sun's and Adam Cheng's styles. Wong Yeun Sun is clearly wushu trained, while Adam Cheng seemed to bring elements of ballet dancing into Yip Goo Sing's swordsmanship.