What happened to the Iron Sand Palm after Qiu QianRen retired?

[BlackRaven]

They were not mentioned at all in Smiling Proud Wanderer. Did this formely illustrious clan appear in other periods?

It is said that Qiu QianRen and his teacher Shangguan improved the Iron Sand Palm technique, making it a Great level martial art.

Some say that Qiu QianRen was a step below the Greats. But since Qiu QianRen lived longer than Hong Qigong and Ouyang Feng, and since the post 16 years Yi Deng was said to be only barely better than Qiu, I think Qiu QianRen would be better than Hong and Ouyang at their deaths, therefore giving him the level of a Great.

Qiu did not benefit from 9 Yin in any way either, his power derived entirely from the Iron Sand Palm clan's martial arts.

Now, although the Iron Sand Palm is a Great level martial art, did Qiu teach any successor this skill, or was it lost to the sands of time? Did he teach anyone the improved variations imparted to him by his teacher Shangguan? Were Qiu's own variations lost as well?

Qiu seemed like a cheapstake when it came to sharing martial arts. He did not even teach his own TWIN BROTHER any good martial art. How good was the other Qiu twin anyway? Could he beat 2 of the Freaks by himself?

Since he did not teach even his brother, it's possible that the improved Iron Sand Palm was lost. Or maybe Qiu recorded it? I think he must have. He obviously still practiced martial arts during all these years. It would have been basic courtesy to return to the clan what he received, and leave a manual to a successor.

Do you guys think the Iron Sand Palm could have played a key role in the power struggles of later periods if they have a complete Iron Sand Palm manual in their hands?

[PJ]

In ROCH, it was revealed that the clan disbanded right after LOCH (after Qiu Qianren left with Yideng).

二十年前，铁掌帮在江湖上确是声势极盛，但二次华山论剑之时，帮主铁掌水上飘裘千仞皈依佛门，拜一灯大师为 师，铁掌帮即风流云散。当铁掌帮散伙之时，杨过刚刚出世...

[PJ]

By the way, I think the name of the technique is just Iron Palm (no "sand"), right? In Ode to Gallantry, there's a character named Zhan Fei whose special technique is called Iron Sand Palm, but anyway, even if the name were identical to Qiu Qianren's technique, it's probably only in name and not the technique itself (similar to HYS and Xie Yanke both using "Tanzhi Shentong").

[Ken Cheng]

Didn't Yeun Nan Ping also practice this skill?

[K2Grey]

I thought it was Iron Sand Palm too, but apparently there is room for argument on the translation. From http://ymaa.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1152&start=40:

"Sand was never used in Iron Palm training, but the Chinese word for sand, sha, is the same as for gravel. The Chinese word does not differentiate the size of the sand particles. Literally translating "Tie Sha1 Zhang" as "Iron Sand Palm" simply indicates that translators do not understand how Iron Palm is practiced. The practice begins with raw mung beans, then continues to sha, which large sand or gravel of the same size and shape as the mung beans. In advanced stages, tie sha, iron gravel is used. These pieces are also the same size and shape as the mung beans."

[BlackRaven]

Oh, so he disbanded it that early. I don't think he had the right to disband it. He wasn't the founder after all. He should have just appointed someone to be the next leader. Or the clan could have picked one on its own. They were a strong clan so another person should have stepped up to become leader, that's too bad.

I think I saw "Iron Sand Palm" in the movie Twin Warriors ( also called Taichi Master ). That movie was really good so the name stuck.

[PJ]

Oh, so he disbanded it that early. I don't think he had the right to disband it.

Either he disbanded it or the members just decided to part ways after they lost their leader. I'm not sure which was the case. In any case, loss of a strong leader can be a huge blow to even a strong clan, like when Qiao Feng suddenly left Gai Bang, it sank like a rock. And Shaolin weakened considerably after Huogong Toutuo killed its leader.

[MacDaiTienSinh]

Didn't David Chiang's character, Shum Shing-Nam, in the 2006 series Face to Fate practice the Iron Palm technique?

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

Didn't David Chiang's character, Shum Shing-Nam, in the 2006 series Face to Fate practice the Iron Palm technique?

Close it was Red Sand Palm. I think it was made up for the series.