The Romance of the Condor Heroes <神鵰俠侶> - how bad is it?

[i_fotted]

Here you go.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...58S3XMnDzQMzOR

Our team may be taking a break from sub. Happy holiday everyone!

thank you so much. happy holiday to you!

[MrWErD]

As stated before, the problem is that Yu Zheng is a hack with no sense of proper tone or pacing. Jin Yong himself would use long passages to talk about a minor character's back story, but the difference is that he had a very good sense of when, where and how to work that into the current plotline. Moreover, a fanfiction writer who has a good grasp of how the characters work can insert outside ideas to more fully explore and expose those characters. Yu Zheng doesn't have any of these skills, so the end result is haphazardly implemented and unsatisfying. I wish that he had enough confidence to use his modifications to make some wild changes to the storyline, but as is, we have to settle for these half-assed pieces of writing.

I don't think that Yu Zheng is a complete hack. He did Guo Jing and Haung Rong really well. And every scene with Sun Yaoqi and Chen Xiao were very enjoyable. If he just stuck to the source material and made the safe choices in casting rather than to try to be unique, this series wouldn't be half as bad as it is now. As hard as it is to believe, I actually look forward to see how he'll handle future plotlines. Most of the my favorite scenes from the novels don't actually involve XLN at all. If Yu Zheng can handle them half as well as the way he did Yang Guo and Lu Wushuang, this wouldn't be a total waste. I especially want to see more of this Guo Jing and Haung Rong. It's a really interesting take on their characters. But, Yu Zheng really really really needs to tone down on the flashbacks, not when they eat up a whole episodes and more per character. It's basically filler.

Also, the music and the opening titles. I like them both.

But that's about all I can say in defense of this series. This is, so far, a bad adaption. I can't help but wonder how much liberties that a person or company can take before Jin Yong finally gets pissed and bans them from making anymore adaptions from his stuff, like he did TVB. I hope we'll find that out very soon in the near future.

[Malevolent]

I don't think Yu Zheng will disappoint. I heard Li MC will fall for YG just like DFBB fell for LHC. In Swordsman, the love between DFBB and LHC was mutual (ie. real love). I don't think YG will ever return the love to Li MC, so it will be more like one-sided love in ROCH.

I saw the short previews and doubt that LMC will fall in love with YG

[hirobo2]

I don't think that Yu Zheng is a complete hack. He did Guo Jing and Haung Rong really well. And every scene with Sun Yaoqi and Chen Xiao were very enjoyable. If he just stuck to the source material and made the safe choices in casting rather than to try to be unique, this series wouldn't be half as bad as it is now. As hard as it is to believe, I actually look forward to see how he'll handle future plotlines. Most of the my favorite scenes from the novels don't actually involve XLN at all. If Yu Zheng can handle them half as well as the way he did Yang Guo and Lu Wushuang, this wouldn't be a total waste. I especially want to see more of this Guo Jing and Haung Rong. It's a really interesting take on their characters. But, Yu Zheng really really really needs to tone down on the flashbacks, not when they eat up a whole episodes and more per character. It's basically filler.

Also, the music and the opening titles. I like them both.

But that's about all I can say in defense of this series. This is, so far, a bad adaption. I can't help but wonder how much liberties that a person or company can take before Jin Yong finally gets pissed and bans them from making anymore adaptions from his stuff, like he did TVB. I hope we'll find that out very soon in the near future.

Jin Yong is already 90 y/o. I don't think he cares anymore. Judging from YZ's prior work (Swordman 2013), I'd say his production doesn't look like mainland Chinese at all. They're colorful and bright. Most mainland Chinese productions are "dark and gritty". Swordsman, on the other hand looked like an HK production with mainland-type budget and sceneries. I would have to say YZ studio is the new TVB.

One thing I admire though, aside from some obviously silly CG scenes where LHC and DFBB lept like hundreds of stories into the air to fight each other, I thought the CG looked realistic and was generally well done in Swordsman, especially the falling snow. I honestly couldn't tell which was real (props) and which was CG for most of the drama... I doubt TVB would have put so much care into the CG if they had adapted this again. So, in a way, it's a good thing that JY banned TVB b/c YZ studio seemed like the better replacement.

[hirobo2]

I saw the short previews and doubt that LMC will fall in love with YG

It's possible they only showed stuff viewers are already familiar with in the previews and trailers.

[Silverhawk]

I saw the short previews and doubt that LMC will fall in love with YG

What? LMC falls in love with YG? Now that's something new

I have seen the first 16 eps. CX doesn't seem like YG to me. More like some crafty conman. MC certainly isn't XLN. Yu Zheng should have made her LMC and Viann Zhang as XLN instead. Anyone noticed that LMC in Condor Heroes 1995 is the same person who played Madam Ma in DGSD 1997 whereas in china it's Viann who plays both these characters. Coincidental?

[wuxiarocks]

Anyone noticed that LMC in Condor Heroes 1995 is the same person who played Madam Ma in DGSD 1997 whereas in china it's Viann who plays both these characters. Coincidental?

Same with Idy Chan who played Wang Yuyan and XLN of the 80s, Carman Lee playing Wang Yuyan and XLN of the 90s, and LYF playing XLN and Wang Yuyan in her generation as well. Isn't that weird?

[wkeej]

What? LMC falls in love with YG? Now that's something new

I have seen the first 16 eps. CX doesn't seem like YG to me. More like some crafty conman. MC certainly isn't XLN. Yu Zheng should have made her LMC and Viann Zhang as XLN instead. Anyone noticed that LMC in Condor Heroes 1995 is the same person who played Madam Ma in DGSD 1997 whereas in china it's Viann who plays both these characters. Coincidental?

Viann Zhang as XLN? Hmm, interesting. YG will definitely loved her - I mean Viann Zhang.

[MrWErD]

Same with Idy Chan who played Wang Yuyan and XLN of the 80s, Carman Lee playing Wang Yuyan and XLN of the 90s, and LYF playing XLN and Wang Yuyan in her generation as well. Isn't that weird?

Somewhat related. Liu Shishi played Mu Nianci in LOCH 2008, then later Lady Yang in HSDS in 2009.

[i_fotted]

its something called casting guys.

[wuxiarocks]

its something called casting guys.

It's them playing the same specific roles in their respective generation that makes it interesting.

Like how the 3 big actress for Wang Yuyan and XLN plays the same role in their era.

[wkeej]

OT: Wondering whether anyone has acted in three roles in the trilogy of LOCH, ROCH and HSDS?

[ToastedRossi]

I don't think that Yu Zheng is a complete hack. He did Guo Jing and Haung Rong really well.

Yu Zheng usually borrows from good material, and so some of his characters can turn out well. As a contrast to this, look at the Huang Rong in the '83 adaptation. She is a marked departure from the book version, but she also makes a much stronger impression than all of the other ones. And when Yu Zheng borrows from weak material, the end result can be awful. The part that really got to me was that terrible stretch in Quanzhen - it's pure terribleness comes from him having no idea what works and what doesn't.

And every scene with Sun Yaoqi and Chen Xiao were very enjoyable. If he just stuck to the source material and made the safe choices in casting rather than to try to be unique, this series wouldn't be half as bad as it is now. As hard as it is to believe, I actually look forward to see how he'll handle future plotlines. Most of the my favorite scenes from the novels don't actually involve XLN at all. If Yu Zheng can handle them half as well as the way he did Yang Guo and Lu Wushuang, this wouldn't be a total waste. I especially want to see more of this Guo Jing and Haung Rong. It's a really interesting take on their characters. But, Yu Zheng really really really needs to tone down on the flashbacks, not when they eat up a whole episodes and more per character. It's basically filler.

I don't know if Yu Zheng would be any good at a straight adaptation. I'd prefer if he took large departures from the original, and followed through with the changes he made. That way, even if it's not particularly good, at least it would be consistent. As is, this show isn't very good but I'm watching because I like the source material so much. I do think that Michell Chen gets a lot of undue criticism. A lot of the problems with her appearance can be attributed to her costume and styling. She is also directed pretty poorly.

Jin Yong is already 90 y/o. I don't think he cares anymore. Judging from YZ's prior work (Swordman 2013), I'd say his production doesn't look like mainland Chinese at all. They're colorful and bright. Most mainland Chinese productions are "dark and gritty". Swordsman, on the other hand looked like an HK production with mainland-type budget and sceneries. I would have to say YZ studio is the new TVB.

The only TVB production that reminds me of Yu Zheng's work is Flying Fox '99. Yu Zheng uses bright colors, but he doesn't have the eye to do so very effectively. That's why scenes are framed less well and portrayed more poorly than they should be. Look at these Xiaolongnu entrances and compare:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKRNCHSf-Rk

Xiaolongnu dresses in all-white, so framing her entrance in the night makes for a very striking effect. Anyone not doing it like this shows their lack of color sense. The video also hints at how bad the '96 Taiwan version is.

Same with Idy Chan who played Wang Yuyan and XLN of the 80s, Carman Lee playing Wang Yuyan and XLN of the 90s, and LYF playing XLN and Wang Yuyan in her generation as well. Isn't that weird?

I believe that Xiaolongnu and Wang Yuyan's grandmother are the two Jin Yong characters who are described with the words "美若天仙", so the casting choice seems to make sense. It also connects the smaller role (Wang Yuyan) to the larger role (Xiaolongnu). It's probably more odd that Wang Yuyanis generally given predominantly white costumes like Xiaolongnu.

OT: Wondering whether anyone has acted in three roles in the trilogy of LOCH, ROCH and HSDS?

There are lot of actors who did so. TVB used the same secondary cast for their first two LOCH and ROCH productions, and a lot of those actors had roles in the '87 HSDS as well. Heck, those shows have so many characters that they each probably used up most of TVB's acting corps.

[i_fotted]

so im awaiting subs for episodes 16. apparently there is a white hair lady that i have not seen before .

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

Why does everyone keep on bringing this up? If YG goes for the prettiest girl, then he's just superficial and I don't want to see a story about this version of him! But, that doesn't mean he should go for the ugliest girl either just to prove his love is real...

I keep on hearing Joe Chen would make the perfect XLN. Although JC is very pretty (actually not just super pretty, but can actually succeed Idy Chan to become ethereal XLN v2.0, like Jet Li becoming Bruce Lee v2.0), I don't think she can beat Michelle at playing that scene where she grins upon finding YG again. Those scenes where two lovers (run) towards each other and reunite are the defining moments in a romance story anyways...

I see Joe Chen as more of a succesor to Brigitte Lin. Both of them have such beautiful eyes

[Silverhawk]

I see Joe Chen as more of a succesor to Brigitte Lin. Both of them have such beautiful eyes

Joe Chen as XLN and Zhang Xinyu as LMC with YG marrying both would be interesting

LMC would repent and change her ways because of YG.,,how about that?

[MrWErD]

Joe Chen as XLN and Zhang Xinyu as LMC with YG marrying both would be interesting

LMC would repent and change her ways because of YG.,,how about that?

Never take half-measures, I always say. If Yang Guo really decide on the polygamy route, he might as well go all the way, if you catch my drift. Otherwise, I think he should just stick to his Gugu.

As for the latest episodes, I think they were just okay. Yang Guo's battles with Huodu and then Da'erba were one of my favorite scenes from the book, but I'm underwhelmed by what they gave us. Yang Guo is way too powerful in this drama. His fight scenes were so short and fast that they weren't even half as exciting as I'd expected them to be. The same goes for the other battles too. This really ticked me off something bad. So they decided to dedicate whole episodes to flashbacks but only like 20 minutes tops to the actual fighting scenes? In a wuxia series? What, are they high? Just because they renamed it the Romance of the Condor Heroes, do they think they're filming an actual romance?

Also, I don't like how they turn Guo Fu into a slow but sympathetic character. I mean, wow, she still defends Yang Guo even after he humiliated her in front of everybody in Wulin. That's... admirable. Pssh, are we sure her name's Guo Fu and not Guo Xiang? Because at this point, she might as well be Guo Xiang. Maybe they swapped personalities! Actually, if it wasn't already spoiled in the trailer, I would've guessed that the real Guo Xiang, with Guo Fu's personality, will cut off Yang Guo's arm 16 years later because she wasn't pleased with a bag of human ears as birthday presents or whatever. Anyways, without an character like the novel's Guo Fu to goad them, we now see the Wu brothers big jerks they are! That reminds me... Oh my God, those two idiots! I hate them so much! Close your mouth and learn some poetries, you worthless clowns! How could it even be possible that you have a master like Guo Jing and still suck so badly? God, what a waste, what an absolute travesty!

MOVING ON!

Okay, I'm now absolutely certain that I don't like Chen Xiao acting like an immature brat, at least not without a foil like Lu Wushuang to balance out his overblown silliness. Granted, this is also the same reason why I didn't like Huang Xiaoming's Yang Guo 70% of the time, which is why I can't put the blame all on the actor himself, but at this point, I can't wait for Guo Fu to finally chop off his arm and turn him into a real man. Please, Miss Guo, just do it! Do it for the sanity of the audience! Do it while Chen Xiao still has some dignity left!

Nothing on Michelle Chen, cause you guys already know how much I don't like her as XLN.

All in all, despite potential, this series continues to disappoint.

[hirobo2]

Never take half-measures, I always say. If Yang Guo really decide on the polygamy route, he might as well go all the way, if you catch my drift. Otherwise, I think he should just stick to his Gugu.

As for the latest episodes, I think they were just okay. Yang Guo's battles with Huodu and then Da'erba were one of my favorite scenes from the book, but I'm underwhelmed by what they gave us. Yang Guo is way too powerful in this drama. His fight scenes were so short and fast that they weren't even half as exciting as I'd expected them to be. The same goes for the other battles too. This really ticked me off something bad. So they decided to dedicate whole episodes to flashbacks but only like 20 minutes tops to the actual fighting scenes? In a wuxia series? What, are they high? Just because they renamed it the Romance of the Condor Heroes, do they think they're filming an actual romance?

Also, I don't like how they turn Guo Fu into a slow but sympathetic character. I mean, wow, she still defends Yang Guo even after he humiliated her in front of everybody in Wulin. That's... admirable. Pssh, are we sure her name's Guo Fu and not Guo Xiang? Because at this point, she might as well be Guo Xiang. Maybe they swapped personalities! Actually, if it wasn't already spoiled in the trailer, I would've guessed that the real Guo Xiang, with Guo Fu's personality, will cut off Yang Guo's arm 16 years later because she wasn't pleased with a bag of human ears as birthday presents or whatever. Anyways, without an character like the novel's Guo Fu to goad them, we now see the Wu brothers big jerks they are! That reminds me... Oh my God, those two idiots! I hate them so much! Close your mouth and learn some poetries, you worthless clowns! How could it even be possible that you have a master like Guo Jing and still suck so badly? God, what a waste, what an absolute travesty!

MOVING ON!

Okay, I'm now absolutely certain that I don't like Chen Xiao acting like an immature brat, at least not without a foil like Lu Wushuang to balance out his overblown silliness. Granted, this is also the same reason why I didn't like Huang Xiaoming's Yang Guo 70% of the time, which is why I can't put the blame all on the actor himself, but at this point, I can't wait for Guo Fu to finally chop off his arm and turn him into a real man. Please, Miss Guo, just do it! Do it for the sanity of the audience! Do it while Chen Xiao still has some dignity left!

Nothing on Michelle Chen, cause you guys already know how much I don't like her as XLN.

All in all, despite potential, this series continues to disappoint.

In my opinion, nothing done to date wrt ROCH has topped the fight scenes in the anime. Especially awesome in the anime was XLN deflecting Golden Wheel Monk's flying kick while she was down on the ground. Also, they managed to squeeze in a bamboo scene from Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon while dueling with Gongsun Zhi. Of course, there were things I didn't like about the anime, such as how they portrayed Golden Wheel Monk or Beggar Clan leader's stick. But overall, if an adaptation can't beat the anime fight scenes, they might as well not try. Plus, it's not like the actors and actresses in ROCH 2014 are well versed in martial arts. They were hired for their acting skills after all...

[whiteskwirl]

They were hired for their acting skills after all...

Let me know when they start using them.

[blurry]

I have seen most the episodes too. Here are my thoughts.

1) Good choice of getting Zhang Xin Yu as LMC. In the novel LMC is supposedly a beautiful maiden but in most past series she doesn't look beautiful at all.

2) MC as XLN was certainly a bad choice. Could have gotten Liu Shishi to play XLN

3) In this series HR seemed to be so much better than LMC in martial arts during their first encounter. If my memories serve me right HR is at par with LMC in terms of martial art skills.

4) I thought it was suppose to be another priest who killed that granny from the tomb? Did Yu Mama run out of funds to hire another six people to portray the other six Quanzhen heroes?

4) It was so unnecessary to add in HQG's romance story. Yu Mama needs to know that this is not another Gong series.

5) YG was way too powerful during the wulin gathering.