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Thread: Legend of the Condor Heroes 2017 《射雕英雄传》 - Yang Xu Wen, Li Yi Tong, Chen Xing Xu

  1. #201
    Senior Member yanfeng's Avatar
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    Ohhh... my favorite topic! HSDS's Zhaomin and ZWJ!

    ZWJ + ZZR
    I agree with Ken: ZZR getting jilted at the altar is not ZWJ's fault. She lied and cheated (and inadvertently killed- well at least in some versions) to get the marriage arranged, so it seems only just to me that not only does she not get ZWJ, it happens dramatically to her.

    Now I totally hear the point people make that her shifu was to blame, that circumstances were dire etc. but it's the same thing with legal systems.

    A criminal who was ill-treated as a child, who comes from desperate circumstances etc. can be justifiably given a lighter sentence or perhaps sent for therapy instead of punishment for theft and murder, BUT that doesn't mean that it is fair for other people to suffer for their suffering. ZWJ shouldn't be held accountable to marry her after being duped into promising to, regardless of how ZZR did all the un-right things she did because of "her circumstances".

    I've always been a little miffed at the pity ZZR inspires, and how that seems to "justify the means" with which she ultimately chose to carry out her plans. That she doesn't have enough of a spine to have a strong moral compass is a fault.

    ZM's father tried to make her choose between Wuji and her family/position/tribe, Wuji was caught between Wudang and Ming, Wuji's father was similiarly trapped between the 'good guys' and protecting his family... and they all chose in a way that didn't bend their moral compass (poor Zhang CuiShang and Ying Susu did so most dramatically by killing themselves. You could say ZM abandoning her family was a betrayal, but she made it very clear that she chose Wuji and she refused to take part in the fight against her family at the end. So I consider that cleanly defecting.)

    PS
    1) That's not to say ZWJ is golden... he's indecisive and pretty wishy-washy in how he treated the women in his life, but I don't fault his moral compass in choosing to rescue his Yifu over up-holding his promise to marry ZZR right then/there (i.e., he was still committed to marrying her later if she was willing.)
    2) On '78's Zhao min's ending. If I remember it right, it was open-ended... she seemed to 'appear' again at the end, potentially implying her jump was some sort of ploy. But yes, she jumped so that she got 'out of the situation' on her own terms rather than Yang Xiao's.
    Last edited by yanfeng; 09-22-16 at 12:25 AM.

  2. #202
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng View Post
    Never watched Adam Cheng's version of HSDS, but I never felt these criticisms of Cheung Mo Gei's character to be fair.

    1. Chow Chi Yerk secured Cheung Mo Gei's agreement to marry her through vicious and cruel acts of bad faith. She eliminated her remaining potential rivals by murdering Chu-yee and then framing Chiu Mun for the act. Is a person obligated to honor a promise that was obtained in bad faith?

    2. Even so, Cheung Mo Gei was fully prepared to go through with the marriage anyway. Even when Chiu Mun appeared at the wedding, CMG refused to leave with her until she showed him a few locks of Tse Tsun's hair. At that point, CMG left with CM with the goal of rescuing TT, and even promised CCY that he would return to wed her after he had rescued TT. That it never happened later on has more to do with CCY's subsequent personality transformation than anything CMG did.

    3. Regarding Siu Chiu: she was not CMG's to rescue. She was the Leader of the Persian Ming Cult, technically Cheung Mo Gei's superior (Chinese Ming Cult was subordinate to Persian Ming Cult). She had a duty to fulfill, just as he did. To go take her from the Persians by force would likely create a WAR between the Chinese and Persian branches of the Ming Cult...which would be the HEIGHT of irresponsible behavior and would throw away the hard-won new reconciliation of the two branches after over a century of conflict.
    Nice narrative, Ken, and I actually agree with your thoughts. I just don't like the new ending of HSDS (is that 2nd edition? 3rd ed? I cannot wrap my head around it). I hope we actually don't have another revision for LOCH, the many characters here already made my non Chinese head spinning...

    Quote Originally Posted by wkeej View Post
    Interestingly, I am quite shocked that Genghis Khan is acted by a Singaporean actor.
    http://www.tnp.sg/m/more/tv/how-ofte...-behead-people

    Only looking a few times, yes, he's from Singapore.
    Oh, this is actually nice! I like it when they include more actors/actresses from outside the Mainland. Adds to diversity, somehow. Reminds me of Anthony Wong in LOCH 2008 and his HK/UK background.

  3. #203
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    "During a battle scene where I was doing a full calvary charge on horseback, leading 100 soldiers into battle wearing full armour and with a huge golden sword in one hand, I felt like I was in (Game Of Thrones season six's penultimate episode) Battle Of The Bastards," he said.

    Tay insisted his supporting character Genghis Khan, also known as Temujin, is more like Jon Snow than his cruel nemesis Ramsay Bolton (played by Iwan Rheon).

    Set during the Song Dynasty, Legend Of The Condor Heroes tells the fictional tale of Guo Jing and Huang Rong and their adventures with martial arts legends, the Five Greats.

    As a boy, Guo Jing grows up in Mongolia under the care of Genghis Khan.

    "Genghis was a tyrant and would kill entire villages he had conquered, including women, children and dogs," Tay said.

    "But he had a human side, and believed in brotherhood and honour. Ramsay was just sadistic and a psycho."

    - See more at: http://www.tnp.sg/m/more/tv/how-ofte....EvUrVMeA.dpuf
    Interesting that Tay actually equated Genghis Khan with Jon Snow.

    Discuss? (I have no idea cos I've been avoiding GoT, cos I don't need another addiction)

  4. #204
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wkeej View Post
    OT: She is afterall still a Mongolian. She has made plans to leave with ZWJ. But the Ming (under Yang Xiao) is still on her hot pursuit. She reached the edge of the cliff - no choice but to jump.
    I see. Okay, that sheds a better light into the story. Thanks for this.

  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icha Parvati View Post
    Interesting that Tay actually equated Genghis Khan with Jon Snow.

    Discuss? (I have no idea cos I've been avoiding GoT, cos I don't need another addiction)
    Tay should be enjoying his role as Genghis Khan. For he was an army platoon officer. As an official, one will lead a group of 30-40 soldiers.

  6. #206
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    Michael Miu had an interview yesterday about, among others, his role as Huang Yaoshi.

    http://www.wxrw123.com/bg/20161008/3226560.html

    I've translated the part about HYS and also the latter parts here:

    http://riverandlakerealm.blogspot.co...loch-2017.html

    Of course, since I don't read Chinese characters, I am bound to make mistakes. Inputs are welcome.

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icha Parvati View Post
    Michael Miu had an interview yesterday about, among others, his role as Huang Yaoshi. http://www.wxrw123.com/bg/20161008/3226560.html I've translated the part about HYS and also the latter parts here: http://riverandlakerealm.blogspot.co...loch-2017.html Of course, since I don't read Chinese characters, I am bound to make mistakes. Inputs are welcome.
    "So when I was approached for the role, I said [just stop, I'll take it].
    I cannot reveal too much at this moment,
    versions of LOCH
    LOCH series (no mention of HYS character)
    (I or We as a production team) do not intend to make a superior edition or new classic of the novel.
    I hope to be myself , to create a new HYS , let the viewers see a unique portrayal of HYS"

  8. #208
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    Thank you very much, Krabs, I will revise it and acknowledge you for that!

  9. #209
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    Looking VERY forward to this, because Chinese series mostly now days have a marked decline in the quality of fight choreography in Wuxia (as another poster noted). Except for most of Jin Yong works. Romance of Condor Heroes have action that's good, Demi-Gods and Semi-Devils that's great!


    When can we expect a trailer?
    Last edited by Don Yu; 10-30-16 at 08:51 PM.

  10. #210
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    Not sure yet. Been watching over the Weibo too, but the production weibo address has gone. As in, I cannot find their weibo handle anymore. I hope it's not a bad sign or something. My Indonesian friends at Kaypang Gallery still reported that the editing is still ongoing, so it should be fine...

  11. #211
    Senior Member yanfeng's Avatar
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    Looking forward to this for Huang Yaoshi plus (with some trepidation since I'm not into the character, but think the actor's pretty awesome) Guojing. Alas, it's not out till 2017 and that somehow seems a long ways away!

  12. #212
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    haha, yanfeng, we're the same with Guojing. Cos, I've seen two adaptations (not a lot, I know, but I have no time for more adaptations other than 2017), and I haven't been warming up to GJ tho I know he's the model character. I do love the mature GJ in ROCH 83, but that's not the same with the young GJ...

  13. #213
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Yu View Post
    Looking VERY forward to this, because Chinese series mostly now days have a marked decline in the quality of fight choreography in Wuxia (as another poster noted). Except for most of Jin Yong works. Romance of Condor Heroes have action that's good, Demi-Gods and Semi-Devils that's great!


    When can we expect a trailer?
    I SO agree with you on your comments on the recent wuxia fight choreography! We have wire-fu these days instead of kungfu, it really hurts! While for the 80s series...Why, I could just replay and replay all the Quanzhen and Huang Yaoshi fights of the 1983 LOCH so many times because of their beauty...

    Anyway, I don't think I've put this somewhere in this forum (perhaps at the LOCH 83 thread), but here's the MV I made a while ago featuring the fights between Yeung Hong (Michael Miu) and Wong Yung (Barbara Yung). Just a sample of the beautiful fighting scenes of the olden days...



  14. #214
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    and this is the Chor Lau Heung fights in the 1984 Chor Lau Heung series:


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    Any ideas who will sing the theme songs yet?

  16. #216
    Senior Member leorio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Yu View Post
    Any ideas who will sing the theme songs yet?
    Laure Shang Wenjie, isn't? Can't wait.

    *slinks out of lurkdom*

  17. #217
    Senior Member yanfeng's Avatar
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    Woww! Those Barbara and Michael fights are really something! I love how she was fighting once without hands just to show how good she was! She's got attitude!

    And also with the stick, when she tossed and caught it... she does it with such flair. I agree modern fights don't have the 'cool' factor as much as the great hand-to-hand work from before. Fingers-crossed on LOCH 2017!

    PS I think Micheal and Barbara had so much chemistry even when they were meant to be enemies, and he's scum, I remember thinking... I wished Huangrong would like Yang Kang instead of Guojing! (Or maybe Guojing was just _that_ boring!) I'm hopeful that in the new LOCH 2017, the actor for Guojing (the fabulous Qing Long in Chusen!) will make me at least like the OTP better than the leading lady with the main villain!

    BTW all, I'm not spoiler tagging anything here, as with everyone else, because I assume that everyone knows the story of LOCH! If you object though, say so and we'll all be more careful.
    Last edited by yanfeng; 11-08-16 at 11:38 PM.

  18. #218
    Senior Member Icha Parvati's Avatar
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    hehehe, thanks a lot, Yanfeng... I agree that Barbara had the flair in those fighting scenes! She was amazing with her petite figure, she had Yeung Hong busy despite him slightly more skillful than her!

    I also assume everyone that comes here knows what happens in LOCH, so do pardon us if we spill the beans...

    Quote Originally Posted by yanfeng View Post
    PS I think Micheal and Barbara had so much chemistry even when they were meant to be enemies, and he's scum, I remember thinking... I wished Huangrong would like Yang Kang instead of Guojing! (Or maybe Guojing was just _that_ boring!)
    Hehehe... I evidently think the same too... But I also understand why in general HR is better paired with GJ, cos he balanced her and she made him smarter etc etc etc. But if YK turned back to the light... that might be a different story (tho I do like him with MNC too).

    Hey, here's a good discussion: HR vs YK, which one would win? Before HR was trained by HZG, I think YK would win.

    After she was trained by HZG, I think YK couldn't stand a chance.

    Or am I wrong?

  19. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by leorio View Post
    Laure Shang Wenjie, isn't? Can't wait.

    *slinks out of lurkdom*
    Thanks I hope it's good.

  20. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icha Parvati View Post
    But I also understand why in general HR is better paired with GJ, cos he balanced her and she made him smarter etc etc etc. But if YK turned back to the light... that might be a different story (tho I do like him with MNC too).

    Hey, here's a good discussion: HR vs YK, which one would win? Before HR was trained by HZG, I think YK would win.

    After she was trained by HZG, I think YK couldn't stand a chance.

    Or am I wrong?
    I can't remember.

    1. Has YK ever shown any liking for HR?
    2. Does YK has a formal/proper martial arts teacher?

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