Do Japanese Anime artis / Comic Authors and Video Game Designers read Chinese Wuxia?

[david85]

Or will they enjoy Chinese swordfighting novels if they happen to pick up some to read? I am a long time fan of King of Fighters video games and Iori and Kyo 's respective fighting styles, flame color and the sun / Moon symbols on their clothes make me draw a link to how Nine Yin and Nine Yang practitioners may fight. Moon represent Yin , , Iori fights with his claws , same as Nine Yin White bone claw , swift and deadly while Sun represents Yang , Kyo's moves are orthodox, open and aboveboard. Anyone has similar feeling?

[hirobo2]

I certainly hope not. Japanese artists are only good at crafting visuals. They can't craft interesting chars nor tell compelling stories for beans, which is why their popular anime chars are all knock offs of Chinese literature (Goku Naruto Inuyasha are all permutations of Sun Wukong). Makes no diff if Map artists read wuxia, cuz they'll just produce cheesy knock-offs if they do.

Besides all fighting games originated from Street Fighter. Instead of seeing Nine Yin bone claw, wouldn't it be better to think of the fighter as a Vega clone with the sharp claws?

[Ken Cheng]

ROCH was adapted in Japan as a manga and anime some years ago, so yes, some Japanese are likely fans of Chinese wuxia.

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

I certainly hope not. Japanese artists are only good at crafting visuals. They can't craft interesting chars nor tell compelling stories for beans, which is why their popular anime chars are all knock offs of Chinese literature (Goku Naruto Inuyasha are all permutations of Sun Wukong). Makes no diff if Map artists read wuxia, cuz they'll just produce cheesy knock-offs if they do.

Besides all fighting games originated from Street Fighter. Instead of seeing Nine Yin bone claw, wouldn't it be better to think of the fighter as a Vega clone with the sharp claws?

Can't say I agree with you. Animes like Ninja Scroll and Shadow Skills have very interesting stories and compelling characters and they are uniquely Japanese.

[hirobo2]

Can't say I agree with you. Animes like Ninja Scroll and Shadow Skills have very interesting stories and compelling characters and they are uniquely Japanese.

Every1 is entitled to their own opinion. But what exactly do you find so appealing about NS? The lack of an Oscar-winning screenplay (Lone Warrior strutting the world as a bum to occassionally take out a few bad guys, how original), girls love him for his bland personality, coupled with a few nude scenes here and there and a lot of gore? I'm going to be disappointed if it is b/c most ppl consume anime like they consume fast food. It tastes good right away but leaves you feeling empty inside at the end...

[hirobo2]

ROCH was adapted in Japan as a manga and anime some years ago, so yes, some Japanese are likely fans of Chinese wuxia.

There is a difference between a Chinese company contracting animation from a Japanese animation studio, and the other way around, where the Japanese company approaches the Chinese company b/c they really wanted to adapt the work. In the case of ROCH anime, it was the former.

[david85]

There are other examples that indicate Japanese animators might have drawn inspiration from Jin yong novels.

Samurai Shodown 4 's final boss Shiro Tokisada Amakusa whose gender orientation is ambiguous , similar to Dong Fang bu bai in that sense.

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

Every1 is entitled to their own opinion. But what exactly do you find so appealing about NS? The lack of an Oscar-winning screenplay (Lone Warrior strutting the world as a bum to occassionally take out a few bad guys, how original), girls love him for his bland personality, coupled with a few nude scenes here and there and a lot of gore? I'm going to be disappointed if it is b/c most ppl consume anime like they consume fast food. It tastes good right away but leaves you feeling empty inside at the end...

Li Xunhuan was introduced in the same way, a moody loner, who occasionally does good deeds. If you just use the single film then yes, Jubei was a rather bland character, but if you read his back story and the real life character he is based on you can see how multi layered he is.

Your criticism of anime being consumed like fast food is hardly a problem unique to the medium. Just look at how saturated the American comic book industry is. Dozens of TV series, two or three blockbuster films every Summer and I lose count of the cartoons they pump out. At least with anime we still get gems like the films Studio Ghibli make.

[hirobo2]

Li Xunhuan was introduced in the same way, a moody loner, who occasionally does good deeds. If you just use the single film then yes, Jubei was a rather bland character, but if you read his back story and the real life character he is based on you can see how multi layered he is.

Your criticism of anime being consumed like fast food is hardly a problem unique to the medium. Just look at how saturated the American comic book industry is. Dozens of TV series, two or three blockbuster films every Summer and I lose count of the cartoons they pump out. At least with anime we still get gems like the films Studio Ghibli make.

Ghibli Studio is another prime example of what I would call overated. This coming from some1 who was once addicted to Miyazaki but eventually out grew it. When I think about it, I mostly enjoyed these animated features for the artwork, the effort a certain animator expended to perfect every single animation cell. When I thought about it some more every one of them had an underlying story structure as weird as a certain Italian plumber who could fly b/c he acquired a raccoon tail. That kind of weirdness level. Looking back Ghibli became another one of those style over substance phenomenon for me, except a lot more effort put in than mainstream anime. I would say that the best thing that Ghibli ever produced was not any particular animation sequence, fantastical flying machines that would never be able to lift an inch off the ground without the potential to cause severe bodily harm during the inevitable air accident, but the song from Laputa Castle in the Sky. All I'm really saying is after all those years the only thing I still give a hoot about coming from Ghibli is this song...

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

Ghibli Studio is another prime example of what I would call overated. This coming from some1 who was once addicted to Miyazaki but eventually out grew it. When I think about it, I mostly enjoyed these animated features for the artwork, the effort a certain animator expended to perfect every single animation cell. When I thought about it some more every one of them had an underlying story structure as weird as a certain Italian plumber who could fly b/c he acquired a raccoon tail. That kind of weirdness level. Looking back Ghibli became another one of those style over substance phenomenon for me, except a lot more effort put in than mainstream anime. I would say that the best thing that Ghibli ever produced was not any particular animation sequence, fantastical flying machines that would never be able to lift an inch off the ground without the potential to cause severe bodily harm during the inevitable air accident, but the song from Laputa Castle in the Sky. All I'm really saying is after all those years the only thing I still give a hoot about coming from Ghibli is this song...

Yet one can easily make the same criticism of unrealistic situations to the Wuxia genre. The way they throw babies/children around would have killed or severely cripple them. Then there are the famously inconsistent feats of Linghu Chong who did things that defied even the internal logic of the novel itself. All fantasies use something that allows for the impossible to happen. In Wuxia it is Qi, Sci-fi it is pseudo science (or 'the force'), Ghibli it is magic. We all know that what happens in fantasy is unrealistic but we are all ready to suspend are disbelief for just a moment and imagine.

[pannonian]

Ghibli Studio is another prime example of what I would call overated. This coming from some1 who was once addicted to Miyazaki but eventually out grew it. When I think about it, I mostly enjoyed these animated features for the artwork, the effort a certain animator expended to perfect every single animation cell. When I thought about it some more every one of them had an underlying story structure as weird as a certain Italian plumber who could fly b/c he acquired a raccoon tail. That kind of weirdness level. Looking back Ghibli became another one of those style over substance phenomenon for me, except a lot more effort put in than mainstream anime. I would say that the best thing that Ghibli ever produced was not any particular animation sequence, fantastical flying machines that would never be able to lift an inch off the ground without the potential to cause severe bodily harm during the inevitable air accident, but the song from Laputa Castle in the Sky. All I'm really saying is after all those years the only thing I still give a hoot about coming from Ghibli is this song...

All fiction rests on conceit. If you can't accept the conceit, you're not really in a position to judge. Ghibli's material is certainly no more absurd than wuxia.

And if Kimi Wo Nosete is all that you rate from the Ghibli oeuvre, presumably you've not read the Nausicaa manga.

[hirobo2]

Yet one can easily make the same criticism of unrealistic situations to the Wuxia genre. The way they throw babies/children around would have killed or severely cripple them. Then there are the famously inconsistent feats of Linghu Chong who did things that defied even the internal logic of the novel itself. All fantasies use something that allows for the impossible to happen. In Wuxia it is Qi, Sci-fi it is pseudo science (or 'the force'), Ghibli it is magic. We all know that what happens in fantasy is unrealistic but we are all ready to suspend are disbelief for just a moment and imagine.

I'm loling at above 2 posts. When u both get older you'll both enter the stage where both of you will realize Ghibli movies ain't art. Miyazaki is a talented animator, nothing more...

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

I'm loling at above 2 posts. When u both get older you'll both enter the stage where both of you will realize Ghibli movies ain't art. Miyazaki is a talented animator, nothing more...

I am 36 now so if I haven't grown out of it by now I doubt I ever will. Whether a medium is art or not depends on whoever experiencing it. Just want to clarify one point, do you just consider Miyazaki not an artist, or the whole medium of animation not art?

[pannonian]

I'm loling at above 2 posts. When u both get older you'll both enter the stage where both of you will realize Ghibli movies ain't art. Miyazaki is a talented animator, nothing more...

What an odd claim to make. When I grew to love Ghibli films, I was at a stage where I mostly enjoyed only arthouse movies. I still haven't regained any love for blockbusters (I despise most of the Star Wars franchise), but I keep finding new aspects of My Neighbour Totoro to love. Probably because I grew up in the kind of rural setting that Miyazaki's films are a love letter to.

I'm pretty confident that, if you're such a great connoiseur of art, I can trump you with even more specialised niches to rave about. Or if you want, expound on your theories of art, with reference to the art and literary theorists of the 19th/20th century.

[hirobo2]

If anyone is willing to read a long exposition of my thoughts on Japanese animations:

My thoughts on Kingsglaive Final Fantasy XV (2016) trailer




.

[Snafu3721]

Condor heroes in Japanese is translated as "sha cho eiyuuden"
http://www.c-games.info/games,002,4608.html

That's an old PS1 game based on LOCH.

@Hirobo
Many Japanese manga and anime is essentially wuxia in visual form. You should check out Shigurui manga. It's based on the novel Suruga-jō Gozen Jiai which describes stories of many swordsmen who enter a competition. Each warrior has a unique backstory and the stories are revealed as the competitors fight in front of a literally insane Shogun. The manga version only adds an artists flare and style, but does not take away from the the original wuxia like story which is very solid on its own.

Whether you want to view manga/anime as "art" or not depends on your taste. But I wouldn't dismiss their "martial arts fiction" genre as only visuals. Especially since many great stories can be read via old school book medium instead of an anime.

[hirobo2]

Condor heroes in Japanese is translated as "sha cho eiyuuden"
http://www.c-games.info/games,002,4608.html

That's an old PS1 game based on LOCH.

@Hirobo
Many Japanese manga and anime is essentially wuxia in visual form. You should check out Shigurui manga. It's based on the novel Suruga-jō Gozen Jiai which describes stories of many swordsmen who enter a competition. Each warrior has a unique backstory and the stories are revealed as the competitors fight in front of a literally insane Shogun. The manga version only adds an artists flare and style, but does not take away from the the original wuxia like story which is very solid on its own.

Whether you want to view manga/anime as "art" or not depends on your taste. But I wouldn't dismiss their "martial arts fiction" genre as only visuals. Especially since many great stories can be read via old school book medium instead of an anime.

That's not entirely true. The Japanese had always thought of themselves as the true "China" stealing and copying from the real Middle Kingdom. Just check their traditional world map, Japan is the center of the world. Screw the length of the Pacific Ocean from Japan to America, JP really is the "ZhongGuo"! As such Japanese "wuxia" isn't really wuxia. It's a distorted form. Heck ask the average Japanese (artist) they'll probably say Japan invented wuxia. Hence, the work(s) u alluded to probably ripped off from some Chinese work, but the Japs will never acknowledge it d/t their inflated ego.

[pannonian]

That's not entirely true. The Japanese had always thought of themselves as the true "China" stealing and copying from the real Middle Kingdom. Just check their traditional world map, Japan is the center of the world. Screw the length of the Pacific Ocean from Japan to America, JP really is the "ZhongGuo"! As such Japanese "wuxia" isn't really wuxia. It's a distorted form. Heck ask the average Japanese (artist) they'll probably say Japan invented wuxia. Hence, the work(s) u alluded to probably ripped off from some Chinese work, but the Japs will never acknowledge it d/t their inflated ego.

And yet you dismiss Ghibli's and Miyazaki's work. Now there's someone with a broad and grounded view of the world (rather broader than yours), with a better understanding of world history than you blithely wave away. See one interview for Castle in the Sky where he comments on the waste of resources that is the abandonment of the Welsh mines. Or his comments on how the dissolution of Yugoslavia rendered the pessimism of the end of his Nausicaa manga. That's someone who doesn't see Japan as "Zhong Guo", but who has embraced European culture in its original form (Porco Rosso is his love letter to 1920s-30s Mediterranean Europe, with the key sequence an animation of a little known Roald Dahl short story).

[ThirdWayMonk]

Besides all fighting games originated from Street Fighter.

I always preferred Yie-Ar Kung Fu, which was ahead of its time

[david85]

That's not entirely true. The Japanese had always thought of themselves as the true "China" stealing and copying from the real Middle Kingdom. Just check their traditional world map, Japan is the center of the world. Screw the length of the Pacific Ocean from Japan to America, JP really is the "ZhongGuo"! As such Japanese "wuxia" isn't really wuxia. It's a distorted form. Heck ask the average Japanese (artist) they'll probably say Japan invented wuxia. Hence, the work(s) u alluded to probably ripped off from some Chinese work, but the Japs will never acknowledge it d/t their inflated ego.

Please don't give your Japan vs China shit in my thread. They are good at different things. You said Japanese have inflated ego ?! hah its pot calling the kettle black presuming you are from China.