Was Ouyang Feng a victim of Xenophobia

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

OYF was undoubtedly the most ruthless of the 5 Greats, but was his reputation for 'Evil' due to his personality or racial discrimination from Wulin?

OYF was certainly unscrupulous in his methods and never missed any opportunity to take advantage of his opponents, whether fair or unfair but was this enough to label him 'Evil'? He never established a school/cult with the intention of Wulin domination, in fact he seemed indifferent to that sort of power. Although he allied with the Jin's, this was an alliance of convenience and he never did anything openly against the Song. He was not squeamish about killing innocent people but did not make a habit of it or do it on a big scale.

We know that OYF came from the far West, possibly outside of Han China proper and may even have had red hair. Could his exotic appearance and background contributed to his 'Evil' reputation? Wulin was infamous for its racial discrimination, so it would be easy to see why they would make the most obviously 'foreign' of the Greats the 'Evil' one.

[Ken Cheng]

It probably didn't help matters, but it was primarily his actions as an individual. If Au Yeung Fung had been a benign, honorable person, I think they would have treated him respectfully as a friend.

[Ian Liew]

His reputation was established way before the timeline of the novels, and as such we don't really know what it was that made him "evil". It was bad enough that Wang Chongyang felt the need to teach Duan Zhixing Xiantiangong to counter the Toad Stance, and then set a trap at his funeral (which OYF, as expected, fell for). That's probably all we know about OYf's character pre-LOCH (other than his love life) and he doesn't seem to be a particularly honorable or pleasant fellow at all.

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

His reputation was established way before the timeline of the novels, and as such we don't really know what it was that made him "evil". It was bad enough that Wang Chongyang felt the need to teach Duan Zhixing Xiantiangong to counter the Toad Stance, and then set a trap at his funeral (which OYF, as expected, fell for). That's probably all we know about OYf's character pre-LOCH (other than his love life) and he doesn't seem to be a particularly honorable or pleasant fellow at all.

OYF's relationship with the other Greats has always been quite complex.

WCY rightly understood how vicious he was so allied with DZX and set up that trap at his funeral. But if he really thought OYF was 'Evil' then would it not have been simpler to just kill him? WCY was clearly the best of the Greats and while the fight would have been no means easy it was definitely winnable. It would seems that WCY's priority was to contain/control OYF, thus indicating that he did not consider OYF unredeemable.

HYS seemed quite admirable towards OYF. Part of this was because he respected the man's skill but I suspect it went deeper than that. Perhaps HYS felt a certain level of empathy for OYF as they were both outsiders.

H7G and DZX relationship with OYF can best be described as 'frenemy'. They might not like him but they definitely respect him.

Overall it seems the other Greats judged OYF as dangerous but not 'Evil' as the rest of Wulin did.

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

It probably didn't help matters, but it was primarily his actions as an individual. If Au Yeung Fung had been a benign, honorable person, I think they would have treated him respectfully as a friend.

True, but I have always been amazed that when a Han/orthodox person behaves like OYF they are rarely labelled as 'Evil'. Zuo Lengshan would be a prime example. Despite his ruthlessness he was never called 'Evil' by the majority of 'Wulin'. Even when his attempt to annihilate the (North) Mount Heng Sect and the unprovoked murder of Dingjing was made public no one ever denounced him.

[Ian Liew]

OYF's relationship with the other Greats has always been quite complex.

WCY rightly understood how vicious he was so allied with DZX and set up that trap at his funeral. But if he really thought OYF was 'Evil' then would it not have been simpler to just kill him? WCY was clearly the best of the Greats and while the fight would have been no means easy it was definitely winnable. It would seems that WCY's priority was to contain/control OYF, thus indicating that he did not consider OYF unredeemable.

HYS seemed quite admirable towards OYF. Part of this was because he respected the man's skill but I suspect it went deeper than that. Perhaps HYS felt a certain level of empathy for OYF as they were both outsiders.

H7G and DZX relationship with OYF can best be described as 'frenemy'. They might not like him but they definitely respect him.

Overall it seems the other Greats judged OYF as dangerous but not 'Evil' as the rest of Wulin did.

Wulin are usually afraid of those who they don't know, really - as far as they were concerned, wasn't Huang Yaoshi equally as evil? They were equally prejudiced against him simply because he did not conform to the normal ideals of wulin, and neither did Ouyang Feng. I doubt either Huang Yaoshi or Ouyang Feng concerned themselves with the petty matters of wulin for several decades, and had just lived off the legends surrounding their names.

I suspect that Wang Chongyang felt that although Ouyang Feng was a danger to wulin, he wouldn't be easy to kill. He may be able to beat him in a fair fight, but it would be wrong to storm White Camel Mountain unprovoked and kill him, and even if he did attack Ouyang Feng, it may not have been easy to keep him from fleeing. The greats had a certain level of pride and didn't seem willing to actively take a stand against each other. Even Hong Qigong, for all his disgust for Qiu Qianren, never did make a move against him until provoked by circumstance at the end of LOCH.

[tape]

Are there any passages about his reputation ? I know the Qiuzhen sect kind of talks bad about him but that's because he tried to steal 9 Yin.

I think the Jin mercenaries said they heard about his reputation, but it wasn't anything evil.

LOCH wasn't very wulin centric so there really aren't that many people commentating outside the people interacting with the main characters.

[EdenResident]

I don't think he ever had the reputation of being "evil" per se. His nickname is 西毒 but the 毒 part has more to do with his ability to utilize poison rather him being evil. Of course, Ouyang Feng may be unscrupulous in his methods but I don't think he ever schemes against someone specifically. Most of his actions are just for his own gain, like bullying Guo Jing to get the JiuYin manual. In his fight against other Greats, unless it's life and death (like when his boat was burning), Ouyang Feng always fights fair and rarely resorts to using poison to get the upper hand.

When I read Jin Yong, I get the sense that he would never portray any of his characters to be pure evil, like to the level of Stalin or Hitler. Even Cheng Kun, one of his most evil characters, has clear motives behind his schemes. In that sense, the only character I see that is truly evil is Ah Zi.

[Ian Liew]

When I read Jin Yong, I get the sense that he would never portray any of his characters to be pure evil, like to the level of Stalin or Hitler. Even Cheng Kun, one of his most evil characters, has clear motives behind his schemes. In that sense, the only character I see that is truly evil is Ah Zi.

You'll change your mind when you read Linked Cities - the number of complete scumbags in there make for some really depressing reading. Among his more famous novels, though, Zuo Lengchan and Ding Chunqiu are pretty bad news.