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Thread: Official LOCH translation

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    Senior Member Athena's Avatar
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    Post Official LOCH translation

    According to the Guardian, there will be an official LOCH translation. The first volume is already translated.

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ondor-jin-yong
    So huge, so hopeless, to conceive
    As these that twice befell
    Parting is all we know of heaven
    And all we need of hell.

    Emily Dickinson (1830-1886)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Athena View Post
    According to the Guardian, there will be an official LOCH translation. The first volume is already translated.

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ondor-jin-yong
    thx athena for your information,
    and the android ebook is expected to be released too , but in early 2018

    https://play.google.com/store/books/...d=9GQ9CgAAQBAJ

    i prefer demi gods and semi devils though, coz no one translate it to english yet, the only jin yong novel that no one translate it till finish in english , the team in this forum who translate it , all were already gone

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    We should be greatful that there will be more official wuxia in another language than chinese. I hope they will continue...

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    Looking forward to the Kindle edition.

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    Quote Originally Posted by a_tumiwa View Post
    thx athena for your information,
    and the android ebook is expected to be released too , but in early 2018

    https://play.google.com/store/books/...d=9GQ9CgAAQBAJ

    i prefer demi gods and semi devils though, coz no one translate it to english yet, the only jin yong novel that no one translate it till finish in english , the team in this forum who translate it , all were already gone
    Wait, I thought in the end, after multiple translators, the DGSD translation was finally finished some years ago.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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    Unfortunately the translator borked the names up... Huang Rong is now Lotus Huang, Skyfury Guo, Whirlwind Mei, etc... =\ (I've read a review copy).Deathblade talks about it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmPB-3jtSMc

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    Quote Originally Posted by CC View Post
    Wait, I thought in the end, after multiple translators, the DGSD translation was finally finished some years ago.
    unfortunately , it's fail to be completed , only up to chapter 45 (of 50).

    http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showthre...7#.Wnfcva6WZ0w

    hope someone show up as an angel and finish it

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    After noticing its review in our just arrived The Guardian Weekly, I looked for online version, see https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...es-translation

    Quote Originally Posted by Athena View Post
    According to the Guardian, there will be an official LOCH translation. The first volume is already translated.

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ondor-jin-yong
    « I know more than I can express in words, and the little I can express would not have been expressed, had I not known more. » — 弗拉基米爾·弗拉基米羅維奇·納博科夫

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    Quote Originally Posted by whiteskwirl View Post
    Unfortunately the translator borked the names up... Huang Rong is now Lotus Huang, Skyfury Guo, Whirlwind Mei, etc... =\ (I've read a review copy).Deathblade talks about it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmPB-3jtSMc
    I cringed a little at the rendition of those names too, but ... presumably the translation is intended for a Western audience with very little to no familiarity with Chinese names and cultural concepts - a very different audience to what seems to be the SPCnet readership (or the majority of it). I too would prefer pinyin, especially as that is how the names of Chinese modern day personages (eg. Xi Jinping) are rendered, with an asterisk highlighting the meaning of each character, but I am sure it was a deliberate choice by the translator not to do so. foxs has commented in another thread that "those characters belong to some fantasy novel, not historical wuxia fiction" ... and I can see where he is coming from but I think to the audience it is intended for are going to be so unfamiliar with that period of history that it might as well be fantasy (that's even before things like inner power projected through flute sound, etc, appear). At any rate I applaud the work the translator has put in, and hope that it achieves a measure of the success that the original work most certainly deserves.

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    So, Simon the Snow Blower and Yellow Pharmacist will become official names
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

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    Quote Originally Posted by a_tumiwa View Post
    unfortunately , it's fail to be completed , only up to chapter 45 (of 50).

    http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showthre...7#.Wnfcva6WZ0w

    hope someone show up as an angel and finish it
    I should really get around to finishing it then. But the 1st 45 cvhapters are a mix of edition 2 and edition 3 right?

    I know those few chapters I did from 30s to 40s were all 2nd ed.
    Its BIxie Jianfa Gawdammit you guys!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by CC View Post
    I should really get around to finishing it then. But the 1st 45 cvhapters are a mix of edition 2 and edition 3 right?

    I know those few chapters I did from 30s to 40s were all 2nd ed.
    hi CC, Justin has finished translate it , he use edition 2.
    and yes , some translators use edition 3, especially the part where Zheluoxing (Polo Singh in hokkien) and his brother appeared in Shaolin, make some confusion when i read the story

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    and my mistake from previous post, i cant find Sword Stained with Royal Blood english translation, so its mean no one translate it yet, so we have another JY's masterpiece not translated yet

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patudo View Post
    foxs has commented in another thread that "those characters belong to some fantasy novel, not historical wuxia fiction" ...
    In short, I don't hold foxs to be trustworthy as a translator. A recent example, for the 水仙刃 that 宋缺 wield in 第二十六卷,第五章:屢敗屢戰 of 大唐雙龍傳
    Quote Originally Posted by foxs View Post
    Akolaw [who pointed it out], thanks for sharing. The dictionary does give ‘narcissus’ as one of the definitions, but I thought ‘water immortal’ sounds cooler.
    And his translation being :
    Quote Originally Posted by foxs View Post
    Song Que caressed the blade of the saber with his eyes. He spoke softly, “This saber is called Shuixian [lit. water immortal; legendary aquatic immortal]. Based on this saber’s characteristic, I created ‘Tian Dao Ba Jue’ [heavenly saber eight secrets (of an art)]. Each secret consists of ten strikes, for a total of eighty saber strikes. The saber is ruthless, Shao Shuai must be careful!”
    Well, foxs "must be careful" not to mislead the illiterate ?

    The relevant passage :
      宋缺的目光在刀身來回巡逕,柔聲道:「此刀名水仙,本人曾就此刀的特性,創出「天刀八訣」,每訣十刀, 共八十刀。刀下無情,少帥小心啦!」
      「鏘」!寇仲掣出井中月,立時黃芒大盛,喜怒不露諸形色的淡淡道:「這八訣有什麼好聽的名字,閥主可否 說來讓在下開開耳界。」
      宋缺的目光離開水仙寶刃,朝他瞧去,卻啞然失笑道:「什麼開開耳界,不過你的不守成規,正是你的長處。 我「天刀」宋缺自出道以來,從沒有人敢與我刀鋒相對,絲毫不讓的硬拚三十多刀,代價只是一口鮮血,所以我才 破例讓你歇息後再戰,非是我改變主意,肯饒你一命。」
      寇仲哈哈笑道:「「天刀」宋缺也憑多廢話。我幾時想過閥主會刀下留情?閥主偏要這麼說,是否因殺我之心 不夠堅定,所以須先把話說滿呢?」宋缺微一錯愕,然後點頭道:「你這番話不無道理。如說玉致對我殺你的決心 沒絲毫影響的話,自是騙你。少帥可否再考慮宋某人勸你退出這場爭天下的紛爭的提議?」
      寇仲失笑道:「閥主仍摸不清我寇仲是那一類人嗎?」
      宋缺審視他好半晌後,訝道:「你若身死此地,還爭什麼天下。所謂好死不如惡活,你就算不怕死,這麼死去 卻是毫無意義。」
      寇仲洒然聳肩道:「都怪閥主你不好,自訂八十刀之約,不怕告訴你,小子根本不相信閥主能在八十刀內宰掉 我。再有一晚的思索,說不定明天我可揚長而去哩!」
      宋缺把刀鞘隨意拋開,左手揚刀,仰天笑道:「好!自古英雄出少年,「天刀八訣」第一式名為「天風環珮」 ,意境是有天仙在雲端乘風來去,雖不能看到,卻有環珮鏗鏘的仙樂清音。」
      寇仲歎道:「果不愧天刀的起首一式,只聽聽便知是神龍見首不見尾的奇招。閥主看刀!」
      有過前車之鑒,他再不敢讓宋缺主攻。
      當然面對如此可怕的大敵,他也不敢貿然進擊,當下提刀迫去,雙目緊盯宋缺。
      龐大的刀氣,立時朝宋缺湧去,寒氣漫堂。
      宋缺雙目閃過訝色,點頭稱許道:「難怪少帥口出狂言,原來不但功力盡復,且尤有精進,確是 非常難得。」
      寇仲倏地搶前,揮刀猛掃,化作黃芒,疾取宋缺胸口,凌厲如電閃。
      宋缺不動如山的瞧著井中月尚差尺許就往胸脅掃至時,才略往後移,手中水仙薄刃化作千百道藍汪汪的刀芒, 把寇仲連人帶刀籠罩其中,刀法精妙絕倫,令人難以相信。
      寇仲心知不妙,更知迅快飄忽至此的刀法根本是無法捉摸,無從掌握。
      刀風呼嘯聲在四面八方響起,寇仲猛一咬牙,在這生死懸於一線的危急時刻,純憑直覺去揣測宋缺殺氣所在, 於殺氣最盛處,化繁為簡,身隨刀走,一刀劈去。
      「叮」!一聲清響後,藍芒與黃茫不斷交擊。寇仲連擋宋缺接踵而來,有若鳥飛魚游,無跡可尋的連續九刀, 殺得他汗流浹背,差點棄刀逃亡。
      兩人倏地分開。
      寇仲橫刀而立,暗自調息,一時說不出話來。
      宋缺從容不迫的撫刀笑道:「少帥現在明白什麼是刀意嗎?」寇仲苦笑道:「想不明白也不行,原來感覺是這 麼重要。不過若我沒有猜錯,閥主並非真的想殺我,否則一出手就是道什麼娘的「天刀八訣」,恐怕我只能在地府 中去領悟什麼叫刀意。」
      宋缺長歎道;「你這麼想可是錯了。只因你不知道我是如何寂寞,難得有你這麼一個好對手,才不肯輕易讓你 迅快歸天。」
      寇仲調息完畢,信心大幅增強,微笑道:「小心愈來愈難殺我,第二訣又是什麼名堂?」
      宋缺欣然道:「愈難殺愈好,第二訣名為「瀟湘水雲」,雖是十刀,卻如霞霧繚繞,隱見水光雲影,流轉不盡 ,意態無窮,看刀!」
      寇仲忙喝道:「且慢!」
      宋缺淡然道:「若我發覺少帥是在拖延時間,少帥將會非常後悔。」
      寇仲哂道:「我寇仲從不會為這種事後悔,更沒興趣拖延時間,只因閥主的一訣十刀之數而想起一套名「血戰 十式」的凌厲刀法。閥主若能只守不攻,任我施展刀法,保證會是非常痛快暢美的享受。」
      宋缺大笑道:「我還以為你會說刎頸自盡。不過這「血戰十式」確能使本人聞之心動,即管使來看看。假若名 不符實,休怪本人沒有看下去的耐性。」
      寇仲暗忖最緊要你肯受落,嘿然笑道:「閥主小心啦!」
      立時提刀作勢,弓起腰背,上身微俯向前,井中月遙指宋缺,雙目厲芒電射,鷹售般一瞬不瞬的緊盯對手,作 勢欲撲。那種迫人的氣勢,換作一般高手,怕要立即不戰自潰,棄械逃生。
      宋缺持刀做立,點頭道:「果然有點對壘戰場,浴血苦戰的味兒。」
      寇仲沉聲喝道:「這一式正是「兩軍對壘」。」
      話猶未已,井中月化作黃芒,直向丈半外的宋缺射去。由於不用顧忌宋缺會以攻對攻,所以去勢份外凌厲,大 有一往無回之勢。
      宋缺目射奇光,寇仲這一刀最厲害處非是刀法,而是刀意。從他提刀作勢,至撲前狂攻,所有動作均渾成一個 無可分割的整體,雖是右手運刀,但這一刀卻包含全身全靈的力量,教人不敢小看。
      而最令宋缺又好氣又好笑的,是寇仲分明看準自己這把水仙寶刃利攻不利守,遂故意以言語誰得自己只守不攻 ,眼睜睜的吃虧。
      「噹」!宋缺錯往一側,左手水仙刃往上斜挑,正中寇仲刀鋒。
      寇仲手中刀芒大盛,冷喝道:「鋒芒畢露!」千萬點刀光,像無數逐花的浪蝶般變招灑往宋缺, 氣勢如虹。
      宋缺喝一聲「好」後,單手抱刀,喳喳喳的連閃三步,竟在刀光中穿插自如,最後才運刀斜削,劈在井中月離 刀把三寸許處。
      寇仲下一招「輕騎突出」竟使不下去,改為第四式「探囊取物」,疾挑宋缺腰腹。
      宋缺哂道:「少帥技窮啦!咦!」
      只見寇仲挑來此刀,其「刀意」正隨速度和角度不住變化,所以雖是表面看來簡單直接的一刀,落在宋缺這大 行家眼內,卻知因其無法捉摸的特性,如若被動的等待,必然擋格不住。縱是能勉強守過此招,接續而來的攻勢將 會令高明如宋缺也要落在下風,其後要扳平將非是容易。
      在寇仲眼中,見到宋缺神情略一猶豫,心知肚明宋缺終於中計。
      由上次交手到目下此刻,不理他如何努力爭取,卻從未曾搶佔得上風,又或奪得主動的形勢,可以說是給宋缺 牽緊鼻子來走。
      苦無辦法下絡給他心生一計,就是先以有形的「血戰十式」,誘使宋缺生出輕敵之心,再以剛從宋缺偷學過來 的「刀意」以子之矛,攻子之盾,迫宋缺改守為攻,那在心理上宋缺已像輸了一著,氣勢自然因此心態而有所削減 。
      眼前宋缺臨陣遲疑的情況,正是中計的如山鐵證。
      宋缺冷笑一聲,左手水仙刃立時化為仿如水光雲影的刀光,層層疊疊的迎往寇仲的井中月。終於放棄只擋不攻 。
      寇仲大笑道:「我都說沒可能只守不攻的哩!」
      倏地橫移,運刀劈在空虛。
      他終於首次看破宋缺的刀法,施展奕劍之術。
      宋缺生性高傲,寇仲這句話比劈中他一刀更令他難受,登時殺氣劇盛。
      豈知寇仲忽然退往他刀勢最弱的位置,劈出的一刀更如天馬行空般妙至毫巔,若他原式不變,等若把水仙刃送 上去給他砍劈的樣兒。
      而且寇仲的身法忽然變得奇詭難測,就像水中的魚兒,縱使一動不動,但只要你搞動附近的水流,他隨時可迅 速竄退溜動。那種靜中帶有強烈游移干定的特性,以他自問能洞穿所有變化的眼力亦大感頭痛。
      剎那間宋缺已知剛才的略一猶豫,已給這天才橫逸的小子搶佔得主動和上風。
      他的「瀟湘水雲」再使不下去,不怒反笑的吟道:「石上流泉!」
      似水流不斷的刀式,驀地化作一道碧光冶冶、穿巖漱石的清泉活水,水仙刃劃出一道藍芒,循某一條優美至超 乎任何言語所能形容的弧度,宜取寇仲。
      寇仲往另一方錯開,橫刀格擋,看似迅疾,其實卻寓快於慢,化巧為扭。
      「蓬」!接著連串兵刃交擊之音不絕如縷,宋缺的刀勢雖不住擴張,但寇仲已非完全處在捱打和受盡凌辱的劣 勢,更非宋缺要他向東便向東,往西便朝西的無法自由自主,而是有攻有守,且干時有今守缺頭痛的 自創奇招。
      最大的得益就是寇仲終學曉了如何在宋缺驚濤駭浪般的刀法中回氣的方法,那是繫乎輕重的把握,攻中藏守, 守中含攻。每在全力出擊或格擋後稍留餘力,以調節體內真氣,當中微妙處,非是臨陣對敵時,是沒 法掌握的。
      有點像每潛游一段時間後,就冒出海面透透氣,而不是死命在水底捱下去,宜至力竭氣盡。
      在宋缺的龐大壓力下,寇仲把渾身解數毫無保留的施展出來,把過去所有領悟回來的刀法發揮得淋漓盡致,配 合從宋缺身上新學曉的東西,愈打愈得心應手,暢快至極點。
      宋缺刀法忽變,高吟道:「梧葉舞秋風!」整個人旋動起來,水仙刃似是隨意出擊,全無痕跡刀路可尋,更因 其怪異的身法,寇仲一直力保的優勢立時冰消瓦解。
      「噹」!


    So, why akolow backs reinstating narcissus :
    Quote Originally Posted by akolaw View Post
    Narcissus in Chinese is water immoral, the leave look like the blade of sabre, while the flowers look like a lady stand on water, and was frequently use to refer to goddess of water, Madame of Xiang, is the most famous one, see the name of Song 10 secret include description of Xiang. Xiang is Hunan province.
    Last edited by 徐中銳; 06-08-18 at 04:22 PM.
    « I know more than I can express in words, and the little I can express would not have been expressed, had I not known more. » — 弗拉基米爾·弗拉基米羅維奇·納博科夫

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    Quote Originally Posted by foxs View Post
    I just found out that he slandered me in the other forum, in a thread that has nothing to do with this story. I wonder what it is that he want to achieve, other than, like Xiaohu said, to get attention.
    Because foxs has just accused me of slander, I'll give a better example of my said stance of his untrustworthiness as a translator. So, even after the following comment by LuDongBin, foxs still obstinately imposed his right to wilfully use "immortal image" as the translation of 不死印 :
    Quote Originally Posted by LuDongBin View Post
    Pedantically speaking, the correct word should be seal. Mudras or hand seals in the Tantric sense are used to stimulate energy flows (prana) in accordance to the 5 Elements. For example, the little finger represents the water element; ring finger represents earth; middle finger for ether; index finger for air, thumb for fire. Within the Chinese meridians, some of the 12 standard meridians pass through each of the fingers eg lung meridian (thumb). When you form these hand seals, energy flows are generated to nourish or strengthened certain parts of the body. One of the exercises in Naropa's Six Yogas is the forming of these hand seals. If you read the passage where XL was imitating the hand postures of the various Luohans, the specific hand seal described appears quite similar to Naropa's. And XL was practicing essentially something of Indian/Tantric origin. If I form a mudra and imprint it on mud or cement, that would be hand print. You see the subtle difference? I'm sorry if I belabored this point. What I am suggesting is based on acceptable nomenclature and i have offered evidence therein. But if you guys prefer to base on guessing and feelings then that is another story.

    At the risk of starting another round, the term 不死, may I offer "deathless"? Sounds better?
    You know, there's enough talk of "speak truth to power." It made me look up what's written about it. And Google prominently gives :
    "Speaking truth to power means believing deeply in what you say and fighting every day to have that heard. It may not be popular; it means taking a risk, it means standing for something." https://www.huffingtonpost.com/jade-...b_8824094.html
    « I know more than I can express in words, and the little I can express would not have been expressed, had I not known more. » — 弗拉基米爾·弗拉基米羅維奇·納博科夫

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    Quote Originally Posted by 徐中銳 View Post
    [URL="http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showthread.php/38694-大唐双龙传-Da-Tang-Shuang-Long-Zhuan-by-Huang-Yi?p=1145577&viewfull=1#post1145577"]In short, I don't hold foxs to be trustworthy as a translator.

    A recent example, for the 水仙刃 that 宋缺 wield in 第二十六卷,第五章:屢敗屢戰 of 大唐雙龍傳:


    The relevant passage :

      宋缺的目光在刀身來回巡逕,柔聲道:「此刀名水仙,
    Well now... instead of inserting large sections of Chinese text in a forum where the great majority of communication has been in English, why don't you offer your own, more "trustworthy" translation of the passage you pasted for the edification of the forum readership? ...

    ... and as an aside, if you're holding refined discourse with other wuxia truth-seekers on any Chinese-language discussion fora, please provide a link - I'd love to see whether your Chinese-language persona is as...quirky as your English one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patudo View Post
    Well now... instead of inserting large sections of Chinese text in a forum where the great majority of communication has been in English, why don't you offer your own, more "trustworthy" translation of the passage you pasted for the edification of the forum readership? ...

    ... and as an aside, if you're holding refined discourse with other wuxia truth-seekers on any Chinese-language discussion fora, please provide a link - I'd love to see whether your Chinese-language persona is as...quirky as your English one.

    You prove to have minuscule substance for reasoning.


    For transparency, let's cite the beginning of your pet-hate for me :
    Quote Originally Posted by Patudo View Post
    I haven't commented in literally years - but the post above has compelled me to suggest to the poster-surnamed-Xu...


    ...some might find labelling a well meaning post "commissar speech", with all its related unpleasant overtones - especially given that the Chinese expression cited is a well known and oft heard phrase - pretty deplorable in its own right. It may be that "not all witnesses would concur" that Huang Yi, or any other writer for that matter, has the power to adequately describe hand to hand battle of that nature. But I'm damn sure that a whopping majority of readers of this thread would be very glad if you could devote your energies to "helping" entertainment-industry types you "esteem" (your post #5695 earlier in this thread) and let the rest of us enjoy this most entertaining translation in peace.


    Rant over. I apologise to other readers if this has been too direct. I'd like to place on record my thanks to foxs for delivering what is in my opinion the most interesting translation on this forum - I am sufficiently invested to have resisted the temptation to Wikiread more about the era for fear of spooling the suspense - and for all his previous efforts.


    Quote Originally Posted by 徐中銳 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by wangxiaohu View Post
    Hahaha,
    Xu Xiong, foxs translation makes the reader feels like they witnessing the battle with their own eyes, so I called it flawless, or seamless heavenly clothes ( see : http://www.standardmandarin.com/idio...-clothes-idiom)

    You're jesting with your commissar speech ?


    I believe it deplorable rhetoric to generalise, summarily including everyone… And I find that in "foxs translation makes the reader feels like they witnessing the battle with their own eyes."


    I'm certain not all witnesses would concur.


    I remember :
    Quote Originally Posted by foxs View Post
    Xiaohu, truth be told, I am touched that you are so looking forward to the updates, but at the same time, I don’t want you to be disappointed, because sometimes real life interferes with this project. So … I am just going to ignore the fact that you are waiting …

    Are you not putting too much pressure on foxs with your enthusiasm ? How will anyone other than sagely akolaw dare to give constructive feedback ?


    Incidentally, speaking of battle, does Red Cliff gild the lily ?

    Little since from you are discerning. You're but a commissar of foxs—your pet-love. Can you proof otherwise ?


    And do really understand what trust is—when reading ??
    Last edited by 徐中銳; 06-18-18 at 04:52 PM.
    « I know more than I can express in words, and the little I can express would not have been expressed, had I not known more. » — 弗拉基米爾·弗拉基米羅維奇·納博科夫

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