another YG and GJ thread

**superboy** · 03-05-04, 01:39 AM

Basically, a combination of Sad Palms and Kicks.

**duguxiaojing** · 03-05-04, 01:43 AM

Yg was not sad when he was with WYS they were reuniting as old friends and drinking b4 competing skills when those guys from mongo camp showed up.

**Ken Cheng** · 03-05-04, 01:44 AM

Originally posted by duguxiaojing
Yg was not sad when he was with WYS they were reuniting as old friends and drinking b4 competing skills.

As long as Little Dragon Girl's whereabouts were unknown to him, Yeung Gor had a reserve of sadness sufficient to power his Sad Palms. He didn't absolutely have to be crying for his Sad Palms to work.

**superboy** · 03-05-04, 01:45 AM

He was in a depressed mood for 16 years without XLN. Basically, it was never said that the power of the Sad Palms reflects to the amount of sadness you have. You just needed to be sad. And JY is likely to mention it if it it were not in full power.

**sixdays** · 03-05-04, 01:46 AM

Originally posted by Ken Cheng
Three moves that the Golden Wheel Monk completely did not expect and was never ready for. The Golden Wheel Monk had not seen or fought Yeung Gor for sixteen years. The Yeung Gor he remembered had a nifty Iron Sword and an assortment of neat techniques, but NOTHING like the Sad Palms. If three moves were all it took to defeat the Golden Wheel Monk, forget about comparing Yeung Gor to the Greats . . . we'd be starting to pit him against the Janitor Monk. The context of that battle can't be ignored, however, because these factors do greatly affect outcomes.

isn't this just a testament to the uniqueness and power of sadpalms? after all, GLFW had never seen GJ's HL18Z before the heroes' banquet, yet he matched it head on without being defeated similarly. i know that sadpalms had unorthodox moves, but that in itself can in no way can insure the win. otherwise, YG could just use jade maiden and win the day. as to the context of the battle...wasn't GWM dominating YG before then, because of YG's injury and also the element of surprise? therfore, GWM should have control of the fight...making it even harder for YG to surprise him.

ken, if you could elaborate more on the fight itself...maybe make noodles give us a translation of the fight (

), then maybe we'd have a better chance of coming to a conclusion.

**sixdays** · 03-05-04, 01:50 AM

Originally posted by superboy
He was in a depressed mood for 16 years without XLN. Basically, it was never said that the power of the Sad Palms reflects to the amount of sadness you have. You just needed to be sad. And JY is likely to mention it if it it were not in full power.

just because he was sad for 16 years doesn't mean he was at full power. ever heard of coping?

JY never said that sadpalms depends on the sadness of the user...yet he didn't say that it WASN'T based on the sadness of the user. in fact, at the time he uses sadpalms against GWM, JY writes that YG was able to call upon the full power of sadpalms because he was about to die and be parted with XLN FOREVER. sure, this is circumstantial evidence, but it still points to the fact that sadpalms relies on the sadness level of the user. if anything, the burden of proof is on YOU to prove why sadpalms is not dependent on the sadness of the user.

besides, why would JY mention if the kungfu wasn't full powered? did he mention when the sweeper monk was full power against XF? did he mention if GJ was full power against JLFW at the heroes' banquet?

the point is, it doesn't matter...just like it shouldnt matter that JY said nothing about the "full power" of sadpalms while YG was fighting ZBT and HYS. it's called common sense...again, YG would not be the kind of guy who comes out with full power against his friends.

plain and simple.

**rabadi** · 03-05-04, 01:51 AM

I am not sure GLFW had never seen GJ's Dragon Subduing Palm, 'cause I don't think it was stated in the novel. Dragon Subduing Palm should be quite famous, ever since DGSD era, so GLFW *probably* already had brainstorming on his head before coming to that meeting on how to try anticipating the Dragon Subduing Palm.

**Ken Cheng** · 03-05-04, 01:52 AM

Originally posted by sixdays
isn't this just a testament to the uniqueness and power of sadpalms? after all, GLFW had never seen GJ's HL18Z before the heroes' banquet, yet he matched it head on without being defeated similarly.

The Golden Wheel Monk hadn't seen the Hong Lung 18 Palms before, but he knew to expect it. The Golden Wheel Monk was no fool: he'd done his homework on Gwok Jing and the other Greats before he ever set foot in China, and he knew that if he squared off against Gwok Jing, he'd be facing the Hong Lung 18 Palms. On the other hand, the very existence of Sad Palms was unknown to the Golden Wheel Monk. He never even imagined Yeung Gor being capable of such a palm technique.

We should remember the Golden Wheel Monk's attitudes towards Gwok Jing and Yeung Gor. The Golden Wheel Monk always had a certain respect/fear of Gwok Jing because of the latter's reputation, so he avoided direct one-on-one confrontations and always fought cautiously and strategically when he had to go up against Gwok Jing. Yeung Gor, on the other hand, had just been a talented, but inexperienced *kid* in the eyes of the Golden Wheel Monk. Although the Golden Wheel Monk had tasted a few defeats at Yeung Gor's hands, the Golden Wheel Monk never afforded Yeung Gor's martial arts (his cunning and guile, yes, but not so much martial arts) the same respect he had for Gwok Jing's martial arts. Hence, it was still possible for Yeung Gor to surprise the Golden Wheel Monk. The monk constantly underestimated Yeung Gor, and this proved to be his undoing.

**superboy** · 03-05-04, 01:52 AM

Basically, what element of surprise means is that it was totally unexpected. Like you get someone on the ground and about to finish him off. Then he suddenly pulled out a knife and *stab*

. It's not that he overpowered GLFW so badly that he flew 20 feet away, but the palms strucked his body a number of time. One can also argue if it's so powerful, why is 3 palms not enough to have killed GLFW, but just severly energyed him, while one palm from GJ and OYF both gave each others quite some problem when they were hit. But the popint is not to downgrade Sad Palms.

**rabadi** · 03-05-04, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by sixdays
...wasn't GWM dominating YG before then, because of YG's injury and also the element of surprise? therfore, GWM should have control of the fight...making it even harder for YG to surprise him.

Actually I think if you have been dominating someone in a fight, you tend to *underestimate* him/her, and thus the element of surprise is quite likely.

**rabadi** · 03-05-04, 01:54 AM

Never mind, Ken and Superboy already mentioned it above

**superboy** · 03-05-04, 01:55 AM

Deleted.

**duguxiaojing** · 03-05-04, 01:56 AM

"As long as Little Dragon Girl's whereabouts were unknown to him, Yeung Gor had a reserve of sadness sufficient to power his Sad Palms. He didn't absolutely have to be crying for his Sad Palms to work."

man u and super r really takin me apart 2 day thats very true this would also explain y he could not use full SP against GWM (since he reunited wit XLN) until he was bout 2 die good point may hat off 2 u

6D i think there is a translation already i dunno where i read it fromm though it may have been from this forum. basically he could have defeated GWM but GWM attacked a tied up GX YG defended got injured thought about losing XLN after all this time powered up palms and trashed GWM dunno bout 3 edit i heard GWM sacrificed himself or whatever.

**superboy** · 03-05-04, 01:59 AM

GLFW did fear that YG's strage movements might control him in another few hundred moves, therefore he used underhand tactics.

**rabadi** · 03-05-04, 02:00 AM

All these emotion powering martial art (sadness powering Sad Palm) talks remind me of an old Jackie Chan movie

**sixdays** · 03-05-04, 02:02 AM

i see where you're coming from, ken. yet at the same time, i can't believe that one can truly prepare for HL18Z. after all, its essence is a pure yang technique that just builds one level of energy greater than the other...

i will give you the point, though, that GWM knew what to expect against GJ while YG had the element of surprise. that's one thing that always frustrated me about GWM...that even in a life/death battle, he underestimates his opponent. well, he got what he deserved...

and by the way, superboy...YG did make GWM fly 20 ft down. also, YG hit GWM so hard that GWM was completely immobilized. when GJ hit OYF, OYF was still able to escape...

if you want to say that the difference between YG's kungfu and GWM is the same as the difference between GJ and OYF, that's just fine with me...

that makes YG look pretty good.

**sixdays** · 03-05-04, 02:04 AM

hahah, rabadi...

the jackal is such a great movie. probably the first one that i saw of jackie's other than "operation: condor". strangely appropriate, cuz we're arguing about the condor heroes...

**superboy** · 03-05-04, 02:06 AM

My point wasn't saying that GLFW didn't flew away when the palms struck him, but it wasn't like he matched palms with YG fair a square and still got knocked 20 feet, since he was strucked on the body. And you still haven't given me your basis on why you think YG wasn't using max when fighting with HYS and ZBT.

**duguxiaojing** · 03-05-04, 02:06 AM

actually GWM could have escaped he was inured severly but still able to move but was grabbed by ZBT

**duguxiaojing** · 03-05-04, 02:09 AM

After being hit GWM was hurt but still able 2 attack back it wasnt like he hit him 5 or six times and all he could do ws stand there

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