another YG and GJ thread

[sixdays]

to superboy:

My point wasn't saying that GLFW didn't flew away when the palms struck him, but it wasn't like he matched palms with YG fair a square and still got knocked 20 feet, since he was strucked on the body.

no one could knock GWM back 20 feet from matching palms, not even GJ. but i agree with your point

And you still haven't given me your basis on why you think YG wasn't using max when fighting with HYS and ZBT.

i already told you...my theory is based on the fact that the sadder you are, the more powerful you will be. my evidence is that YG's sadpalms when fighting GWM are much more powerful than when fighting ZBT and HYS. the burden of proof is on YOU to prove that sadpalms is NOT dependent on the amount of sadness you have...

and no, "JY didn't mention it" is not a valid argument.

[superboy]

But where did the idea of the sadder the more powerful? So why do you think so? We knew that YG tried his best but just drawed, although I thought it might be possible for him to beat HYS in a long fight. So is my 'invalid point' more valid then your's?

[duguxiaojing]

Thats what i had believed 2 i never thought bout it any other way till super brought it up. both theories work though YG was extremely sad when he thought bout losing XLN so he's powered up sad palms overwhelmed GWM. OR He was happy while fighting GWm after reuniting with XLN didnt feel sad till he thought of death got sad unleashed full potential..i no this is nitpicking but wouldnt he be a little bit sad that GX was in trouble which according to some theories whould allow him to use the full power of sad palm thus proving the theory wrong since when he was about to be defeated he unleashed an higher level of fighting ablility?

[sixdays]

again...he was sad when he fought ZBT, yet they were only a draw.

he was sad when he fought GWM, yet DEFEATED him.

since ZBT is around the same as GWM, don't you see the clear point here?

[superboy]

GLFW is not neccessary at the level of ZBT. They only exchanged a few moves, which can't be used to judge at all.

[duguxiaojing]

Yeah NICE ONE 6D i never thought of that if he was sad during his fight wit WYS then he must of been sad when he fought ZBT 2 so this disproves(is that a word?) the thoery of 16 years of pent up sadness giving him power...unless he was happy while fighting GWM which explains lower level of sad palms till he wasabout 2 die till he unleashed full power proving that tha the thory could still be valid.....damn this is starting 2 hurt my head so mayn turns...

Cmon Superboy how can u say that b fair even if he was greater then GWM he's only up by the smallest fraction all the greatest were pretty much dead locked at the end your letting the truth be block by u beliefs isnt that the thing u hate bout YG fans?

[sixdays]

i love having a passionate ally like xiaojing...

he can just yell at ppl while i throw out facts. it's a good partnership.

to superboy:

fine, GWM isn't to the level of ZBT. but how much lower can he possibly be? like xiaojing said, only by a fraction...if he was really that much lower than all the other Greats, then all of them shouldn't even have been worried at that point. why were they even afraid of him in the first place then?

[duguxiaojing]

lol

[Ken Cheng]

Originally posted by sixdays


he can just yell at ppl while i throw out facts. it's a good partnership.

Say, that sounds like the same arrangement I have with Candide (TristeCouer)!

[sixdays]

indeed...it's tough to debate with candide, because he knows how to attack you emotionally and make you forget the facts...he'll say stuff like:

"um...that last post was just a sack of garbage."

hahah, i respect the guy now...but when he was first comin at me in the "neverending debate" thread, i got pretty frustrated. goodtimes

[duguxiaojing]

Yo Ken how sad does he have to be for palms to take full effect? IYOIf YG can use full power of sad palms with out JY specifically mentioning it then wouldnt it be logical to assume he would be atleast a little sad when GX was tied up? IF that was true then why did JY later in the battle mention that YG was trying to unleash full power of sad palms while fighting GWM?

[Ken Cheng]

Originally posted by duguxiaojing
Yo Ken how sad does his palm have to be to take effect. If YG can use full power of sad palms with out JY specifically mentioning it then wouldnt it be logical to assume he would be atleast a little sad when GX was tied up? IF that was true then why did JY later in the battle mention that YG was trying to unleash full power of sad palms while fighting GWM?

I don't know if we can take a measuring stick to it, but Little Dragon Girl's being separated from him gave Yeung Gor a sadness that no other experience . . . not the fate of his father (both of them, Yeung Hong and Au Yeung Fung), the loss of his arm, his childhood sufferings . . . could match. If all kinds of sadness could generate the Sad Palm power, then the end of ROCH might have also been the end of Sad Palms. At the end of ROCH, Yeung Gor was happily reunited with Little Dragon Girl, made peace with his father's past, reconciled with the Gwok family (even Gwok Fu), and became a great and respected hero to the people of China for killing Mongke Khan. There wasn't much for him to be sad about anymore, so the Sad Palms might have been retired even before Yeung Gor himself was.

[duguxiaojing]

This is unfair u r better writer then me and not taking question on directly

[Ken Cheng]

Originally posted by duguxiaojing
This is unfair u r better writer then me and not taking question on directly

When it comes to writing, *I'm* Dook Goo Kau Bai.

Although I prefer to think of myself as my avatar (Sai Mun Chui Sheut).

[rabadi]

Originally posted by Ken Cheng
When it comes to writing, *I'm* Dook Goo Kau Bai.

I like to annoy people with my joke posting, so perhaps I'm ZBT in writing, though unfortunately I cannot type with 2 keyboards using L/R Technique

[superboy]

Originally posted by sixdays
i love having a passionate ally like xiaojing...

he can just yell at ppl while i throw out facts. it's a good partnership.

to superboy:

fine, GWM isn't to the level of ZBT. but how much lower can he possibly be? like xiaojing said, only by a fraction...if he was really that much lower than all the other Greats, then all of them shouldn't even have been worried at that point. why were they even afraid of him in the first place then?

Possibly by a significant gap or a slight amount. We see GLFW having problem with just the wierd moves of YG Sad Palms without it's power. But the weird movements plus the power of Sad Palms were not able to beat ZBT. So your previous statment of ZBT=GLFW is an invailid point to back up the point of the sadder you are the stronger the sad palms.

[Anonymous]

Ken: Hong Lung 18 Palms was a martial art that favored straightforward personalities like those of Kiu Fung, North Beggar Hung 7 Gung, and Gwok Jing. Yeung Gor, a complex personality if there ever was one, was not suited for learning Hong Lung 18 Palms.
--- YG could learn the 18DragPalm (recall IronSword/WoodenSword theory is not unlike 18DragPalm). All great martial arts seem to converge at the end. YG just needs to understand it, though I can see YG would suck at HL18Z with GJ as teacher ...
.
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Super: In HSDS, ZWJ said 9 Yin and 9 Yang doesn't mix. So there couild be a problem if YG's energy is too Yang.
--- Actually, YG has experience with Yin/Yang. AncientTomb=Yin and he was able to convert the Yin style to Yang style for his purposes (and that was when he was young. ) Also, YG could do soft/hard (Yin/Yang?) from the "sounds" created by the WoodenSword practice sessions.
.
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6Day: an injured YG defeated GLFW in 3 moves . PERIOD.
--- Only because GLFW was caught off-guard. Bummer.
.
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6Day: isn't this just a testament to the uniqueness and power of sadpalms? after all, GLFW had never seen GJ's HL18Z before the heroes' banquet, yet he matched it head on without being defeated similarly.
--- Actually, JY never mentions HL18Z during the clash. Just that they clashed.
.
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6Day: GWM knew what to expect against GJ while YG had the element of surprise. that's one thing that always frustrated me about GWM...that even in a life/death battle, he underestimates his opponent.
--- YG also underestimated GWM, so basically their advantages are neutralized when they go head-to-head.
.
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Ken: At the end of ROCH, [...] There wasn't much for him to be sad about anymore, so the Sad Palms might have been retired even before Yeung Gor himself was.
--- Optimism says: YG just loses the SadPalm as focus, and he can probably create another focus ... like LovePalms. He's a greatOne.

[sixdays]

lovepalms...that's hilarious

although it might be love swordplay, if you know what i mean...

"Gu Gu, come here. i've learnt a new kungfu..."



to superboy:

i don't believe that it was purely because of the strange movements of sadpalms that YG was able to defeat GWM. if it were only that the kungfu were strange, why would HYS (most likely the most knowledgeable man of martial arts in the central plains) say that sadpalms were able to be compared with HL18Z? if strange moves were all it took to defeat GWM, we might as well all learn reverse 9yin and kick the monk's arse.

[hitman]

Originally posted by duguxiaojing
Yo Ken how sad does he have to be for palms to take full effect? IYOIf YG can use full power of sad palms with out JY specifically mentioning it then wouldnt it be logical to assume he would be atleast a little sad when GX was tied up? IF that was true then why did JY later in the battle mention that YG was trying to unleash full power of sad palms while fighting GWM?

That is basically 2 different emotions.YG Sad Palm was basically about sadness regarading love problem.Love and friendship produces 2 totally different emotions.For YG Sad Palm to work it only requires YG to be in sad mood(love).There is no such thing as the more sadder the more powerful you can become but only affect the way you fight,i.e. becoming wild and crazy.

Before YG reunite with XLN,he was in a sad mood due to missing XLN.After meeting XLN back such sad mood naturally disapear.That is why YG Sad Palm is not working only during his fight against GWM.There is no reason to suggest that YG wasn't at his best when fighting ZBT or HYS due to their 'friendly' spar.When Greats fight,they must put their best or else they end up losing terriblely(refer to 2nd Wah Shan tournament).In fact in the novel YG had to put in his best when fighting ZBT because he realized if he refused to use his best effort he would immediately lose to ZBT.They only stop fighting when YG realized to settle who is better is by competing internal energy battle which might end up one will be dead.

[PJ]

Originally posted by rabadi
Actually I think if you have been dominating someone in a fight, you tend to *underestimate* him/her, and thus the element of surprise is quite likely.

This is probably YG's biggest advantage - you think he is losing but he can pull out something completely unexpected. But if you are carefully expecting it, then it doesn't work.