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Thread: The Bund 《上海灘》

  1. #241
    Senior Member Ghaleon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    Oddly enough, until THE BUND, Angie Chiu was known mainly for her wuxia roles. After THE BUND, however, she wasn't assigned to many wuxia projects; THE BUND steered her towards more 1930s and modern roles.

    Chow Yun Fat and Angie Chiu were already established as stars before THE BUND, but Ray Lui's career probably benefited the most from the series. It was literally his first starring role. He would be one of TVB's most dependable actors for the rest of the decade (although because of his edginess as Ding Lik, he got many villainous roles at TVB).
    Yeah I remember Ray primarily from Flying Fox back in the 80's. Although he's popular i haven't seen him in any other serial (until watching The Bund). I just read from wikipedia.org that lot of people consider the death scene and the wedding scene the greatest scenes of all-time. I thought both scenes were *perfect*.

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post
    Yeah I remember Ray primarily from Flying Fox back in the 80's. Although he's popular i haven't seen him in any other serial (until watching The Bund). I just read from wikipedia.org that lot of people consider the death scene and the wedding scene the greatest scenes of all-time. I thought both scenes were *perfect*.
    My favorite THE BUND scenes are as follows. They are listed in order of how much I personally liked them (from best to least best).

    1. The conversation between Hui Mun Keung and Ding Lik just before Ding cut off Hui's finger. People usually don't list this scene as their favorite or the best or the most memorable scene of THE BUND, but it's always been my personal favorite. The two actors' performance, I think, was never more subtle or nuanced than in this touching scene. In this scene, we see the strength of the brotherhood between Hui Mun Keung and Ding Lik...the depth of Ding's loyalty to Hui, and the anguish that Ding experienced at being caught between two benefactors (Hui and Fung Ging Yiu). The dialogue was extremely compelling, and revealed so much about the souls of both characters. It was my favorite moment of the series.

    2. The Farewell Scene: between Hui Mun Keung and Fung Ching Ching. This one often comes up as a favorite/best scene in THE BUND, and it's hard to argue against it. I especially loved the moment when Ching Ching told Mun Keung she wasn't giving him a last chance "because he wasn't worth it." That moment was absolutely heartbreaking, but it wasn't done in a maudlin way. Although this was a violence-free scene with no blood, fighting, or guns, it was, in one way, the most brutal moment in THE BUND: the moment that Ching Ching broke Mun Keung's heart. You'd have never guessed that *she*, of all people, could be so ruthless...and could wound Mun Keung more deeply than any gun or knife ever could.

    3. The Wedding Scene: another classic moment. For me, I think the best part was when Mun Keung saw Ah Lik putting the ring on Ching Ching's finger and realized that it was really all over between himself and Ching Ching.

    4. The Death Scene: 'Nuff said. A moment of silence, please.

    *********************************

    5. The "Snowfall/Umbrella" Scene: Hui Mun Keung shelters Ching Ching with an umbrella after it begins to snow. Textbook example of the right way to do a romance scene.

    6. The KMT Shoot Scene: like gritty, violent scenes? Check this one out.

    7. Hui Mun Keung goes to the weapons warehouse on a foggy night: nobody ever singles out this scene for special attention, but I think it's extremely underrated. What a great noir feel in this scene! I never thought the noir was stronger than it was in this sequence.

    8. The Chin Woo Martial Arts School vs. Japan Heavenly Dragon Society rumble (and Hui Mun Keung kills Kyoko Yamaguchi). This was the best action sequence in THE BUND...possibly the biggest fight scene in a TVB series outside of wuxia adaptations. It was a gang rumble of massive proportions. The moment I loved most was when Kyoko was trying to flee and Hui Mun Keung was chasing her. A number of Japanese fighters got in his way and Mun Keung, losing patience, just pulled his gun and SHOT the f*ckers. It was just so cool how he pulled out his gun in the middle of this fight and brought it to a stop with just one shot. AWESOME!

    9. Speaking of Hui Mun Keung and guns, who could forget Episode 3 and the train station. Hui Mun Keung: "This gun here has only six bullets." BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! This image was so cool that it was later used in BUND promotional pictures. It became *the* iconic still image from THE BUND...just like Gwok Jing shooting his arrow for LOCH.

    10. Episode 1: we see Mun Keung's awesome prowess for the first time when he goes to that rival cinema owner's office and singlehandedly takes back those films that he stole. Who needs other thugs when you have Hui Mun Keung on your side? He's a one-man army!

    There were so many more scenes in this series that I could list as great moments, but I'll stop with these ten. One could easily compile a book of great BUND moments because this series rocked from end to end.

  3. #243
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    I won't be getting around to watching THE BUND II for a few weeks (got to finish DGSD '81 this week and take five weeks to get through the first BUND), but some random preliminary thoughts based on my scannings in recent weeks:

    1. The Cheung Gwai character had limited, but memorable appearances in the first BUND. In THE BUND II, Cheung Gwai plays a far more prominent role, and is one of the series' most dynamic characters. Liu Kai Tze did a great job bringing this character to life in both parts.

    2. Miu Kiu Wai begins to appear in THE BUND II, but does not do much of significance until THE BUND III (I don't know if he played the same character in both parts; he was in the first BUND too as a street protester). He and Felix Wong both have fairly significant roles in THE BUND III.

    3. Great attention to detail in Chow Yun Fat's lone cameo reprise of Hui Mun Keung in Episode 4's flashback sequence. TVB had both Chow Yun Fat and Ding Lik dressed to look the way did in BUND just before Hui Mun Keung betrayed Fung Ging Yiu. Even so, you can tell that this wasn't an outtake from BUND; this was shot specifically for BUND II.

  4. #244
    Senior Member Ghaleon's Avatar
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    Thanks Ken for posting your favorite scenes in detail. It was nice seeing the finger chopping scene and the wedding scene on the cover of the DVD set. They chose great scenes for the cover. I also like the costume that CYF wears as the main picture on the cover. I think he looks slick in that (even though you said that's a flashback scene in Bund II).

    7. Hui Mun Keung goes to the weapons warehouse on a foggy night: nobody ever singles out this scene for special attention, but I think it's extremely underrated. What a great noir feel in this scene! I never thought the noir was stronger than it was in this sequence.
    This was a great ode to film noir. The atmosphere, the shadows and ambient music were perfect. They also paid homage to Godfather with the Godfather music being played when the Chin Woo Athletic members were gunned down in their own place.

    2. The Farewell Scene: between Hui Mun Keung and Fung Ching Ching. This one often comes up as a favorite/best scene in THE BUND, and it's hard to argue against it. I especially loved the moment when Ching Ching told Mun Keung she wasn't giving him a last chance "because he wasn't worth it." That moment was absolutely heartbreaking, but it wasn't done in a maudlin way. Although this was a violence-free scene with no blood, fighting, or guns, it was, in one way, the most brutal moment in THE BUND: the moment that Ching Ching broke Mun Keung's heart. You'd have never guessed that *she*, of all people, could be so ruthless...and could wound Mun Keung more deeply than any gun or knife ever could.
    I agree that this was a great scene. It's the climax (aside from the final scene) to the downbeat romance between the two leads. The series wouldn't be truly dark and downbeat without this scene.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    I won't be getting around to watching THE BUND II for a few weeks (got to finish DGSD '81 this week and take five weeks to get through the first BUND), but some random preliminary thoughts based on my scannings in recent weeks:
    Remember to post your comments and analysis when you get to Bund II. Based on ur lengthy discussions, i'm compelled to write a very brief review of Bund I. I'll try to make it as short as possible: "greatest series ever" BTW in DGSD '81, did Sweeper Monk actually get killed?
    Last edited by Ghaleon; 03-02-09 at 12:14 PM.

  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post
    Thanks Ken for posting your favorite scenes in detail. It was nice seeing the finger chopping scene and the wedding scene on the cover of the DVD set. They chose great scenes for the cover. I also like the costume that CYF wears as the main picture on the cover. I think he looks slick in that (even though you said that's a flashback scene in Bund II).
    Yeah, the outfit looks really GODFATHERish. I wonder why they saved it up for a flashback sequence only.

    This was a great ode to film noir. The atmosphere, the shadows and ambient music were perfect. They also paid homage to Godfather with the Godfather music being played when the Chin Woo Athletic members were gunned down in their own place.
    Another great noir moment was at the end of Episode 5...underneath the tunnel when Hui Mun Keung was talking about splitting up his partnership with Ding Lik and the two brothers going their separate ways.


    BTW in DGSD '81, did Sweeper Monk actually get killed?
    Yes, unfortunately. Mo Yung Bok (who was newly superpowered after having secretly trained with Shaolin manuals) and the foreign monk Kau Mor Tze ganged up on him and overpowered him (as if that were actually plausible).

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    Wow, we have a Bund thread here!? I didnt know, let me join

    Very good favourite scenes you are listing Batman, but dont forget the final confrontation between CYF and Fung Ging Yiu. I got to say that scene is one of my top favourites, much better than the last duel with Lip Yan Wong. Well, maybe because I grew up with the final duel scene of Lip Yan Wong, that I didnt find it quite surprising or exciting.

    There was a Swedish channel here in Norway that showed a clip of the Bund during early 80s, and my dad taped it down. Basically they showed an extended clip starting from when HMK and DL is speaking in the alley and all the way until Lip Yan Wong gets shot. So yes, The Bund was so popular that it found its way to a preview here in Scandinavia in the 80s, in a time when people here still didnt really know who the heck Jackie Chan was :P It was kind of funny, because the guy who translated the dialogues to Swedish was kind of rusty in his/her Cantonese. There is this dialogue when HMK and DL is speaking in the alley. HMK says that Lip Yan Wong won't kill him, because he's still valuable to him. So HMK says in Canto: "Yan wai ngo chong yau lei yong ka chik". And the Swedish translator thought he said: "Yan wai ngo chong yau yat co ka che" hehe..which he translated as "Because I still have a sister" :P Funny funny! And he didnt know Lip Yan Wong was a name of a guy, so he translated the name as "The hunting king" LOL.

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    Senior Member Ghaleon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    Another great noir moment was at the end of Episode 5...underneath the tunnel when Hui Mun Keung was talking about splitting up his partnership with Ding Lik and the two brothers going their separate ways.

    Yes, unfortunately. Mo Yung Bok (who was newly superpowered after having secretly trained with Shaolin manuals) and the foreign monk Kau Mor Tze ganged up on him and overpowered him (as if that were actually plausible).
    Ahh i must've missed that one in ep. 5. I'll have to take another look at it again sometime after watching II and III. Yeah i was kind of annoyed at DGSD 81 because they actually killed Sweeper Monk. I was "ok" at the final boss scene but not ok with them killing off mr. invincible sweeper monk.

    ery good favourite scenes you are listing Batman, but dont forget the final confrontation between CYF and Fung Ging Yiu. I got to say that scene is one of my top favourites, much better than the last duel with Lip Yan Wong. Well, maybe because I grew up with the final duel scene of Lip Yan Wong, that I didnt find it quite surprising or exciting.
    HELL YEAH! That was a f-king awesome scene with LOT of tension. I also didn't expect HMK to actually kill FGY. I thought we were going to get some stupid a$$ scooby doo ending or something between the two. So I'm glad HMK actually pulled the trigger So the one thing that makes The Bund really special is that it doesn't follow any conventions. It does whatever it wants to, it doesn't cop out like other series giving us stupid conventional happy happy endings. The Bund shows things (especially violence) the "way they are", and doesn't sugarcoat it for us.
    Last edited by Ghaleon; 03-02-09 at 04:45 PM.

  8. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post
    HELL YEAH! That was a f-king awesome scene with LOT of tension. I also didn't expect HMK to actually kill FGY. I thought we were going to get some stupid scooby doo ending or something between the two. So I'm glad HMK actually pulled the trigger
    Totally agree on this one! But I kind of wasnt surprised that he shot FGY, because I actually watched Shanghai Grand before the original Bund. Yes yes, I know, it is Norway, a country where Chinese movies/series were few to non-existent when I grew up. I literally had to wait about 20 yrs before I could get my hands on The Bund, and tragically my first experience with it was the heavily edited VCD version.

    But back to FGY duel, yeah it was powerful, and if it was a series of today's standard, it would definitely be a lame scooby doo result, like the daughter running in begging for her dad's life...huhh yawn! And how cool it is when DL spins the coin, and HMK slams it down..and that echo fills the room...you just gotta love it! And the coolest thing is that the coin slamming backfires on HMK, and he's still into the game..accepting to fire the first shot...how cool is that

  9. #249
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post
    Ahh i must've missed that one in ep. 5. I'll have to take another look at it again sometime after watching II and III.
    It's a great scene. Hui Mun Keung was refusing to sell out and work for Fung Ging Yiu, but Ah Lik, who didn't want to see his dream of making it in Shanghai go up in smoke, was ready to join Fung's organization. That's when Hui told Ding that perhaps they should go their separate ways.

    Ah Lik was torn. He wanted to continue to be in the game in Shanghai, but he didn't want to do it without Mun-gor (especially since he knew it was his rashness in killing Lo Gum that blew it for Mun-gor and himself). Ah Lik was very conscious that he would never have gotten as far as he had without Mun-gor's help, and he remembered that it was Mun-gor who saved his life when he was in danger of bleeding to death.

    So Ah Lik tearfully said to Mun-gor's back, "Mun-gor! You've taught me so much! You've saved my life! Everything I owe you, I'll now repay you!"

    So saying, Ah Lik drew a knife out of his pocket, and slashed his arm with it...at the same spot where he was slashed in the past by Ah Bing's thugs when he failed to assassinate Hui Mun Keung. Ah Lik was literally repaying the blood debt he owed to his brother.

    It was when Mun Keung saw the depth of Ah Lik's loyalty that he decided to join Fung Ging Yiu's organization after all (although he'd come to regret that decision).

    HELL YEAH! That was a f-king awesome scene with LOT of tension. I also didn't expect HMK to actually kill FGY. I thought we were going to get some stupid a$$ scooby doo ending or something between the two.
    This is THE BUND. Would that ever happen in THE BUND?

    I loved the cruel smile that grew on Hui Mun Keung's lips as the fifth shot came up blank, sealing Fung Ging Yiu's fate. He pointed the gun at Fung Ging Yiu and said menacingly, his voice dripping with hate, "Fung Ging Yiu...this bullet belongs to you."

    And notice what Fung Ging Yiu said as he went down on his knees, horrified, and pleaded for his life..."Mun Keung...please...!"

    He didn't call him "Hui Mun Keung" or "Mr. Hui." He called him "Mun Keung," like back in the days when Hui worked for him and Fung was fond enough of him to want him to be his son-in-law. It was almost as if Fung Ging Yiu, in the moment before his death, regretted all that he had done to Mun Keung and not only wanted Mun Keung to spare his life, but to go back to being his loyal follower like in the "good old days." But it was far, far too late. That bullet indeed had Mr. Fung's name on it.

    The utter terror on Fung Ging Yiu's face when he knew he was doomed was priceless. Lau Dan is the most underrated performer in THE BUND.

    Symbolism:

    What was Hui Mun Keung wearing when he killed Fung Ging Yiu? Not his gangster suit. He was once again dressed like he was in Hong Kong...when his wife and the rest of his adopted family were murdered by Fung Ging Yiu's assassin. It was almost as if Mun Keung were saying through his clothes, "This is for my family, you bastard."

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    Senior Member Ghaleon's Avatar
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    But back to FGY duel, yeah it was powerful, and if it was a series of today's standard, it would definitely be a lame scooby doo result, like the daughter running in begging for her dad's life...huhh yawn! And how cool it is when DL spins the coin, and HMK slams it down..and that echo fills the room...you just gotta love it! And the coolest thing is that the coin slamming backfires on HMK, and he's still into the game..accepting to fire the first shot...how cool is that
    Yeah actually it was a "duel" in every sense of the word. I mean the producers couldn't show them actualy "fighting" each other physically because HMK would easily crush him. So the next best thing to do for a "versus" match is the bullet game which is much more chilling than any "fight" scene could be!

    I first saw this type of bullet game or whatever it's called in the movie Deer Hunter, which won the oscars for best picture. Then it was showed in season 3 of 24 the tv show. I'm glad I got to see it again in The Bund. It's a cruel cruel world.

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    SCOOBY-DOO ending of THE BUND:

    Hui Mun Keung shoots Fung Ging Yiu, and then notices there's something wrong with Fung's face. It doesn't look natural. He and Ding Lik pull off "Mr. Fung's" mask to discover that it isn't Fung Ging Yiu at all: it's AH BING from Episodes 1-2!

    Ah Bing, who isn't dead, then says, "And I would've succeeded if not for you meddling kids and that mangy dog!"

    Ding Lik turns to Hui Mun Keung and asks, "Mun-gor, what dog is this guy talking about?"

    Mun Keung replies, "Remember that doggy that belonged to your girlfriend...Lo Gum's mistress?"

    Ding Lik: "You're kidding! That thing was turned to stew!"

    Mun Keung: "Nah, that was just a trick. They were saving it up for later!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post
    Yeah actually it was a "duel" in every sense of the word. I mean the producers couldn't show them actualy "fighting" each other physically because HMK would easily crush him. So the next best thing to do for a "versus" match is the bullet game which is much more chilling than any "fight" scene could be!

    I first saw this type of bullet game or whatever it's called in the movie Deer Hunter, which won the oscars for best picture. Then it was showed in season 3 of 24 the tv show. I'm glad I got to see it again in The Bund. It's a cruel cruel world.
    There's a name of this kind of game. It's called "Russian Roulette." The mechanics are similar to a roulette table, but the stakes are the players' lives.

  13. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    It's a great scene. Hui Mun Keung was refusing to sell out and work for Fung Ging Yiu, but Ah Lik, who didn't want to see his dream of making it in Shanghai go up in smoke, was ready to join Fung's organization. That's when Hui told Ding that perhaps they should go their separate ways.

    Ah Lik was torn. He wanted to continue to be in the game in Shanghai, but he didn't want to do it without Mun-gor (especially since he knew it was his rashness in killing Lo Gum that blew it for Mun-gor and himself). Ah Lik was very conscious that he would never have gotten as far as he had without Mun-gor's help, and he remembered that it was Mun-gor who saved his life when he in danger of bleeding to death.
    Oh i remember that part now. The main thing i remembered though was the danger that HMK and DL were in after DL killed Lo Gum. All the tongs were after them and it was the first time in the series where i really felt the cold underbelly of Shanghai.

    He didn't call him "Hui Mun Keung" or "Mr. Hui." He called him "Mun Keung," like back in the days when Hui worked for him and Fung was fond enough of him to want him to be his son-in-law. It was almost as if Fung Ging Yiu, in the moment before his death, regretted all that he had done to Mun Keung and not only wanted Mun Keung to spare his life, but to go back to being his loyal follower like in the "good old days." But it was far, far too late. That bullet indeed had Mr. Fung's name on it.

    The utter terror on Fung Ging Yiu's face when he knew he was doomed was priceless. Lau Dan is the most underrated performer in THE BUND.
    Yeah i have to agree that LD did a good job showing the embarassing aspect of his character near the end when everything was crumbling around him. You kind of feel sympathy for the character because FGY wasn't pure evil (he was a shades of grey type of character with a human side).

    Symbolism:

    What was Hui Mun Keung wearing when he killed Fung Ging Yiu? Not his gangster suit. He was once again dressed like he was in Hong Kong...when his wife and the rest of his adopted family were murdered by Fung Ging Yiu's assassin. It was almost as if Mun Keung were saying through his clothes, "This is for my family, you bastard."
    Wow i can't believe you caught this one, i didn't even notice it! Great catch again. That's a nice touch making HMK wear what he wore when his adopted family was murdered. I really appreciate the effort they made in every small detail. Classic, classic series.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post

    What was Hui Mun Keung wearing when he killed Fung Ging Yiu? Not his gangster suit. He was once again dressed like he was in Hong Kong...when his wife and the rest of his adopted family were murdered by Fung Ging Yiu's assassin. It was almost as if Mun Keung were saying through his clothes, "This is for my family, you bastard."
    If I remember correctly, that blue dress was made for him by his wife in Hong Kong, wasn't it? So yeah, it was heavy symbolism that this was for avenging his wife, and wearing that dress was his way of hoping for her blessing to fulfill the avenging act. This is also reflected in the next scene with the coin. He kind of believes his wife's soul is there with him, and she would never let him die by the first shot. But what's so good about the scene, is that though he believes in the blessing, he is still scared shit as trigger fires on..hehe..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post

    Yeah i have to agree that LD did a good job showing the embarassing aspect of his character near the end when everything was crumbling around him. You kind of feel sympathy for the character because FGY wasn't pure evil (he was a shades of grey type of character with a human side).
    Fung Ging Yiu had a number of human moments that really showed that he wasn't just a diabolical character. There was a good, loving side to him as well, especially regarding his daughter, Ching Ching.

    My favorite human scenes of Fung Ging Yiu:

    1. When she and Mun Keung had an argument over something in one of the earlier episodes, and she took out her frustrations on her dad. Fung Ging Yiu didn't get angry with her, saying only with a loving smile, "I'm your father. If you can't come to me with your frustrations, then who can you go to?" He really was a very loving, doting parent.

    2. The worry that Fung Ging Yiu felt when Ching Ching was jailed for leading a protest against the city government. By this time, Fung Ging Yiu's power had diminished so much that he couldn't help his daughter, and he felt completely helpless. His anguish at being unable to help the one person he loved most was palpable, as was his joy when she was finally freed (thanks to Hui Mun Keung's influence with the city authorities).

    3. Towards the end, when "Uncle Cheung" (Fung's right hand man) tried to persuade Fung to retire from his business and leave Shanghai. Uncle Cheung said to Fung Ging Yiu, "Mr. Fung, you're getting on in years. You're tired and you need to rest. I've served you faithfully my entire life. Now, I only hope you'll take me with you to retirement, so that I can enjoy some peaceful final years myself." I expected Fung Ging Yiu to lash out angrily at his subordinate for essentially suggesting him to give up and surrender the city to Lip Yan Wong and Hui Mun Keung, but instead, Fung put a gentle hand on Uncle Cheung's shoulder as if to say, "Thank you, old friend, for all your loyalty...and for supporting me to the end. You deserve to live the rest of your life in peace for your loyalty to me all these years. I am grateful for all you've done for me."

    It was hard to see Fung Ging Yiu as a complete monster. He was a bastard at times, but he was also capable of great humanity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NetDragon View Post
    If I remember correctly, that blue dress was made for him by his wife in Hong Kong, wasn't it? So yeah, it was heavy symbolism that this was for avenging his wife, and wearing that dress was his way of hoping for her blessing to fulfill the avenging act. This is also reflected in the next scene with the coin. He kind of believes his wife's soul is there with him, and she would never let him die by the first shot. But what's so good about the scene, is that though he believes in the blessing, he is still scared shit as trigger fires on..hehe..
    Actually, Hui Mun Keung was unbelievably calm throughout the entire Russian Roulette game. Fung Ging Yiu looked terrified, but Hui Mun Keung's demeanor was more, "Screw it. Whatever happens, happens. I don't care anymore."

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    Quote Originally Posted by NetDragon View Post
    And how cool it is when DL spins the coin, and HMK slams it down..and that echo fills the room...you just gotta love it! And the coolest thing is that the coin slamming backfires on HMK, and he's still into the game..accepting to fire the first shot...how cool is that
    That's what's called "taking fate into your own hands," LITERALLY.

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    It was hard to see Fung Ging Yiu as a complete monster. He was a bastard at times, but he was also capable of great humanity.
    I'll say it once again, The Bund is awesome. It's so intelligent on many levels.

    It's almost embarassing to watch drama series like Gem of Life. Oh well, wuxia still holds up because their unique.
    Last edited by Ghaleon; 03-02-09 at 08:52 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganryu View Post
    It's almost embarassing to watch drama series like Gem of Life.
    Your expectations have been permanently set higher for TVB now that you've watched THE BUND. Believe me, that's a *good* thing. Don't settle for crap anymore.


    Oh well, wuxia still holds up because their unique.
    Well, with wuxia, TVB can always say, "It's not our fault! That's how Jin Yong/Gu Long wrote it!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    Your expectations have been permanently set higher for TVB now that you've watched THE BUND. Believe me, that's a *good* thing. Don't settle for crap anymore.
    Yeah I think i'm probably be more critical of series now. It's a good thing for my wallet because I won't randomly buy average serials anymore (like Gem of Life). I'm settling for classics now My standards have definitely risen higher.

    Well, with wuxia, TVB can always say, "It's not our fault! That's how Jin Yong/Gu Long wrote it!"
    Wuxia is just plain fun. I never tire of the ultra repetitive cliches. I still get lot of excitement watching the heroes become powerful (finding some super secret manual in the cave) and then showing off their awesome skills mesmerizing the entire wulin world. I love that stuff still

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