Ou Yang Ke really loved Huang Rong : True or False?

[steffy]

Ou Yang Ke. One of the baddie of LOCH. However, I have always gotten the feeling that for all his faults, Ou Yang Ke genuinely loved Huang Rong. For example:

1) He rather let the boat drift away so that he would have a chance to spent the rest of his life with Huang Rong on a deserted Island.

2) He lied to his uncle that it has nothing to do with Huang Rong when his uncle asked if Huang Rong had a hand in making the rock fall on him.

3) Huang Rong asked if he knew she is the one who caused the rock to fall on him. He replied yes but that he would not mind dying under her hands. He further asked her not to let his uncle hear as his uncle would hurt her if he knew.

In fact, I have always thought that if given the chance, Ou Yang Ke may have turned "good" for Huang Rong and would have given up all his harems as well.

I love LOCH and loved Guo Jing and Huang Rong together but sometimes do think of what would happen if Guo Jing and Ou Yang Fung never found the island, would Huang Rong have eventually fall for Ou Yang ke instead? He seemed to genuinely
care for her.

What do you think?

[Suet Seung]

Well if you explain it that way, sure I'd think he would be good for her.

All except, how he tried to make a move on her when they were on the island.

Huang Rong did find him creepy, perverted, and hah...even more simple minded than Guo Jing at times?

I wonder which actor from the many adaptations, portrayed him best?

Also I'd like to add, Would he remain faithful to HR if they weren't on the island anymore? I mean if they actually got married, would he remain faithful to her? Seems when they got back to land, he did not get HR so he went on pursuing other women.

[rabadi]

Yup. He tried to take advantage of Mu Nian Ci, and so YK killed him.

[steffy]

Based on the book, he actually treated HR with respect on the island altough he did make it clear that he wanted to spend the rest of his life with her and to have children with her. (TVB adaptation aside)

A few times he was actually with HR alone without Hung Chit Kung and he did not try to rape her or anything. In fact both times HR is the one who tricked and hurt him.

In addition, after they left the island, he did not go back to "other women". In fact, he was actually using MNC and CYJ (Chen Yao Jia) to get HR and GJ out from the secret room in Cow Village. However, I don't doubt that if Yang Kang did not arrive on time, he would have molested both girls. I am not saying he is not horny, I am just saying that that he feels more than just lust for HR.

In the book, I remember one place which HR thought to herself "Actually, this man is very good to me".

I agreed that all along HR did not have any feelings for anybody except for Guo Jing but I find it cute that some one so "feng liu" as OYK could genuinely love another.

[Ken Cheng]

When Jin Yong is at the top of his game in characterization, his villains emerge as more than plot devices to provide conflict for the heroes. Often, the best Jin Yong villains have a sympathetic side . . . not sympathetic enough to justify or excuse the evil things that they do, but enough to understand that the villains too are human beings capable of sorrow and pain (rather than just unfeeling monsters). This humanizing principle is seen in this case with Au Yeung Hak, as it is seen elsewhere with his uncle, West Poison Au Yeung Fung (most notably in ROCH).

[andrea7974]

Yep. I think that Ouyang Ke loved HR.
Somehow a pervert man is always be a pervert man :wink:

[charbydis]

What ever you do, don't go by LOCH 82 on this character.

I actually agree with most of you, if HR did accept him (poor GJ ), he might actually turn good (oh well, at least better). And I do like him better than most fo the other JY villians.

But I sometimes wonder does he like HR because he really likes her, or because she is hard to get (and he thinks he is better than GJ)

However, you can't expect him to change overnight. Lust is a main part of his life, and I don't think he would have immediately changed his behaviour towards other beautiful women (e.g MNC) , especially when HR didn't accept him.

[steffy]

When Jin Yong is at the top of his game in characterization, his villains emerge as more than plot devices to provide conflict for the heroes. Often, the best Jin Yong villains have a sympathetic side . . .

I agreed to with Ken said. A lot of Jin Yong's "villains" have a human side. For example, Wan Yen Hong Lie may seemed to be villain in LOCH but how many of us would really blamed him for the things he do. If seen from another point of view, this guy is a hero.

1) He did everything for his country. He is a hero to his people.

2) He is very faithful, he loved only one woman in his life
(although the method he got her is pretty drastic, but you have got to know, this man is a prince, he is used to getting what he want. For him, Yang Tie Xin is only an ignorant pheasant who stand between him and his true love, he has no idea that his action will come back and bit him on his tushy 18 years later.)

3) He dotes on his "son" whom he has brought up for the past 18 years (I would understand why he refuse to give him up, I wouldn't)

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As for Ou Yang Ke, his "feng liuness" aside, I actually like him. (the book version, not TVB). His relationship with HR is a typical boy meet girl story except for him, GJ stood in the way to a "Happily Ever After". He fell for HR the first time he laid eyes on her in the Jin Palace, he didn't know about GJ then, so the theory that he only like HR because he feel he is better than GJ doesn't really take.

The book describe his feelings for HR when he first laid eyes on her as "shen wen dian tou" (loosely translated : drunk on feelings)

He could have used the small boat to get back on mainland and go back to "Bai Toh San" as Chief. He didn't want to do that, he wanted to remain on the island with HR as he feels that this is most probably the only chance he had with her, on a deserted island without Guo Jing.

Maybe it's just me but the thought of "taming" a playboy does appeal.

[flyingfox2002]

He treated her with respect only because he wants her to spread willingly. The reason he didn't rape her right away was 1-he still was paranoid H7G might still have kungfu; 2-he does have feelings for HR, and he's also in awe of her because he has feelings for her; and 3-he's so proud of his ability to get laid that he feels HR will eventually let him have her. If HR didn't cripple him, he would have raped her eventually.

Originally posted by steffy
Based on the book, he actually treated HR with respect on the island altough he did make it clear that he wanted to spend the rest of his life with her and to have children with her. (TVB adaptation aside)

A few times he was actually with HR alone without Hung Chit Kung and he did not try to rape her or anything. In fact both times HR is the one who tricked and hurt him.

In addition, after they left the island, he did not go back to "other women". In fact, he was actually using MNC and CYJ (Chen Yao Jia) to get HR and GJ out from the secret room in Cow Village. However, I don't doubt that if Yang Kang did not arrive on time, he would have molested both girls. I am not saying he is not horny, I am just saying that that he feels more than just lust for HR.

In the book, I remember one place which HR thought to herself "Actually, this man is very good to me".

I agreed that all along HR did not have any feelings for anybody except for Guo Jing but I find it cute that some one so "feng liu" as OYK could genuinely love another.

[Candide]

That was his dark side calling him, Mr Fox People like him are proud of doing evil things. In their minds, it might be a good thing even. I don't think that OYK was just in it for sex or the thrill of conquering a tough prey... Otherwise, after knowing that HR crippled him, he would take revenge right away. Imagine that you just got both legs smashed by a falling boulder (and you used to be a famous playboy) and you know that the one who did it is standing right next to you, and that the one who could help you to take revenge is also right there... How many of you would try to kill the culprit ?

[legend]

well, he did said he will forgo all his girls and promise not to look for other girls if HR agree to follow him......

[Siven]

I'm just struck by all the colorful phrases available in Chinese to describe someone lecherous as Ou-Yang Ke, like se lang, se gui, and my favorite, yin zei. Surely he's not above some petty lies to get a girl he wants to bed. C'mon this is a dude who has a small harem. Kinda hard to tell love from lust with someone like that.

[charbydis]

Adding onto my previous post:

Judging by his willingness to lie for HR in front of his uncle, I think he does love HR to some extent, though not enough. If this was a real person and someone asked my opinion, I would actually still suspect him lying to get her moved and into his arms, but since it is a novel, and JY didn't write anything about hidden thoughts about OYK lie, I think OYK does love HR truely.

And when he was trying to molest CYJ and MNC at the temple, he intended on distracting GJ and HR healing in the hidden room so they will die or something, but he got carried away and started getting serious, which proves that he will have other women besides HR, whether she is there or not.

OYK may not have changed even if HR married him and loved him since he was brought up in a society where monogamy was rare, and collecting girls into a harem (whether by force or money) was a common practice by powerful men.

He would treat her good enough and become better, but letting go of his ways that he is used to and proud of for thirty something years of his life, is something that I think can't be done by him. (It's like telling me I can't watch TVB anymore)

Besides love for HR, his feelings for her also comprise of hurt ego, hate, revenge, lust; he sees her as a goal to reach, rather than a soul-mate. But if one day, he stops loving HR, he's going to treat her like crap, and OYF ( ) is not going to help either.

Yes, he does love HR, but he is also cheap, perverted, messed-up-in-the-head, and should attend Sex-Addict Anonymous Sessions.

[Laviathan]

OYF ( )

Charbydis, I know you didn't like the sex scenes in Xun Qin Ji, and reading your post I also understand you think that Ouyang Ke is a pervert (I agree that he is very messed-up).

But on the other hand, you like Ouyang Feng very much. Now, you do realise that he had an affair with his brother's wife and spawned a bastard, right? Furthermore, he also cut off the head of an innocent school teacher just for fun.

Of course, you have every right to like or dislike whatever you want, but I think it is a bit strange that you are so harsh on the novel Xun Qin Ji or the character Ouyang Ke, while so forgiving and mild towards Ouyang Feng.

Just my rant...

[Candide]

Women...what do you expect, Lav? They don't have the logic circuit installed like us.

[Zhuge Liang]

His feelings are more than lust but his methods shows he loves himself more than he loves her. Despite her protests to the contrary he does not give up and tries to win her hand in marriage by force at Peach Blossom Island. If you truly love someone you want them to be happy even if it is not with you.

To think that he could love someone at all was a surprise for me however. In the end i think he will not be faithful to HR - i don't think he loves her "that" much.

Ultimately i think it is irrelevant to HR's romantic feelings towards him.

[charbydis]

Charbydis, I know you didn't like the sex scenes in Xun Qin Ji, and reading your post I also understand you think that Ouyang Ke is a pervert (I agree that he is very messed-up).

But on the other hand, you like Ouyang Feng very much. Now, you do realise that he had an affair with his brother's wife and spawned a bastard, right? Furthermore, he also cut off the head of an innocent school teacher just for fun.

Of course, you have every right to like or dislike whatever you want, but I think it is a bit strange that you are so harsh on the novel Xun Qin Ji or the character Ouyang Ke, while so forgiving and mild towards Ouyang Feng.

Just my rant...

I can't help it. I just feel that way about them. About OYK, I don't like him as a character by himself, but when compared with other villians/perverts in JY's universe, I like him much better. It is the little true feeling he has for HR that makes me hate him less, but it doesn't convince me that he can change into a totally monogamous person for her from his upbringing.

Besides, I don't agree 100% with what OYF does, even though I like this character the best out of JY's characters. I do know about his bad side and acknowledge them, but he a combination of qualities that I consider very unique and special, like determination, ambition, etc...., which I like.

[Laviathan]

I see, of course I respect your views. I do not like Ouyang Ke as a person or as a novel character. I think he lacks depth. Actually, I have this problem with lots of Jin Yong's villains. It seems that he is not very good at writing villains. His bad guys are all quite bland, IMO, they do not give me any strong feelings. Ouyang Ke, I wouldn't even bother to hate him really... I mean, he is handsome and rich, so why does he need to force women to have sex with him? Rapists mostly have this urge for power, but I do not sense this in Ouyang Ke. He's just a very pathetic loser who has nothing better to do, at least that's the impression he gives me.

I agree that Ouyang Feng has very unique qualities, but again, he does not do me much. I really lost interest in him as a character when he showed the head of this school teacher he murdered. I mean, I know you are a bad guy and is supposed to do evil Western Venom stuff... But don't you have anything better to do? Cutting the heads off of school teachers really strikes me as very stupid and ignorant, and in a way, even immature.

I like my villains to be really wicked and cool, characters you would love to hate. I somehow don't seem to find many in Jin Yong's novels.

Just my feelings...

[Tazzy1972]

my most memoorable villian would be Cheng Kun from Yi Tian

[Alinda]

it seemed to me that OYK was a very messed up character. so HR would probably never like him in the first place so it was pretty sad for him because he was used to what he gets on this point and it doesn't look like he got it