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Thread: why guo jing never thought of being emperor or warlord

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    Default why guo jing never thought of being emperor or warlord

    late song emperors are weak and care little for their country yet guo jing risked his life protecting xiangyang , why not he use his influence over wulin and people to revolt and be the king , make the country stronger to fight against the mongol
    or use his past relationship with the mongols saying ' guo jing wish to be king of central plain and will pay tributes to mongol" while at the time gather resources to fight the mongols

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    Because, for all his vaunted greatness, he was a follower, not a leader. That, and, he didn't have what it takes to be a Emperor, he was too nice.

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    haiz too bad , with huang rong with his side also no use , if guo jing has brains of huang rong , anything is possible

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    It's a gamble that might not have paid off. Although the Southern Sung Dynasty was corrupt to the core, at least it was more-or-less unified. Starting a civil war when foreign invasion is imminent isn't a good plan.

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    You guys are forgetting that Wong Yung never encouraged Gwok Jing to seize power and fight the Mongols as a Chinese emperor either. If it were feasible, Wong Yung would have recommended it. That she never even considered it means it was never a workable plan to begin with.

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    hard to say , while posponing the mongol attack using guo jing relationship, and conduct a civil war. this senario is just like the manchu attack ming china and li zhi cheng rebels

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    since its a gamble , might as well take it, defending the city alone just means waiting to die , and the song dynasty don even want to help themselves

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    GJ would never usurp a throne. That would be the ultimate form of treachery and he would never be able to live with himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flyingfox2002
    GJ would never usurp a throne. That would be the ultimate form of treachery and he would never be able to live with himself.
    Then the question is: If there was a vacuum, would he step up to fill it?

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    Q: If there was a vacuum, would he step up to fill it?

    My answer is:

    If he has a choice, he won't. GJ and HR values a peaceful life (for example, at PB island) more than being a king & queen in a palace (which has a lot of responsibility). Only way that GJ might accept to be a king is when there is no other choices and with a huge amount of support (not just by a minority group of people). This is very unlikely to happen and he will not be happy being a king .

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    Senior Member rabadi's Avatar
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    Nope, GJ would never want to be an emperor or a warlord. He was after all already a general under Genghis Khan. I would say he already had great enough power in his hands, yet he let it go.

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    Speaking about defending Xiang Yang why is it with the NF war manual, GJ, the GB and HR intelligence its still failed to defend Xiang Yang while with the same war manual the Ming sect use it victoriously to get rid of the Yuan dynasty from the central plain?

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    maybe yue fei is a dumb ***

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    Quote Originally Posted by atlantean0208
    Speaking about defending Xiang Yang why is it with the NF war manual, GJ, the GB and HR intelligence its still failed to defend Xiang Yang while with the same war manual the Ming sect use it victoriously to get rid of the Yuan dynasty from the central plain?
    Because no matter how brilliant Ngok Fei's War Tactics Manual was, and no matter how clever Wong Yung was, and no matter how valiant and powerful Gwok Jing was, none of that adds up to squat if they don't have a loyal, well-trained, committed army at their disposal. By the time the Mongols invaded the Sung territories, the Sung army was a demoralized, corrupt, badly trained mob...not an effective fighting force. Under these difficult circumstances, Gwok Jing and Wong Yung did their best and managed to hold the line for over forty years (quite an accomplishment), but ultimately, the deck was stacked against them. The Mongols were well-trained, determined, and devoted to their cause; the Chinese Sung troops were not.

    By the time of the late Yuan Dynasty, things were different: the Chinese were sick and tired of being oppressed by the Mongols, and were willing to do what it took to regain control of their country. When you have people willing to sacrifice for their cause, then such advantages as superior tactics are actually useful.

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    so people are more important than tactics

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    Quote Originally Posted by hentaixp
    so people are more important than tactics
    Yes, because one must depend on people to carry out those tactics. A tactics manual gathering dust on a forgotten bookshelf won't win any war.

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    actualli tactics are just wits , anyone with wits can win the war , mongolians no manual also can win war

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    Quote Originally Posted by hentaixp
    actualli tactics are just wits , anyone with wits can win the war , mongolians no manual also can win war
    The Mongols had ambition and belief in themselves. They truly believed that they were destined to rule the world, and were willing to go to any length to fulfill Genghis Khan's dream. Additionally, they were blessed with great leaders. Genghis Khan was an excellent tactician, as were his best generals (i.e. Jebeh). His four sons were no slouches as tacticians either, and his grandson Kublai was Genghis' own equal. The Mongols were frequently outmanned, out-equipped, and outpositioned during their wars, but they always came out on top because they fought intelligently and inspiredly.

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    i think gj, like zwj, are very simple person. if gj has a choice, he will possibly prefer to continue his sheep rearing in mongolia. as for zwj, i am stuck. possibly stay in wudang and mediate?

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    Quote Originally Posted by wkeej
    i think gj, like zwj, are very simple person. if gj has a choice, he will possibly prefer to continue his sheep rearing in mongolia. as for zwj, i am stuck. possibly stay in wudang and mediate?
    The pastoral theme is more or less universal in epic fiction. The great heroes of Western tradition . . . Achilles, Odysseus, Beowulf, Robin Hood, etc., were farmers when they weren't warriors. Even a modern epic hero like Superman comes from a farming society (Smallville). It was each hero's ideal to defeat all his enemies and achieve peace so that he could end his days living that simple, pastoral lifestyle. That was indeed Gwok Jing's dream, and I think it was the dream of most of Jin Yong's heroes (Kiu Fung, Yeung Gor, Cheung Mo Gei, Ling Wu Chung, etc.). Ironically, perhaps only Yeung Gor and Cheung Mo Gei actually achieved this dream, but they leave themselves open for some criticism because they chose to pursue the pastoral dream before all their enemies had been vanquished. Only by completely conquering the enemy could an epic hero truly enjoy the pastoral lifestyle with a free and clear conscience.

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