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Thread: Jinyong Character Level Ranking Chart

  1. #1921
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    C'mon dude I know you're YG die-hard fans but please don't "blame" our hero by using "unreasonable logic"..

  2. #1922
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    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    C'mon dude I know you're YG die-hard fans but please don't "blame" our hero by using "unreasonable logic"..
    ==> I thought your comparison of DY vs YG and Lewis vs Tyson is an analogy.
    DY is Lewis and YG is Tyson.

    ==> I don't see any resemblance of YG to Tyson, except for power.
    ==> Mike Tyson is a great, powerful boxer, but against someone like Evander Holyfield, who have both powerful offensive and great defensive skills, defeated Tyson handily.
    Therefore, YG is like Holyfied, not Tyson since he does not have great defensive skills.

  3. #1923
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    Quote Originally Posted by FeilongZ View Post
    ==> I thought your comparison of DY vs YG and Lewis vs Tyson is an analogy.
    DY is Lewis and YG is Tyson.

    ==> I don't see any resemblance of YG to Tyson, except for power.
    ==> Mike Tyson is a great, powerful boxer, but against someone like Evander Holyfield, who have both powerful offensive and great defensive skills, defeated Tyson handily.
    Therefore, YG is like Holyfied, not Tyson since he does not have great defensive skills.
    What I mean is not only about their "style" but also their "tactic" which mean someone like Lewis which very great in "jabbing" (long-range type attack) would be easily "dominate" Tyson-type fighter which great in close-range/hand to hand combat I also never said Tyson (or YG) couldn't launch LDA (jabbing) but since LDA isn't YG "specially" he would generated more power and effort to did it which mean he would loose stamina and endurance more faster than DY that's why as long DY could "keep distance" with YG he would win..

  4. #1924
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    Just like XF no matter how great him when he reach his "limit" (in terms of stamina) he would be in "danger" against YTZ "limitless" strength and endurance..

  5. #1925
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    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    Just like XF no matter how great him when he reach his "limit" (in terms of stamina) he would be in "danger" against YTZ "limitless" strength and endurance..
    YG after six-year tidal training against the violent waves of the South Seas 🌊 would most likely dramatically improve his endurance/stamina.
    -Remember YG not just trained against a force that was only coming from one direction like the pre-16 waterfall training, he was training against powerful ocean waves that were omnidirectional for long periods of time.
    As a result, YG's endurance/stamina and offensive skills are superb.

  6. #1926
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    Well I think you still didn't get my point I never said YG stamina is "poor" what I mean is since his base strength below DY he would did more effort to "keep up" with DY..

    DY power 150 (base) stamina 100

    DY power + LMSJ 200 stamina 100

    YG power 100 (base) stamina 100

    YG power with HIS 150 stamina 100

    In the beginning YG (with HIS) would be able to match DY raw power but since YG true strength below DY he would not be able to "keep up" with DY all the time

  7. #1927
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    I'm new in this forum, can anyone explain to me, so I can have better understanding about FZ level in this Jinyong Ranking:

    [A] Facts I - Hui Ke History; Yi Jin Jing in Sanskrit created by Boddhidarma (it's one scripture but) can be interpreted as :
    (1) Zen Buddhism Theories (Great Master Bancimidi)
    (2) Martial Arts Theories (Li Jing)
    [Source Canon : SPW - Chapter 18] : Time : Ming Dynasty
    - FZ knew these things and It's claimed that FZ fully mastered YJJ

    Question :
    (1) Did FZ really master both YJJ Theories (MA and Zen Buddhism) ?
    (2) Is YJJ Zen Buddhism Theories important for fully mastering YJJ MA Theories ?

    [B] Facts II - DGSD :
    (1) Many Shaolin Eminent Monks practiced Yi Jin Jing
    (2) After many years practice Yi Jin Jing yielded negligible results
    (3) To fully master YJJ is really difficult -> someone need to reach (心无所住)
    [Source Canon : DGSD - Chapter 29] Time : Song Dynasty ( 12th Century)
    - Note : AFAIK (心无所住). it's Buddhism terminology. In Sanskrit it's called Apratisthita (The highest form of Buddha-hood in Mahayana Buddhism - Shaolin is a branch of this Mahayana Buddhism), CMIIW

    Question :
    (1) Did Shaolin Monks (in DGSD) know that YJJ has both MA Theories and Zen Buddhism Theories just like FZ (SPW) ?
    (2) If Shaolin Monks in DGSD also knew about YJJ Zen Buddhism and MA Theories (both interpretations), then why many Shaolin Monks in DGSD after many years of practice yielded negligible result but FZ is claimed to have mastered YJJ ?
    (3) Do you think "negligible result" (perhaps) has other meaning such as "nothing extraordinary" ?

    For me, It doesn't make sense:
    (a) FZ knew JYY has MA Theories and Zen Theories but Shaolin Monks in DGSD didn't knew anything about it considering the fact that Hui Ke lived about 5-6 hundred years before DGSD, and at least 9-10 hundred years before SPW.
    (b) After many years of practicing YJJ but yielded "negligible result" (Assuming Shaolin Monks (DGSD) also knew both MA Theories and Zen Buddhism Theories of YJJ)

    [C] Facts III (About MA in SPW)
    (1) FZ is claimed to have mastered YJJ
    (2) DFBB is also claimed to have mastered KHBD
    (3) But : DFBB >>> FZ

    Question :
    (1) If FZ really has fully mastered YJJ, but FZ still much weaker than DFBB, Does It mean that YJJ is far inferior than KHBD ?
    (2) Did any fighters in SPW (Ming Dynasty) still know and practice any Top Tier internal Skills like 9YingSG, 9YangSG, Xian Thian Gong, Xiao Wuxiang Gong, Shenzu Jing etc ?

    [4] Fact IV (About Internal Skills and MA in general)
    (1) GJ practiced 9YingSG -> Number 1 in Wulin (ROCH)
    (2) JY. ZWJ practiced 9YangSG -> Best Yang Internal Skills in Wulin (HSDS)
    Even
    (3) DFBB practiced KGBD -> Number 1 in Wulin (SPW)
    But
    (4) FZ practice YJJ -> ?? perhaps it's what "negligible result" really means??

    Question :
    (1) Do you think YJJ on the same level with 9Ying and 9Yang ?
    (2) If YJJ ~= 9Ying ~= 9Yang, Do you think KHBD >>> YJJ, 9Ying and 9Yang ?

    My main question is
    (-) After considering all the facts, Do you still think FZ has fully mastered YJJ ?

    IMHO after considering all the facts, I think FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ at least in YJJ Zen Buddhism Theories part - [心无所住 or Apratisthita part] - this part is really difficult just like canon said. I always think FZ (SPW) is on the same level as Xuan Chi (DGSD) - it's already really high level, FZ can be considered as "4 Greats Level on 1st Mt. Hua Meeting"

  8. #1928
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gayatri View Post
    I'm new in this forum, can anyone explain to me, so I can have better understanding about FZ level in this Jinyong Ranking:

    [A] Facts I - Hui Ke History; Yi Jin Jing in Sanskrit created by Boddhidarma (it's one scripture but) can be interpreted as :
    (1) Zen Buddhism Theories (Great Master Bancimidi)
    (2) Martial Arts Theories (Li Jing)
    [Source Canon : SPW - Chapter 18] : Time : Ming Dynasty
    - FZ knew these things and It's claimed that FZ fully mastered YJJ

    Question :
    (1) Did FZ really master both YJJ Theories (MA and Zen Buddhism) ?
    (2) Is YJJ Zen Buddhism Theories important for fully mastering YJJ MA Theories ?

    [B] Facts II - DGSD :
    (1) Many Shaolin Eminent Monks practiced Yi Jin Jing
    (2) After many years practice Yi Jin Jing yielded negligible results
    (3) To fully master YJJ is really difficult -> someone need to reach (心无所住)
    [Source Canon : DGSD - Chapter 29] Time : Song Dynasty ( 12th Century)
    - Note : AFAIK (心无所住). it's Buddhism terminology. In Sanskrit it's called Apratisthita (The highest form of Buddha-hood in Mahayana Buddhism - Shaolin is a branch of this Mahayana Buddhism), CMIIW

    Question :
    (1) Did Shaolin Monks (in DGSD) know that YJJ has both MA Theories and Zen Buddhism Theories just like FZ (SPW) ?
    (2) If Shaolin Monks in DGSD also knew about YJJ Zen Buddhism and MA Theories (both interpretations), then why many Shaolin Monks in DGSD after many years of practice yielded negligible result but FZ is claimed to have mastered YJJ ?
    (3) Do you think "negligible result" (perhaps) has other meaning such as "nothing extraordinary" ?

    For me, It doesn't make sense:
    (a) FZ knew JYY has MA Theories and Zen Theories but Shaolin Monks in DGSD didn't knew anything about it considering the fact that Hui Ke lived about 5-6 hundred years before DGSD, and at least 9-10 hundred years before SPW.
    (b) After many years of practicing YJJ but yielded "negligible result" (Assuming Shaolin Monks (DGSD) also knew both MA Theories and Zen Buddhism Theories of YJJ)

    [C] Facts III (About MA in SPW)
    (1) FZ is claimed to have mastered YJJ
    (2) DFBB is also claimed to have mastered KHBD
    (3) But : DFBB >>> FZ

    Question :
    (1) If FZ really has fully mastered YJJ, but FZ still much weaker than DFBB, Does It mean that YJJ is far inferior than KHBD ?
    (2) Did any fighters in SPW (Ming Dynasty) still know and practice any Top Tier internal Skills like 9YingSG, 9YangSG, Xian Thian Gong, Xiao Wuxiang Gong, Shenzu Jing etc ?

    [4] Fact IV (About Internal Skills and MA in general)
    (1) GJ practiced 9YingSG -> Number 1 in Wulin (ROCH)
    (2) JY. ZWJ practiced 9YangSG -> Best Yang Internal Skills in Wulin (HSDS)
    Even
    (3) DFBB practiced KGBD -> Number 1 in Wulin (SPW)
    But
    (4) FZ practice YJJ -> ?? perhaps it's what "negligible result" really means??

    Question :
    (1) Do you think YJJ on the same level with 9Ying and 9Yang ?
    (2) If YJJ ~= 9Ying ~= 9Yang, Do you think KHBD >>> YJJ, 9Ying and 9Yang ?

    My main question is
    (-) After considering all the facts, Do you still think FZ has fully mastered YJJ ?

    IMHO after considering all the facts, I think FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ at least in YJJ Zen Buddhism Theories part - [心无所住 or Apratisthita part] - this part is really difficult just like canon said. I always think FZ (SPW) is on the same level as Xuan Chi (DGSD) - it's already really high level, FZ can be considered as "4 Greats Level on 1st Mt. Hua Meeting"
    Well for Fangzheng I think it's pure his "limited" talent just like Yelu Qi he have mastered 18 Dragon Palm (direct tutelage under GJ) and Quanzhen neigong (under Zhou Botong) yet he never reach great level status or even sub-great level status so to learn martial arts apart of "suitably" (with his/her character) we also need "talent"..

  9. #1929
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    Let's just talk about Internal Skills. Yelu Qi practiced Quanzhen neigong but he never reached Great level like Zhou Butong, so we can say that Yehlu Qi hasn't fully mastered Quanzhen neigong right - he didn't got "talent" to fully master Quanzhen neigong like Zhou Butong did. Same as FZ, YJJ according canon it's really difficult to master. Many Shaolin monks in DGSD practiced YJJ but they got nothing extraordinary result. So we can also say that FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ. So I wouldn't put FZ in LOCH Great (LV70+) but in 1st Mt. Hua 4 Greats Level (LV 65).

  10. #1930
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gayatri View Post
    Let's just talk about Internal Skills. Yelu Qi practiced Quanzhen neigong but he never reached Great level like Zhou Butong, so we can say that Yehlu Qi hasn't fully mastered Quanzhen neigong right - he didn't got "talent" to fully master Quanzhen neigong like Zhou Butong did. Same as FZ, YJJ according canon it's really difficult to master. Many Shaolin monks in DGSD practiced YJJ but they got nothing extraordinary result. So we can also say that FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ. So I wouldn't put FZ in LOCH Great (LV70+) but in 1st Mt. Hua 4 Greats Level (LV 65).
    Well if we put FZ around pre-LOCH/1st Huashan Greats it would make YG/GJ would be easily kick DFBB *** which I highly doubtful..

  11. #1931
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    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    Well if we put FZ around pre-LOCH/1st Huashan Greats it would make YG/GJ would be easily kick DFBB *** which I highly doubtful..
    In SPW, thereís no others Top Tier MAs nor Top Tier negongs we can connect to others JY novels except YJJ. We know that FZ practiced YJJ. And It's assumed that YJJ if fully master at least it's on par with others Top Tier neigong such as 9Ying (LOCH/ROCH), 9Yang (ROCH/HSDS), Xian Tiang Gong (Pre LOCH/LOCH), Xiao Wuxiang Gong (DGSD) etc. So, we can use YJJ as the basis of comparation

    To determine DFBB level, it depends on the level of other SPW characters such as RWX, FZ, LHC etc. - we know DFBB >>> FZ > RWC > LHC.

    If itís assumed that FZ has fully mastered YJJ and we put FZ in LV 72 (in this JInyong Ranking) - the same level as Wang Chong Yang at the time his death (after 1st Mt Hua) - it also implicitly means YJJ on par with WCY's Xiang Thian Gong - then perhaps you're right, it's hard to imagine that YG/GJ (LV80) would beat DFBB (LV83).

    But this scenario makes so many anomalies, it makes top tier neigongs such as (YJJ, 9Ying, 9Yang, Xiang Thian Gong etc.) look inferior than KHBD. And in general, it makes Pre LOCH wulin is much weaker than others wulin in any point of time in Jinyong's novels and on the other hand it makes SPW wulin is much stronger etc. And it also makes The 4 Greats at 1st Mt. Hua were not as Great as they were supposed to be - for me it doesn't make sense.

    So my main question is: Did FZ really have mastered YJJ ? After considering all the facts, I think FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ.

    And if we assume that FZ hasn't mastered YJJ, then all fit on their places:
    (1) We can put YJJ stories in DGSD and SPW into continuity: FZ knew that YJJ has 2 interpretation (MA and Zen theories) so did the DGSD Shaolin Monks who live 4-5 centuries earlier than SPW. So, both FZ and DGSD practiced the same YJJ manual (YJJ MA theories and YJJ Zen theories).
    (2) It also fits in the DGSD canon that it is really difficult to fully master YJJ -> FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ -> nothing extraordinary result just like other DGSD Shaolin Monks such as Xuan Ci etc. (FZ ~= XC)
    (3) Pre LOCH wulin's not weaker than any others wulin in any point of time in all JY's novel - the Great in Pre LOCH still looks as Great as it's supposed to be.
    (4) SPW Characters (DFBB, FZ, RWX etc.) no longer anomalies in JY novels

    Letís assume that FZ hasn't mastered YJJ then we can put FZ in LV65-66 the same as Xuan Ci (DGSD) - we know many Shaolin Monks also practiced YJJ but no extraordinary result at that time - so it's fair enough to put FZ in the same level as XC. Then we nerf all the SPW character by 6-7 level. DFBB then will in the LV76-77, IMO it's really high level, It's already above ROCH Great (LV75) - the same level with Zhou Botong (LV77).

    Do you think YG/GJ (LV80) would easily kick ZBT (LV77) ?

    The gap's between DFBB(LV76-77) and RWX(63-64) or LHC (62-63) still wide enough (13-15 levels). RWX (LV63-64) and LHC (62-63). it's at least the same as QQR (1st Mt Hua). FZ(LV65-66) is the same as The 4 Greats (1st Mt Hua). And both FZ, RWX and LHC would be considered as The Great (or Sub Great) at the time of 1st Mt Hua.

    It's fair enough right?

  12. #1932
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gayatri View Post
    In SPW, thereís no others Top Tier MAs nor Top Tier negongs we can connect to others JY novels except YJJ. We know that FZ practiced YJJ. And It's assumed that YJJ if fully master at least it's on par with others Top Tier neigong such as 9Ying (LOCH/ROCH), 9Yang (ROCH/HSDS), Xian Tiang Gong (Pre LOCH/LOCH), Xiao Wuxiang Gong (DGSD) etc. So, we can use YJJ as the basis of comparation

    To determine DFBB level, it depends on the level of other SPW characters such as RWX, FZ, LHC etc. - we know DFBB >>> FZ > RWC > LHC.

    If itís assumed that FZ has fully mastered YJJ and we put FZ in LV 72 (in this JInyong Ranking) - the same level as Wang Chong Yang at the time his death (after 1st Mt Hua) - it also implicitly means YJJ on par with WCY's Xiang Thian Gong - then perhaps you're right, it's hard to imagine that YG/GJ (LV80) would beat DFBB (LV83).

    But this scenario makes so many anomalies, it makes top tier neigongs such as (YJJ, 9Ying, 9Yang, Xiang Thian Gong etc.) look inferior than KHBD. And in general, it makes Pre LOCH wulin is much weaker than others wulin in any point of time in Jinyong's novels and on the other hand it makes SPW wulin is much stronger etc. And it also makes The 4 Greats at 1st Mt. Hua were not as Great as they were supposed to be - for me it doesn't make sense.

    So my main question is: Did FZ really have mastered YJJ ? After considering all the facts, I think FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ.

    And if we assume that FZ hasn't mastered YJJ, then all fit on their places:
    (1) We can put YJJ stories in DGSD and SPW into continuity: FZ knew that YJJ has 2 interpretation (MA and Zen theories) so did the DGSD Shaolin Monks who live 4-5 centuries earlier than SPW. So, both FZ and DGSD practiced the same YJJ manual (YJJ MA theories and YJJ Zen theories).
    (2) It also fits in the DGSD canon that it is really difficult to fully master YJJ -> FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ -> nothing extraordinary result just like other DGSD Shaolin Monks such as Xuan Ci etc. (FZ ~= XC)
    (3) Pre LOCH wulin's not weaker than any others wulin in any point of time in all JY's novel - the Great in Pre LOCH still looks as Great as it's supposed to be.
    (4) SPW Characters (DFBB, FZ, RWX etc.) no longer anomalies in JY novels

    Letís assume that FZ hasn't mastered YJJ then we can put FZ in LV65-66 the same as Xuan Ci (DGSD) - we know many Shaolin Monks also practiced YJJ but no extraordinary result at that time - so it's fair enough to put FZ in the same level as XC. Then we nerf all the SPW character by 6-7 level. DFBB then will in the LV76-77, IMO it's really high level, It's already above ROCH Great (LV75) - the same level with Zhou Botong (LV77).

    Do you think YG/GJ (LV80) would easily kick ZBT (LV77) ?

    The gap's between DFBB(LV76-77) and RWX(63-64) or LHC (62-63) still wide enough (13-15 levels). RWX (LV63-64) and LHC (62-63). it's at least the same as QQR (1st Mt Hua). FZ(LV65-66) is the same as The 4 Greats (1st Mt Hua). And both FZ, RWX and LHC would be considered as The Great (or Sub Great) at the time of 1st Mt Hua.

    It's fair enough right?

    Well I think you miss something FZ is not only learn Yijin Jing but he also learn at least 10 of 72 Shaolin Supreme Art keep in mind XF only learn very basic Shaolin neigong (which considered much inferior than Yijin Jing) and only one of 72 Shaolin Divine Art yet he could rivalled even bettered any of Condor Greats so FZ which learn both arts for over than years should be not far behind XF/Condor Greats level..

  13. #1933
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    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    Well I think you miss something FZ is not only learn Yijin Jing but he also learn at least 10 of 72 Shaolin Supreme Art keep in mind XF only learn very basic Shaolin neigong (which considered much inferior than Yijin Jing) and only one of 72 Shaolin Divine Art yet he could rivalled even bettered any of Condor Greats so FZ which learn both arts for over than years should be not far behind XF/Condor Greats level..
    I mean if XF with only 10 years training in basic Shaolin neigong and less than 10 years for learn 18 Dragon Palm could rivalled Greats in both external/internal art so logically FZ which learn the "ultimate art" (Yijin Jing and 72 Shaolin Divine Art) for over than 30 years should be no worse than XF/Greats IMHO..

  14. #1934
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    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    Well I think you miss something FZ is not only learn Yijin Jing but he also learn at least 10 of 72 Shaolin Supreme Art keep in mind XF only learn very basic Shaolin neigong (which considered much inferior than Yijin Jing) and only one of 72 Shaolin Divine Art yet he could rivalled even bettered any of Condor Greats so FZ which learn both arts for over than years should be not far behind XF/Condor Greats level..
    I still don't get it: I said FZ(LV65-66) is the same as The 4 Greats (1st Mt Hua). And FZ would be considered as The Great at the time of 1st Mt Hua. It's fair enough right? FZ practiced 10 of 72 Arts of Shaolin - it's nothing special. Kong Zhi (HSDS) also practiced at least 11 of 72 Arts of Shaolin, In this ranking, KZ is only LV48 far below Zhang Wu Ji (LV60) after mastering 9YangSG. Even Yin Tian Zheng The White Eagle (LV50) kicked KZ at Batlle of Bright Peak - nothing special.

    Do you think 4 Greats at 1st Mt Hua were so weak and they can't handle FZ's 10 Arts of Shaolin? If that's so, then The 4 Greats at 1st Mt. Hua were not as Great as they were supposed to be - why JY called them The Greats then? Just called them 4 Elites ...

    FZ mastered 10 Shaolin Arts, KZ mastered 11 Shaolin Arts, Xuan Cheng (DGSD) also mastered 13 of 72 Arts of Shaolin. Whether XC (DGSD) and KZ (HSDS) practiced YJJ or just basic Shaolin neigong - we don't even know that - Still it's nothing special compare to Jiu mo zhi with Xiao Wuxiang Gong internals that could master All of 72 Arts of Shaolin.

    Considering that YJJ ~= Xiao Wuxiang Gong, so, If FZ has fully mastered YJJ, he could also master All of 72 Arts of Shaolins too just like JMZ did, right?

    The fact that FZ only mastered 10 of 72 Arts of Shaolin is another indication that FZ hasn't fully mastered YJJ. YJJ without deep understanding of Zen Buddhism (心无所住) is nothing. If we assume XC only practiced basic (DGSD) Shaolin neigong could mastered 13 Arts of Shaolin > FZ practiced YJJ could master only 10 Arts of Shaolin then we can say that Basic (DGSD) Shaolin Neigong > FZ YJJ right? IMO YJJ will be watered down to the level of Basic (DGSD) Shaolin neigong without (心无所住)

    You miss something important:

    Canon (DGSD) said: Many (DGSD) Shaolin Monks also practiced YJJ, after many years practice (perhaps 30-40 years like FZ did or even 100 years) yielded negligible results. Because to fully master YJJ is really difficult -> someone need to reach (心无所住) In Sanskrit it's called Apratisthita - it's Buddhism terminology.

    Do you think FZ fully has mastered YJJ - did he have reached Apratisthita (The highest form of Buddha-hood in Mahayana Buddhism) --> You have to answer this question first.

    Personally, I believe Sweeper Monks that has fully mastered YJJ because his wisdom and his understanding of Zen Buddhism indicate that he has reached (心无所住) or Apratisthita. So, for him it's a piece of cake to fully master YJJ. IMO Sweeper Monks = Fully mastered YJJ.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Western Eccentric View Post
    I mean if XF with only 10 years training in basic Shaolin neigong and less than 10 years for learn 18 Dragon Palm could rivalled Greats in both external/internal art so logically FZ which learn the "ultimate art" (Yijin Jing and 72 Shaolin Divine Art) for over than 30 years should be no worse than XF/Greats IMHO..
    About XF, we don't even know what XF had been through - perhaps something happens to XF like GJ (drank poisonous snake blood) or YG (eat Snake gallbladders), many protagonists in JY universe experience this kind of thing. IMO this is one of the reasons why YG/GJ can reach Great Level in such a young age ... perhaps this kind of thing happened to XF too, who knows?

  16. #1936
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gayatri View Post
    About XF, we don't even know what XF had been through - perhaps something happens to XF like GJ (drank poisonous snake blood) or YG (eat Snake gallbladders), many protagonists in JY universe experience this kind of thing. IMO this is one of the reasons why YG/GJ can reach Great Level in such a young age ... perhaps this kind of thing happened to XF too, who knows?
    I doubt about it since JY never said anything but if we realized that XYS at XF age (around 30s) could easily "wipe out" entire wulin elites which lead by Shaolin and Kaypang is not strange at all if XF could reach such high level at his age considering his talent which way better than his father..

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