Losing to a girl

[Yeung Gor]

In modern times, when a guy lose to a girl in a fight, he would be laughed at. Considering men were more macho and had more pride in Wuxia, why is it when a girl defeats them in a duel, they don't get ridicule by their male peers? I imagine it would even be more humiliating during that era to lost to females than it is in modern times since society hold females in lesser regards back then. Why is it different in Wuxia like it's not even an issue?

Also I remember back in the days when I train martial arts, guys and girls don't spar each other usually, but in wuxia they are treated same. I find that interesting.

[Suet Seung]

In modern times, when a guy lose to a girl in a fight, he would be laughed at. Considering men were more macho and had more pride in Wuxia, why is it when a girl defeats them in a duel, they don't get ridicule by their male peers? I imagine it would even be more humiliating during that era to lost to females than it is in modern times since society hold females in lesser regards back then. Why is it different in Wuxia like it's not even an issue?

Also I remember back in the days when I train martial arts, guys and girls don't spar each other usually, but in wuxia they are treated same. I find that interesting.

Really? Could you provide examples of where these men who lost to women in sparring wasn't laughed at in wuxia novels?

[Ardor]

Didn't you train by yourself with your hot master?

And also, being defeated by your senior is by no means humiliating. Being defeated by someone with better martial arts is also not humiliating. Not achieving the same level although receiving the same training is the humiliating part.

[Yeung Gor]

Really? Could you provide examples of where these men who lost to women in sparring wasn't laughed at in wuxia novels?

XLN defeating those Daoists when she appeared. Not only is she a female, but only a little girl in their eyes.

[Yeung Gor]

Didn't you train by yourself with your hot master?

And also, being defeated by your senior is by no means humiliating. Being defeated by someone with better martial arts is also not humiliating. Not achieving the same level although receiving the same training is the humiliating part.

Don't forget, I was in those stingy Daoist sect before I met Gu Gu.

Yea, getting beating by your senior is one thing but if you are not in the same school, then it will not apply.

[Suet Seung]

XLN defeating those Daoists when she appeared. Not only is she a female, but only a little girl in their eyes.

But that's impossible for them to not feel humiliated and "having lost face".

You still haven't given me any examples of men not feeling humiliated because they were defeated by the opposite gender.

[Ardor]

But that's impossible for them to not feel humiliated and "having lost face".

You still haven't given me any examples of men not feeling humiliated because they were defeated by the opposite gender.

LMC vs countless men.
TSTL against 36 caves, 72 islands.
2nd evil vs 3rd and 4th evils.

[Felix]

In modern times, when a guy lose to a girl in a fight, he would be laughed at. Considering men were more macho and had more pride in Wuxia, why is it when a girl defeats them in a duel, they don't get ridicule by their male peers? I imagine it would even be more humiliating during that era to lost to females than it is in modern times since society hold females in lesser regards back then. Why is it different in Wuxia like it's not even an issue?

Also I remember back in the days when I train martial arts, guys and girls don't spar each other usually, but in wuxia they are treated same. I find that interesting.

Hmm, if the hypothesis is correct that LCY was a level above the 4 Greats had she participated in the tournament, that would have been a big blow to their egos would it not?

[Yeung Gor]

But that's impossible for them to not feel humiliated and "having lost face".

You still haven't given me any examples of men not feeling humiliated because they were defeated by the opposite gender.

they felt humiliated not because she was female, but because they lost, that's normal. My point isn't about feeling humiliated but rather why other men don't make fun of them for losing to females as it would be in our times.

Whenever we see a fight between a guy and girl, if the guy loses, you will see a bunch of guys laughing at that guy for losing to a girl it really doesnt matter if the girl is more skill, just the nature of men having pride in not ever losing to a girl in combat. However, this is not an issue in Wuxia. That's why I find that odd.

[Suet Seung]

they felt humiliated not because she was female, but because they lost, that's normal. My point isn't about feeling humiliated but rather why other men don't make fun of them for losing to females as it would be in our times.

Whenever we see a fight between a guy and girl, if the guy loses, you will see a bunch of guys laughing at that guy for losing to a girl it really doesnt matter if the girl is more skill, just the nature of men having pride in not ever losing to a girl in combat. However, this is not an issue in Wuxia. That's why I find that odd.

I don't think you can rule out times when men are laughed at by others for losing to the opposite gender. Just because you don't see or hear it in wuxia, doesn't mean it never happens.

[Yeung Gor]

Hmm, if the hypothesis is correct that LCY was a level above the 4 Greats had she participated in the tournament, that would have been a big blow to their egos would it not?

Exactly... if this was modern times and there was a UFC or Pride open Tournament, and all the top fighters compete and some girl comes in and beats everyone. I am sure everyone will laugh at the guys who lost to her and their ego will be crush more so than if it was just another guy. And of course, that girl will also become a legend.

[Radken]

Hmm, if the hypothesis is correct that LCY was a level above the 4 Greats had she participated in the tournament, that would have been a big blow to their egos would it not?

Which begs the question, why didn't she participate? Nevermind, she probably died before then.

[Yeung Gor]

I don't think you can rule out times when men are laughed at by others for losing to the opposite gender. Just because you don't see or hear it in wuxia, doesn't mean it never happens.

Can you give me an example in wuxia that it did happen? And this example must illustrate the fact they got laugh at because the victor is a female.

I think the fact it isn't shown in any wuxia that I have seen so far made me think it isn't much of an issue where as it is in real life. And to me that is interesting.. and I wonder why it is so... that's all.

[CC]

I think one of the standard reactions when losing to a female is to brand her as a 'female demon/witch/devil' then have everybody gang up on her! (see TSTL, LMC, MCF)

[Bangs]

Can you give me an example in wuxia that it did happen? And this example must illustrate the fact they got laugh at because the victor is a female.

I think the fact it isn't shown in any wuxia that I have seen so far made me think it isn't much of an issue where as it is in real life. And to me that is interesting.. and I wonder why it is so... that's all.

The simple reason for this is because the novel creators don't want to inspire sexist ideas and gain criticism. They wanted the readers (both male and female) to enjoy the story for what it really is.

[resident:alien]

yeung gor, how would you feel if you lost to a girl?

how did you feel when that miserable wench, guo fu, cut off your arm? did you concede defeat then?

[Mojo Jojo]

The girls in wuxia can be extremely powerful and can for all intents and purposes be treated as if armed with weapons if they have any martial training.

This would be like a guy in the real world who gets his *** kicked by a girl with a gun or sword. Nobody laughs because people recognize that it's far different than a normal situation.

[lilchilipepper]

By the time female fighters in wuxia get to the point where they can kick lots of a**, they've generally already got a good couple years of respect (or at least fear) instilled in the wulin. Examples:

Huang Rong (ROCH): Nobody is gonna laugh at a guy who loses to the Leader of the Beggar Clan. It's almost a given that she'll win, either through pure martial arts or through her cunning.

Li Mo Chou (ROCH): A bunch of guys have lost to her. The reason nobody laughs? The fear factor.

Mei Chao Feng (LOCH): Similar to Li Mo Chou, she instills fear in her opponents. You get caught laughing at her and you're more likely than not a dead man.

Ren Ying Ying (SOD): I think that she's a bit of an exception because she's young compared to the above examples. The respect she gets isn't from herself so much as it is from who's backing her up. Everybody respects her because Dong Fang Bu Bai respects her. And also cause she helped some of them get the antidote for the San Si Lao Shen Dan.

Xiao Long Nu (ROCH): Um...I think guys are too busy googling to laugh at any guy who loses to her....

And...to all the guys in this forum, just for the heck of it, I have to say this. There is no shame in losing to a girl--even today. Although we naturally may not be as physically capable as guys, we are still able to kick plenty of *** when needed. So please don't let your male ego get to your head, and treat us with some respect.

[Yeung Gor]

The simple reason for this is because the novel creators don't want to inspire sexist ideas and gain criticism. They wanted the readers (both male and female) to enjoy the story for what it really is.

those are good intentions and could be true.

[Yeung Gor]

yeung gor, how would you feel if you lost to a girl?

how did you feel when that miserable wench, guo fu, cut off your arm? did you concede defeat then?

Not a real duel and my master is a female so I am neutral, and my feelings were anger and revenge after she choped off my arm.