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How much did YG boost up in sadmode?
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Thread: How much did YG boost up in sadmode?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Default How much did YG boost up in sadmode?

    When YG faught with Golden Wheel Monk to save Guo Xiang, they faught over hundred of stances and even though YG's Sad Palms was without sadness, he still was able to gain an upperhand against GWM until the monk cheated. YG suffer a severe injury and right before he was about to die, the sadness of not seeing Gu Gu again boost his Sad Palms power and he was then able to defeat GWM in a couple of stances. The boost seems to be quite significant. But how much was it? 20%? 30%? or more?

  2. #2
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    Wasn’t it stated that YG would have beaten GWM in around hundreds of stances in "happy mode". But in "Super Emo mode", he beat him in couple stances.

    So I say probably x2 or x3 power.

    Sad Palm in Emo mode > SB18P

    Sad Palm in Normal mode < SB18P

  3. #3
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dimeron
    Wasn’t it stated that YG would have beaten GWM in around hundreds of stances in "happy mode".
    IIRC it wasn't.
    .................................................. ...............
    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    The boost seems to be quite significant. But how much was it? 20%? 30%? or more?
    The happenings of the Xiang Yang fight:
    1. Jinlun injured Yang Guo.
    2. Yang Guo got sad, his power was suddenly boosted up.
    3. Jinlun approached to finish YG's life.
    4. Jinlun didn't think that Yang Guo's power was suddently increased.
    5. Jinlun was taken by surprise and was killed in 2 stances.

    Lemma:
    Zhang Sanfeng could kill the opponents who were supposed to be as 1/6 as powerful as him in 1 stance.
    Yang Guo is probably around Zhang Sanfeng's level.

    From the information above, I have the key for this problem:

    Normal mode YG = Normal mode JLun = x
    Normal mode injured YG = 0.5x
    Normal mode surprised Jinlun = 0.3x
    Boost = a
    => Sad mode injured YG = 0.5x + ax
    Sad mode injured YG killed Normal mode surprised Jinlun in 2 stances.
    => At that time, he was 3 times as powerful as Jinlun.
    => ax + 0.5x = 3. 0.3x = 0.9x
    <=> ax = 0.4x
    <=> a = 0.4 = 40%.
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-07-07 at 01:42 PM.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  4. #4
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    wait i thought yang guo was happy again after he found his gugu, so shouldnt the sad palm give negative effect?
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    Senior Member Snafu3721's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR
    wait i thought yang guo was happy again after he found his gugu, so shouldnt the sad palm give negative effect?
    When JLGS was going to kill him, it made him extremely sad because he thought he would never get to see his gugu again. Thus, increasing his sad palm power.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huang Rong
    IIRC it wasn't.
    .................................................. ...............

    The happenings of the Xiang Yang fight:
    1. Jinlun injured Yang Guo.
    2. Yang Guo got sad, his power was suddenly boosted up.
    3. Jinlun approached to finish YG's life.
    4. Jinlun didn't think that Yang Guo's power was suddently increased.
    5. Jinlun was taken by surprise and was killed in 2 stances.

    Lemma:
    Zhang Sanfeng could kill the opponents who were supposed to be as 1/6 as powerful as him in 1 stance.
    Yang Guo is probably around Zhang Sanfeng's level.

    From the information above, I have the key for this problem:

    Normal mode YG = Normal mode JLun = x
    Normal mode injured YG = 0.5x
    Normal mode surprised Jinlun = 0.3x
    Boost = a
    => Sad mode injured YG = 0.5x + ax
    Sad mode injured YG killed Normal mode surprised Jinlun in 2 stances.
    => At that time, he was 3 times as powerful as Jinlun.
    => ax + 0.5x = 3. 0.3x = 0.9x
    <=> ax = 0.4x
    <=> a = 0.4 = 40%.
    I like your analysis and calculations, Auntie!

  7. #7
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    You know if you were to take the 40% increase boost from sadmode and put that into PJ's ranking, YG would rank above Dugu Quibai.

    PJ's ranking:

    Dugu Qui Bai = 280

    Gwok Jing = 250
    Zhang 3Feng = 245
    YG (unsad mode) = 230 + 40 % boost to sadmode = 322

    So in sadmode, YG would be the best in the Trilogy.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Loke-Gao-Zhu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    You know if you were to take the 40% increase boost from sadmode and put that into PJ's ranking, YG would rank above Dugu Quibai.

    PJ's ranking:

    Dugu Qui Bai = 280

    Gwok Jing = 250
    Zhang 3Feng = 245
    YG (unsad mode) = 230 + 40 % boost to sadmode = 322

    So in sadmode, YG would be the best in the Trilogy.
    in PJ's world

    Z3F >> ALL except sweeper
    在下日月神教陸教主是也

  9. #9
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loke-Gao-Zhu
    in PJ's world

    Z3F >> ALL except sweeper
    I think it's Icyfox's world that Z3F > all, even sweeper.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Xiao Feng's Avatar
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    My 2 cents;

    YG's Sad Palms in normal circumstances would be fueled by his inner energy. When in emotional distress, his emotions sort of work like afterburners, making his palm strikes heavier and fiercer. But it doesn't make YG himself stronger.

    Now, in that fight with GWM, even if YG had started in emo mode, his blows would probably have been more forceful, but still probably wouldn't have enabled him to subdue GWM in significantly less time. It was the sucker punch that actually KOed GWM at the end.

    Thinking out loud now, I believe that a skill which has such direct connections with the user's emotions, to be fueled by these emotions, especially negative ones, can only have ill side effects if used often.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    You know if you were to take the 40% increase boost from sadmode and put that into PJ's ranking, YG would rank above Dugu Quibai.

    PJ's ranking:

    Dugu Qui Bai = 280

    Gwok Jing = 250
    Zhang 3Feng = 245
    YG (unsad mode) = 230 + 40 % boost to sadmode = 322

    So in sadmode, YG would be the best in the Trilogy.
    Well I don't think so, "the best or not the best", that depends on who his opponent is and how his opponent fights.

    According to The Law of Conservation and Transformation of Energy, the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant, although it may change forms.

    Therefore Yang Guo's total amout of energy in sad mode = that in normal mode.
    In sad mode, YG's energy utilization is increased.
    But the total amout of energy still stays the same, thus, the endurance of the Sad Mode Yang Guo < that of the Normal Mode Yang Guo.
    I drew a graph to represent this matter. lolz I used the Paint application of Windows so it's very ugly, hope you'll understand what I mean :

    As you can see from the graph, YG's palm energy is boosted up only throughout the t1t2 period, so if the opponent is cautious about Yang Guo from t1 and keeps dragging the fight on to t2, then from t2 on, he/she will gradually gain the upper hand over Yang Guo. , and when the time reaches t3, YG's power will be exhausted and that will result in him being killed by the opponent.
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-08-07 at 04:05 PM.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  12. #12
    Senior Member duguxiaojing's Avatar
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    i'm not sure if I can understand your mathmatics or your graph(i suck at math), but i will say that it looks pretty impressive =D.
    wow..04-08....4 years just like that..time flies..

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    Huang Rong has a lot of time on her hands...

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    And according to the Law of Gravity, no one should be able to jump on to 24234234 feet tall rooftops either...

    I would never ever associate physics with wu xia....ever...
    Still searching for my GuGu

  15. #15
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huang Rong
    Well I don't think so, "the best or not the best", that depends on who his opponent is and how his opponent fights.

    According to The Law of Conservation and Transformation of Energy, the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant, although it may change forms.

    Therefore Yang Guo's total amout of energy in sad mode = that in normal mode.
    In sad mode, YG's energy utilization is increased.
    But the total amout of energy still stays the same, thus, the endurance of the Sad Mode Yang Guo < that of the Normal Mode Yang Guo.
    I drew a graph to represent this matter. lolz I used the Paint application of Windows so it's very ugly, hope you'll understand what I mean :

    As you can see from the graph, YG's palm energy is boosted up only throughout the t1t2 period, so if the opponent is cautious about Yang Guo from t1 and keeps dragging the fight on to t2, then from t2 on, he/she will gradually gain the upper hand over Yang Guo. , and when the time reaches t3, YG's power will be exhausted and that will result in him being killed by the opponent.
    The only problem with this theory is that, during the 16 yrs, YG was in sadmode when he develop Sad Palms, therefore, his normal mode is sadmode rather than happymode. So it shouldn't be the case that sadmode would exhaust his energy faster but more like happymode reduced his normal power level. Hope you understand what I mean. It would be equivalent to a say a power lifter who got the flu, his strength is deminish but when he is back to normal health his strength returns to it's essense form, just as how Sad Palms was describe to have lost it's essense when YG was happy, but when sadness return YG power boost back to normal.
    Last edited by Yeung Gor; 02-08-07 at 07:24 PM.

  16. #16
    Senior Member batmankiller's Avatar
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    Hr that's a very good point.. and although physics shouldnt be combined with wuxia.. it makes sense here although YG made a good point too.. hmm any talkers?

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    Emm, i'm modifying Huang Rong chart, no offense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Huang Rong
    ... when the time reaches t3, YG's power will be exhausted and that will result in him being killed by the opponent.
    Huang Rong, this is true if Yang Guo at sad mode is only a mere 30% or 40% higher than normal mode, and the opponent is able to drag the fight to time t3. If it is 2x or more, the opponent might not get the chance to drag the fight to t3. See below:


    If physics theory applies in Wuxia and considering that they can fight for whole day, which means reaching t4 is 1 day, then reaching time t2 could mean 10 hours or something, which is still long enough for sad mode to kill off the opponent.
    Last edited by shortsight; 02-09-07 at 12:01 AM.

  18. #18
    Senior Member Huang Rong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QF
    Huang Rong has a lot of time on her hands...
    no matter what your implication is, yeah, you're rite. (marginal note: time is just relative, the faster you are, the more time you have).
    Quote Originally Posted by R!chard
    And according to the Law of Gravity, no one should be able to jump on to 24234234 feet tall rooftops either...
    I would never ever associate physics with wu xia....ever...
    And AFAIK, the Law of Energy Conservation is absolutely right in JY's novels (and perhaps all other wuxia novels as well). That is, the energy of any character can NOT come from NOwhere.
    Fox ex: Xu Zhu's energy was transferred into his body by the 3 Elders of the Xiao Yao School, Yang Guo's energy came from snake gall-bladders and training,...
    Quote Originally Posted by Yeung Gor
    The only problem with this theory is that, during the 16 yrs, YG was in sadmode when he develop Sad Palms, therefore, his normal mode is sadmode rather than happymode. So it shouldn't be the case that sadmode would exhaust his energy faster but more like happymode reduced his normal power level.
    When YG fought with ZBT and Huang Yaoshi, he hadn't reunited with Xiao Long Nv yet, therefore at that times, he was still in a rather-sad mode (normal mode).
    Quote Originally Posted by shortsight
    If physics theory applies in Wuxia and considering that they can fight for whole day, which means reaching t4 is 1 day, then reaching time t2 could mean 10 hours or something, which is still long enough for sad mode to kill off the opponent.
    well, i don't think the Greats can fight with each other for a whole day. In ROCH and LOCH, Hong Qigong and Ouyang Feng fought 2 times, if i recall correctly, 2 or 3 hours of fighting was the limit of their endurance.
    Last edited by Huang Rong; 02-09-07 at 05:41 AM. Reason: correct some details about the Law of Gravity.
    Yang Guo & Zhou Botong said in Chapters 6, 11 & 25 of ROCH:
    - 这道姑也算得美了,只是还不及桃花岛郭伯母,更加不及我姑姑。
    - 原来郭伯母竟是这般美貌,小时候我却不觉得。
    - 龙姑娘,我瞧你品貌才智,和那小黄蓉不相上下,武功也跟她差不离。

  19. #19
    Senior Member Yeung Gor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huang Rong
    When YG fought with ZBT and Huang Yaoshi, he hadn't reunited with Xiao Long Nv yet, therefore at that times, he was still in a rather-sad mode (normal mode).
    In your graph, you seperated sadmode and normal mode, and now your statement above refer to them as the same, isn't it contradictory? Anyways, my main point was that sadmode is indeed his normal mode, happymode (unsad mode) was his weaken state, therefore YG was not at his normal mode, therefore your theory that he would waste more energy at sadmode is not correct due to the fact that he is actually back to his normal powerful mode. I gave an example like a powerlifter who came down with the flu, he would be in a weaken state but if he return back to health to his normal mode, he would be stronger and obviously his endurance would be even better.

    Also, regarding, the duel with ZBT and Huang Yaoshi, YG was not completely sad, he was in fact beginning to feel happiness to know he will see XLN soon. Read the dialogue YG has with Guo Xiang about reuniting with XLN, you can just tell he is excited that the date has finally arrive.
    Last edited by Yeung Gor; 02-09-07 at 05:25 AM.

  20. #20
    Banned ltcuoi's Avatar
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    Enough boost to defeat Guo Jing.

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