Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: A comprehensive collection of HomoErotic moments in Jin Yong wuxia

  1. #1
    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Posts
    18,425

    Default A comprehensive collection of HomoErotic moments in Jin Yong wuxia

    Chances are, The notion of 2 guys holding hands in broad daylight nowadays is a major no-no in the heterosexual community. But back then in the wuxia universe, male holding hands was acceptable and not out of the ordinary. For example, Qiao Feng held Duan Yu's hand as he introduced Duan to the Beggar's Union members: 他拉着段誉的手,走到那白须白发、手使倒齿铁锏的长老铁前... While it might not have been palm-to-palm hand holding, it was nevertheless close.

    What other such homoerotic moments exist in wuxia?
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

  2. #2
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    24,367

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PJ
    What other such homoerotic moments exist in wuxia?
    TVB's SPW '84.

    Those scenes between the flute guy and the lute guy (God, I sound like LuNaR now) certain raised my eyebrows when I was twelve years old.

  3. #3
    Senior Member duguxiaojing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,492

    Default

    IIRC HYS and YG leaped off the top of sepertae poles and then went decending towards the earth hand in hand like celestial beings....guess it was cool back in the day?
    wow..04-08....4 years just like that..time flies..

  4. #4
    Senior Member ChronoReverse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    2,858

    Default

    Frankly, it's only modern society that has all these weird ideas. If you read great literature, that type of thing is nothing particular.

    For example, Frodo and Sam held hands as the approached Mount Doom. In the book it sure seems fine. Of course, once it's on the big screen, all the "I love you, Sam" bits seem a bit more squeamish =/

  5. #5
    Moderator Ken Cheng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    24,367

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ChronoReverse
    Frankly, it's only modern society that has all these weird ideas.
    Well, not quite that recent. It began when the Abrahamic faiths (i.e. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) began asserting themselves as dominant cultural forces in western Eurasia during the era of the Roman Empire, continuing through the European Middle Ages and the rise of the Islamic Empire, and finally spreading to the rest of the planet during the centuries of colonialism and industrialization. All told, that's about two-thousand years of history.

    Have there been homoerotic subtexts in literature during that time? Sure, there have, but the moral authorities of the times have always deemed these subtexts subversive.

    So no, homophobia isn't an invention of the 20th or 21st Centuries.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Candide's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    ( @ )( @ )
    Posts
    4,651

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ChronoReverse
    Frankly, it's only modern society that has all these weird ideas.
    Not true. It only exists in the Anglosphere. Outside of that (and the world is much bigger), it is normal for men to hold hands.
    "Anything you can't say NO to is your MASTER, and you are its SLAVE."

    "I disapprove of what I say, but I will defend to the death my right to say it."

  7. #7
    Senior Member ChronoReverse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    2,858

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Candide
    Not true. It only exists in the Anglosphere. Outside of that (and the world is much bigger), it is normal for men to hold hands.
    While mostly true, this kind of thing is starting to spread to a lot of what could be called "western society" outside Europe and North America.


    Well, not quite that recent. It began when the Abrahamic faiths (i.e. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) began asserting themselves as dominant cultural forces in western Eurasia during the era of the Roman Empire, continuing through the European Middle Ages and the rise of the Islamic Empire, and finally spreading to the rest of the planet during the centuries of colonialism and industrialization. All told, that's about two-thousand years of history.
    Eh, I wouldn't say so. Even though they are against homosexuality, things like holding hands and hugging simply weren't considered as such which is a rather strange juxtaposition.

    See, it was intercourse that was the taboo. Men used to be able to be close "bosom buddies" without having to go physical nor being accused of homosexuality either. For some reason, modern society likes to do both.

    Even in North America, in the United States, many of the squeamish things and words wouldn't have raised an eyebrow just 100 years ago. If you read literature like Dumas, it's quite clear that the culture didn't have problems with men hugging or crying together during emotional times. And the renaissance wasn't that far off from now.
    Last edited by ChronoReverse; 04-01-07 at 02:02 AM.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Candide's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    ( @ )( @ )
    Posts
    4,651

    Default

    Europe? In Europe, apart from England, it's mostly fine for men to hold hands or hug each other. In countries like Italy, Greek, Spain and Portugal men can even kiss other men in the cheek when greeting them.

    I agree that this anglo-homophobia is slowly spreading everywhere though. That's a shame.
    "Anything you can't say NO to is your MASTER, and you are its SLAVE."

    "I disapprove of what I say, but I will defend to the death my right to say it."

  9. #9
    Senior Member ChronoReverse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    2,858

    Default

    Hrm, you're right. I wonder why I auto-assumed Europe when I said Western. It's not even that, it's just NA.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    6,741

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    TVB's SPW '84.

    Those scenes between the flute guy and the lute guy (God, I sound like LuNaR now) certain raised my eyebrows when I was twelve years old.
    just cause i dunt study as much wuxia as u sheesh, i guess i'll just stop posting on the wuxia forum then
    Participate in SPCNET Idol Season 4!!!

    http://www.spcnet.tv/forums/showthre...66#post1127566

    Entries due July 31st, 2016!

  11. #11
    Moderator kidd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Somewhere Out There
    Posts
    13,111

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Cheng
    Well, not quite that recent. It began when the Abrahamic faiths (i.e. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) began asserting themselves as dominant cultural forces in western Eurasia during the era of the Roman Empire, continuing through the European Middle Ages and the rise of the Islamic Empire, and finally spreading to the rest of the planet during the centuries of colonialism and industrialization. All told, that's about two-thousand years of history.

    Have there been homoerotic subtexts in literature during that time? Sure, there have, but the moral authorities of the times have always deemed these subtexts subversive.

    So no, homophobia isn't an invention of the 20th or 21st Centuries.
    Arab men still hold hands nowadays and they don't think it's homo in anyway. That's what I read in a newpaper article about doing business in Arab. It said Arab men might take your hand when they want to lead you somewhere.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    624

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LuNaR
    just cause i dunt study as much wuxia as u sheesh, i guess i'll just stop posting on the wuxia forum then
    Lunar, it's not about your being uninformed of the intricacies of wuxia which made people here at SPCNet 'jump' at you. No it isn't.

    Instead, you should have known better than to say something 'sucks' when you do not know much about it. More often than not, people here would provide information when you're not clear of something. But to pass judgement (especially a very critical one) of something you're not very sure of, and thinking it a lowly piece of work merely because it doesn't meet your expectations (but curiously enough, it DOES meet those of many people) and your wants, that's going a bit too far.

    Don't take offense at Ken's post. I'm sure he meant nothing.

    Pacifian

  13. #13
    Senior Member ghostdarTeal'c's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Currently in Moss, Silver. Next stop....still Moss, Silver
    Posts
    4,330

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kidd
    Arab men still hold hands nowadays and they don't think it's homo in anyway. That's what I read in a newpaper article about doing business in Arab. It said Arab men might take your hand when they want to lead you somewhere.
    True, it's even natural for them to hug each other and kiss in the cheek like those Italians (i think i got this from mafia movies )

    Quote Originally Posted by LuNar
    just cause i dunt study as much wuxia as u sheesh, i guess i'll just stop posting on the wuxia forum then
    c'mon, why should Ken's tease stop you? be a sport i read the replies in your thread, and i think they did not actually jump at you in such a harsh way. At least it's not as harsh as the replies PeterBanh's been getting... And those definitely dont stop him from creating new threads in the Open Debate forums....
    Last edited by ghostdarTeal'c; 04-01-07 at 06:22 AM.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    624

    Default

    Italians, Arabians, Westerners aside, in China, guys holding hands is quite common. Just minus off those happily swinging arms and gay smiles and everything, and you don't really see anything to do with homoeroticism.

  15. #15
    Senior Member duguxiaojing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,492

    Default

    (Those scenes between the flute guy and the lute guy (God, I sound like LuNaR now) certain raised my eyebrows when I was twelve years old. )

    Ya, IIRC they also held hands before committing suicide together. And LHC did not find their hand holding weird.. so hand holding= no big deal.
    wow..04-08....4 years just like that..time flies..

  16. #16
    Senior Member PJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Posts
    18,425

    Default

    Guys, I think I may have a new favorite HE (HomoErotic) moment in wuxia:

    但觉胸口一酸,泪珠滚滚而下,到后来,便伏在丁典怀中大哭起来。丁典搂住他上身,轻轻抚摸他的 长发。

    [He] could no longer control his emotions. His tears poured down as he rested on Ding Dian's chest area. Ding Dian held onto his upper body, gently stroking his long hair.

    What? A make up but no kiss? I feel cheated!!
    忽见柳荫下两个小孩子在哀哀痛哭,瞧模样正是武敦儒、武修文兄弟。郭芙大声叫道:「喂,你们在干甚麽?」武 修文回头见是郭芙,哭道:「我们在哭,你不见麽?」

  17. #17
    Moderator kidd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Somewhere Out There
    Posts
    13,111

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PJ View Post
    Guys, I think I may have a new favorite HE (HomoErotic) moment in wuxia:

    但觉胸口一酸,泪珠滚滚而下,到后来,便伏在丁典怀中大哭起来。丁典搂住他上身,轻轻抚摸他的 长发。

    [He] could no longer control his emotions. His tears poured down as he rested on Ding Dian's chest area. Ding Dian held onto his upper body, gently stroking his long hair.

    What? A make up but no kiss? I feel cheated!!
    This is so out of context.
    什麼是朋友?朋友永遠是在你犯下不可原諒錯誤的時候,仍舊站在你那邊的笨蛋。~ 王亞瑟

    和諧唔係一百個人講同一番話,係一百個人有一百句唔同嘅說話,而又互相尊重 ~ - 葉梓恩

  18. #18
    Senior Member sheraldine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    STILL malaysia - CHEH!!
    Posts
    486

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PJ View Post
    Guys, I think I may have a new favorite HE (HomoErotic) moment in wuxia:

    但觉胸口一酸,泪珠滚滚而下,到后来,便伏在丁典怀中大哭起来。丁典搂住他上身,轻轻抚摸他的 长发。

    [He] could no longer control his emotions. His tears poured down as he rested on Ding Dian's chest area. Ding Dian held onto his upper body, gently stroking his long hair.

    What? A make up but no kiss? I feel cheated!!
    that make up really work you up for nothing, PJ
    but fairly speaking, such translation really makes one all standing up .

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 17
    Last Post: 09-15-07, 06:56 PM
  2. Jin Yong wuxia novels quiz #1
    By PJ in forum Wuxia Fiction
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 12-15-06, 04:35 AM
  3. Missed Opportunities in Jin Yong wuxia
    By PJ in forum Wuxia Fiction
    Replies: 47
    Last Post: 10-21-06, 09:49 PM
  4. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 08-19-06, 01:14 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •