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Thread: Dad of a fallen Marine perseveres against protests at military funerals

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    Default Dad of a fallen Marine perseveres against protests at military funerals

    Link to article, "Dad of a fallen Marine perseveres against protests at military funerals" @

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20100331...Fkb2ZmYWxsZW5t

    It is tragic that the funeral of a fallen soldier was disrupted by these despicable people in the name of religion. The father of the fallen soldier is now required to pay for their legal fees. Do you think that protecting the protesters' rights to free-speech has gone too far or do you think that protecting a person's rights to free-speech is most important regardless?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sowfoong View Post
    Link to article, "Dad of a fallen Marine perseveres against protests at military funerals" @

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20100331...Fkb2ZmYWxsZW5t

    It is tragic that the funeral of a fallen soldier was disrupted by these despicable people in the name of religion. The father of the fallen soldier is now required to pay for their legal fees. Do you think that protecting the protesters' rights to free-speech has gone too far or do you think that protecting a person's rights to free-speech is most important regardless?
    Yes, it went too far.
    While I am all for free speech but not in this situation. This is one of the main reason I hate many religious institutions. Those church member should be ashamed of themself for what they do to a funeral of a fallen hero. Without the sacrifice of these heroes, they wouldn't have the freedom they currently have. I hope the suppreme court of the land will rule in favor of the father of the fallen hero.

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    Senior Member Guo Xiang's Avatar
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    The court is crazy for siding the church in question. I don't think those buggers realised that free speech is not a right but a privilege, one that they are abusing.

    IMO not all soldiers are heroes, but someone's dead and the family should have the basic RIGHT to grieve and mourn instead of having to go through this type of shit.

    How on earth can free speech override human well-being and rights?

    And "Thank God for dead soldiers"? What kind of church is that? I doubt Jesus Christ ever preached something so malicious. Fancy wishing people dead like that!
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    Free speech, within the US borders, is a right and it should be protected. It is a slippery slope to start prohibiting certain speech just because the content is distasteful.

    I think there is some discrepancy in the facts, in the news article it stated the protest was 30 feet from the memorial service and the father needed to enter through the rear entrance - whereas other sources indicate that the protest was 1000 feet from the entrance and the father did not know of the protest until he was watching the news after the service.

    Nevertheless, I do not agree with nor condone the distasteful message that the Westboro Baptist Church is expressing - but as a matter of principle Westboro Baptist Church should be afforded the protection of the First Amendment. And the Westboro Baptist Church appeared to have (1) kept a reasonable distance from the memorial service, (2) did not disrupt the memorial service, and (3) notified the local police before the protest to ensure order. Speech should not be prohibited merely because it is distasteful or being something we do not want to hear.

    My heart and condolences goes out to the father, Mr. Snyder, especially after reading his statement.

    "I think about the sign [i.e., Thank God for dead soldiers] every day of my life. . . . I see that sign when I lay in bed at nights. I [had] one chance to bury my son and they took the dignity away from it. I cannot re-bury my son. And for the rest of my life, I will remember what they did to me and it has tarnished the memory of my son’s last hour on earth. Somebody could have stabbed me in the arm or in the back and the wound would have healed. But I don’t think this will heal."

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    So, if I were to follow exactly what was done by this church and proceeded to organise a protest everytime someone from this church dies at the exact same distance with the slogans 'Thank god for dead Baptists' and 'American deaths are because Baptists have yet to be hanged' I would be well within the laws?
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    Quote Originally Posted by athlee View Post
    So, if I were to follow exactly what was done by this church and proceeded to organise a protest everytime someone from this church dies at the exact same distance with the slogans 'Thank god for dead Baptists' and 'American deaths are because Baptists have yet to be hanged' I would be well within the laws?
    Simple answer - yes.

    Assuming you are (1) an American citizen or legal resident and (2) within the US borders - you are merely exercising your First Amendment rights.

    The First Amendment does not protect factual statements but protects all speech that it is in the nature of an opinion; thus, there is really no laws that can restrict you from voicing an opinion. (Eg. X is a murderer - is a factual statement so this is not protected by the First Amendment and will get you in trouble for defamation.)

    But there are better things to do with your time than fly to Kansas and protest. And although, your actions are protected by the First Amendment - this does not stop the church from sueing you for defamation. Their lawsuit will fail because you were exercising your First Amendment right, but you will still need to pay the attorney fees to defend against the lawsuit.

    In this case, there was no justice for the Snyders.

    If the Snyders win the case - the Westboro Baptist Church will most likely file for bankruptcy so Mr. Snyder may be lucky if he gets enough to cover his attorney's fees.

    While, the Phelps family will just move on and start another church in Kansas under a different name, ie the Westbourgh Baptist Church. The Westboro Baptist Church has seventy odd members that are all the priest's, Mr. Phelp's, relatives.

    And the Church does not need to pay for attorney fees, unlike you or Mr. Snyder, because the priest's daughters are attorneys.

    And in the end, the Westboro Church got exactly what it wanted by protesting at the funeral - publicity for their church. Which is increased exponentially because of the lawsuit, appeal, and now after the Supreme Court granted review. (The Supreme Court reviews about 1% of the case submitted for review - so this is a lot of publicity)

    So while legally you can exercise your First Amendment rights and protest at the Phelps family funeral, you will still need to pay for the attorney to defend against the lawsuit that the Phelp sisters will brings against you. You will most likely win, but it will bog you down for years and cost you a small fortune. Not very economical, so I will advise against it.

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    this is indeed a very difficult case, and i hope the supreme court does hear it. it will set a precedent for many protesting laws in the future.

    yes, the signs and chanting and message is extremely distasteful, but i understand that the a-holes are totally within their rights to do so. just as if hitler were going to his home and you stood XX feet away from him house, holding a sign saying he's gonna go to Hell. i may not agree with their message, but i agree with their right to freedom of assembly and freedom of speech.

    having the father pay the protesters' legal costs is a bit much, but he is the one who took them to court in the first place. i guess this will depend on whether or not the protesters took things too far and seriously impeded the father's rights. more information is needed to find out to what extremes the protests took, how close they were to the entrance, and the likeliness of violence.
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    If that's the case, I might as well raise money and give it to some gangs to harass them daily At least that way my money is well spent.
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    The best way to handle this church is to ignore them. The moaners should ignore, the public should ignore them and most importantly the press and media should ignore them. They will stop doing it if no one pays attention to their antics.
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