Where do you place the greatest blame for the tragedy of Sung Ching Sheu?

[CC]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but...



...And then, utterly without warning, a steely hand lands on your shoulder. Your heart nearly explodes as you think: it's High Priestess Miejue! But, as you are spun around to face the person who has accosted you, to your utmost horror, you realize that you would much, much rather face the remorseless and pitiless Sect Leader of Emei - for confronting you is your Seventh Uncle Mo...

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So yeah - I agree Qingshu was a very naughty boy - but worse than that, he was a very stupid one. If he'd grovelled for all he was worth before Seventh Hero Mo instead of running away in a panic, he might actually have gotten away with it...

I agree with everything you said, really. SQS was just set up by the plot to fail.

I can imagine the Japanese manga twist, 7th Uncle Mo clamps his hand on SQS's mouth, shoves him out of the way and sticks his own head in front of the tear!

Or, SQS starts yelling! "Seventh Uncle! What are you doing! How can you peep at the Emei Ladies! This is so unbecoming of Wudang!"

[Stance]

Regardless of guy or girl, we are all perverts. It's just a matter of to what level.

SQS should have questioned his uncle. Ask him, are you not attracted to beautiful women?

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

So yeah - I agree Qingshu was a very naughty boy - but worse than that, he was a very stupid one. If he'd grovelled for all he was worth before Seventh Hero Mo instead of running away in a panic, he might actually have gotten away with it...

SQS failure was not voyeurism but rather his actions afterwards. If he had taken his punishment he would probably just had to endure being disciplined by his elders, for I doubt they would have killed him for his indiscretion or made the matter public for fear of affecting Wudang's image.

However, in murdering his uncle, framing ZWJ (or at least being complacent in the incident) and then coming very close to taking down the whole of Wudang, his true character is shown. He is a coward that when caught would rather continue to make ever more horrendous crimes in order to avoid facing up to his responsibilities.

[Patudo]

Jinyong never actually narrates how Mo Shenggu met his end. But from what we're told by Song Qingshu and Chen Youliang in chapter 32, we can piece together the basic facts. He runs after being discovered, Mo Shenggu pursues, they fight for an unspecified period, then Mo is killed by a stroke called "Heaven-Shaking Iron Palm" to his back. The translated text I've read (apologies for not having consulted the original) suggests Song dealt the killing blow, although upon careful reading there actually seems to be a possibility that Chen might have struck Mo - it depends if you believe Chen is skilled enough to simulate what he says is a Wudang move. Chen isn't a high-level fighter, but as a Beggar Sect elder he probably has a few decent skills up his sleeve. Anyway, even if the blow that killed Mo Shenggu was struck by Qingshu, there's still room for extenuating circumstances...

So Qingshu runs - something he really shouldn't have done but his mental state is (ahem) disordered and with adrenaline (ahem) surging through him, he acts by instinct and bolts. Maybe he thinks he can lose his Seventh Martial Uncle and either disappear and become a nameless jianghu wanderer, or compose himself so that he can return to his father and martial uncles with some semblance of dignity and beg their forgiveness. But Mo is hard on his heels, full of righteous anger, quite possibly brandishing his sword and shouting "I'll castrate you, you little animal!" Mo's qinggong exceeds that his martial nephew's, but fortunately for Qingshu, he's fleet-footed, and fear lends the proverbial wings to his feet - until there is nowhere left to run. Suddenly Qingshu is at the edge of a rocky ridge - one more step and he'd have gone over.

Next moment Mo is upon him. He's managed to lose his sword (found later ) - maybe due to a wild swing striking a heavy tree branch, something which under normal circumstances would never have jarred it out of the hand of a martial arts master of his level, but he's so filled with wrath and shame at his martial nephew's behaviour that it does. But the Seventh Wudang Hero is a formidable opponent even without his sword. Qingshu defends desperately as his martial uncle unleashes a blizzard of palm and fist strokes that nearly overwhelm him. Fortunately for him, he has enough familiarity with his Seventh Uncle's martial arts and skill of his own that he succeeds in keeping himself alive, though only just. But his mind is in total disorder now. He's acted out of sheer instinct for self-preservation, but knows that what a disciple of an honourable sect should do is allow his senior to kill him. But, Laotianye knows, he doesn't want to die...

Mo is attacking again, this time with deeper power and greater subtlety, pressing Qingshu harder even than when he had sparred under the desert sky with High Priestess Miejue. Under such intense pressure Qingshu has no time for conscious thought, instinct and training taking over as he blocks and dodges, acting with the reflexive responses that endless training has drilled into him. Suddenly he senses an opportunity to arrest the flow of his Seventh Uncle's attacks with a counter-blow and buy himself a moment or two to beg for mercy, or to escape - he still can't quite decide himself. He sends out the counter - in the heat of battle, he doesn't have time to consider how a highly-skilled master like Mo Shenggu could have allowed such an opening.

It's Chen Youliang. The Beggar Sect elder strikes out of the night, using the darkness and the element of surprise to such effect that he almost succeeds in catching Mo Shenggu completely unawares. But Mo's skill fully merits his appellation as the Seventh Hero of Wudang. He senses the incoming palm a split-second before it lands, and with superlative shenfa (body movement) pivots to meet it in one swift and graceful motion. But Qingshu has already launched his counter...

The blow that Mo Shenggu could easily have parried crashes into his Seventh Uncle's back. Chen Youliang begins laughing evilly...

I agree with everything you said, really. SQS was just set up by the plot to fail.

I can imagine the Japanese manga twist, 7th Uncle Mo clamps his hand on SQS's mouth, shoves him out of the way and sticks his own head in front of the tear!

Or, SQS starts yelling! "Seventh Uncle! What are you doing! How can you peep at the Emei Ladies! This is so unbecoming of Wudang!"

What would be kinkier yet would be if the person who discovered Qingshu was in fact Miejue! She immobilizes him with a jab to one of his acupoints, then has a look through the window and takes in the sight of her youthful disciples frolicking, so innocently nakedly, in the bathroom...


Humour aside, though, I do see Qingshu as a character who increasingly shows deep character flaws. By the Lion-Slaying Assembly he's developed into a character we are all fairly happy to see dead. But had fate (or the author) picked him to be the main character, he could probably have made a decent enough hero. Other roughly similar examples: Yelu Qi, Tuolei, Lin Pingzhi.

I can't help but think the morality lesson Jinyong is trying to teach us in Song Qingshu's and You Tanzhi's character arcs (and also arguably Duan Yu, whose most pathetic moments come when he trying to win Wang Yuyan's favour) is that a true man shouldn't allow deep devotion to/obsession with a woman to take hold of him in such a way. Work on finding a secret manual instead, and if you do, and master its contents, you'll find babes falling all over you...

[CC]

What would be kinkier yet would be if the person who discovered Qingshu was in fact Miejue! She immobilizes him with a jab to one of his acupoints, then has a look through the window and takes in the sight of her youthful disciples frolicking, so innocently nakedly, in the bathroom...

Meijue grabs him by the ear and goes, you naughty boy! Shitai will now discipline you..... drags him off to her room.

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

Meijue grabs him by the ear and goes, you naughty boy! Shitai will now discipline you..... drags him off to her room.

Stop watching Porky's

[Ken Cheng]

Meijue grabs him by the ear and goes, you naughty boy! Shitai will now discipline you..... drags him off to her room.

Wasn't she dead by that point? Maybe Mit Jeut's ghost in some supernatural intervention.

[Mandred Skavenslayer]

Wasn't she dead by that point? Maybe Mit Jeut's ghost in some supernatural intervention.

When did this become 倩女幽魂

[CC]

Wasn't she dead by that point? Maybe Mit Jeut's ghost in some supernatural intervention.

Very much still alive. Zhirou wasnt the leader yet at that point.