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Thread: Off-topic mania

  1. #1
    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    Default Off-topic mania

    Hi everyone,

    Recently we've noticed that too much hijacking of threads with off-topic comments are occurring. Some threads look like they could lead to some interesting posts but often it goes way off topic. Please try to post in threads where you have something on-topic to say and steer yourself to the Can thread if you need to post something off topic. If you find that you can't oblige 90% of the time, I'll personally put you on the wonderful Miserable Ban. Too many threads of recent are being spammed!

    A side note, we will be deleting all the Speak in ____ language threads soon since those have mostly become conversations between 2-3 members. For such posts, PM should be used.
    -SC

  2. #2
    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    Addition: the off-topic part applies to all the forums.
    -SC

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    sc makes me really nervous. i have to watch every word i say; otherwise, i'm afraid i'm going to be banned.

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    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    Originally posted by jay_z
    sc makes me really nervous. i have to watch every word i say; otherwise, i'm afraid i'm going to be banned.
    Yeah, so are you quaking now? Want to try out this new ban hack of mine?
    -SC

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    Originally posted by spcnet
    Yeah, so are you quaking now? Want to try out this new ban hack of mine?
    You really mean that? You mean that? You want to ban me? You make me so nervous! listen I really scare about this. Mamamia! -- chow yun fat, a better tomorrow 2

    btw, the board is a mess. general comments should be closed, too.
    Last edited by jay_z; 09-07-03 at 01:58 AM.

  6. #6
    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    Originally posted by jay_z
    You really mean that? You mean that? You want to ban me? You make me so nervous! I really scare about this. Mamamia! -- chow yun fat, a better tomorrow 2

    btw, the board is a mess. general comments should be closed, too.
    Hehe.. that was such poor (and funny) English when CYF said that. I cringed when I saw that part of the movie.

    Edit: General Comments is fine for now, just need to enforce some changes.
    -SC

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    Senior Member Azalae's Avatar
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    SC I appreciate that it is not easy to maintain a forum this big, but it's becoming a 'nazi-forum'.

    First, I still don't understand the need to remove relationship forums. If the topics are becoming too sensitive and personal, everyone can stop replying. If deteriorates into flame war and name calling, moderators can close/delete said threads.

    But I respect your decision and what's done is done.


    Secondly, off topics. Conversations can (and usually do) develop into different issues. There is only so much to say about anything.

    Also the thread starters can ask posters to go back to original topic themselves. No need to babysit everyone.


    Third, non-english threads. These are where we retreated to. Because of those rules you made, these threads are the only place where we can have fun.

    I don't know about the others but in 'Mari Kita Bicara' more than 3 members participate: me, eeyore, bubeng, wutang, sorcy, tanteun, blueberry, siryu, floo, toon, han solo, and guest stars: mike liu, bubbleshbunny, and yon, and others I don't remember right now.


    This is the most regulated forum I know. For comparison, a sizeable forum created & maintained by a single adminstrator alone: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/


    Please, let us enjoy our time here. Isn't that your intention when opening?

  8. #8
    Moderator Spirit of Honour's Avatar
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    First, I still don't understand the need to remove relationship forums. If the topics are becoming too sensitive and personal, everyone can stop replying. If deteriorates into flame war and name calling, moderators can close/delete said threads.

    The relationships forum was supposed to be a friendly place to chat, but it turned into a forum that created sex topics, hostilities, and too many fights. Some of these hostilies would affect more than just the relationships forum. The moderators tried what you've said above. Telling people to stop flaming doesn't work all the time. The decision to close the forum was a last resort.

    Secondly, off topics. Conversations can (and usually do) develop into different issues. There is only so much to say about anything.

    Also the thread starters can ask posters to go back to original topic themselves. No need to babysit everyone.


    The issue isn't merely just off topic posts. The main problem is off-topic spam posts. Some of these off topic short posts quickly take over a topic. A reminder to go back to the topic doesn't always work, and also keep in mind a post telling someone to back on topic is also off topic.

    Third, non-english threads. These are where we retreated to. Because of those rules you made, these threads are the only place where we can have fun.

    These language threads can isolate members from participating. This language barrier also seperates members and creates a clique. Finally, it's hard to moderate these threads because of the language barrier.

    If you have any concerns with the moderation or the guidelines, feel free to PM SC or the moderators.
    "The gentlemen first practices what he preaches and then preaches what he practices." - Confucius

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    Senior Member eeyore's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Spirit of Honour
    [BThird, non-english threads. These are where we retreated to. Because of those rules you made, these threads are the only place where we can have fun.

    These language threads can isolate members from participating. This language barrier also seperates members and creates a clique. Finally, it's hard to moderate these threads because of the language barrier.

    If you have any concerns with the moderation or the guidelines, feel free to PM SC or the moderators. [/B]
    I beg to differ here. Even the topic can isolate members from participating.. I don't understand much wuxia so I don't participate much. I don't interested in the topic of the keyring topic, so I don't post there...

    Most of members that participate actively in Mari Kita Bicara (I can only speak for this non-English thread because I am one of the active member) are good. We don't cause trouble or get into fight with each other. Most of us are Indonesia living abroad and we looking for fellow indonesian and speaking our mother tangue. we make good friend and having fun there, share news and story from Indonesia or any Indonesian-stuff related (including food ). We may take space here in the forum, but we are friendly people, any guest that come over we gladly talk to them too,.. or if they have any questions...

    as for moderating the MKB, I believe Floo.. is a moderator, anything not right she still can monitor and make the appropriate report to the related moderator.

    MKB, is a special place for me in here. Please, take this into account before any final decision made.

    Addition: Most members of MKB actively involved in other thread.. it's not like we talking just among ourselves. We also enjoy having discussion with other members.
    Last edited by eeyore; 09-07-03 at 04:59 AM.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member Mike Liu's Avatar
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    Yes I myself am guilty of being a thread hijacker. I will do my best to stop that. Kinda hard sometimes when a funny comment hits me ya know?

    *puts on serious hat*

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    Senior Member Yon's Avatar
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    Two way conversation is good every now and then.. for few posts.. but if it goes to couple pages of it which leads to deviate from original topic.. I would say nono.
    Some members did complain to me about too much two way conversation going on and on.. and they really can't follow the original topic.

    I did notice that some topics start out nicely with interesting topics.. and it just deviates from the original topics.. and become 2 way conversation for pages. We would like to prevent that happening. So we continously are asking members to stay with original topics. Off topics here and there is PERFECTLY fine.. but if it gets little too much.. some members don't know what is going on.. and they decided not to post... and the topic which started with fun interesting topics... get killed by the result of spamming.

    One thing I noticed is that.. if someone say "GO BACK to topic" some people do.. and some just ignore.

    Also... to some members.. would you please stop talking about sex?

    Just my 2 cents.

    Yon
    Please email me with questions. Do not use PM here.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Azalae's Avatar
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    Spirit of Honour, I didn't use PM because this is not a personal matter. And too troublesome to PM every and each mods.

    Why do you want to moderate the language threads? You said yourself, others can't understand the posts there. So how can we disturb others?

    Is it because non-English or because you can't understand the language? Does your country forbid its citizen using languages other than the national one?

    Off topics. Sometimes the discussion was over and someone brought an interesting (but different) continuation. If the starter don't like this development, say it and/or ask mod to take action.

    In different forums people spam my threads with off topics (as you put it). I didn't mind because I didn't see those as spams.

    What if a mod just come by and delete a perfectly good thread just because he/she thinks it's deviate from original topic? Not knowing that the starter isn't even bothered.

    What I'm trying to say here all along: please don't take action just because you assume it's a problem. If we want mods to remove or close some threads, trust me, we will let you know.

    EDIT:
    Why don't have a special thread for people to post the thread/post they want removed.

    For example:
    Thread ABC -- Because they are discussing torture methods.
    Post by XYZ -- Thread DEF -- He's disclosing my phone number.

    Let's be open about it. Why hide if you know you're right.
    Last edited by Azalae; 09-07-03 at 09:05 AM.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Yon's Avatar
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    I think as SPC mentioned, if the topic is opened by the starter.. the thread doesn't belong to the starter ... specially in GC thread. If it is in my modding section which is Korean/Japanese thread, I open ask the topic starter because it is more like "Q and A" thread. If the question is fulfilled by the answer, I ask topic started of letting know that the thread is closed and deleted or whatever.
    But in GC, as I noticed, the topic started out with nice comments, and than it gets hijacked by some members and it turns it into two way conversation (AKA Spam). I am sure the original topic could trigger some nice different topic and could continue (I see those in open debate time to time) and mods leave it there without closing it.

    Also.. we do have report to moderator button in the bottom. Many members use it for reporting inappropriate topics and complaints.
    Please email me with questions. Do not use PM here.

  14. #14
    Moderator CrazyLilAngel's Avatar
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    Just to throw it out there, SC and all of us mods AREN'T trying to over-mod this place, but there are certain aspects which have come to our attention that NEEDS to be pointed out.

    As Honour said, it's not the off-topic-ness that we're trying to stop here. If you haven't noticed, almost all topics go astray, and sometimes we're at fault for doing that too. What we're asking is that don't make the off-topic SPAM.

    ...do I make sense?

    As others have said, sometimes when a thread is led off-topic, it leads to better discussions and more fun, but recently, it's just been...spam.

    Just try to make your replies more than a smiley or a word or whatnot. Actually put some substance into your reply. Make an effort; it's not hard to have fun, crack a joke, and still have a meaningful reply, even if it's just due to the humor.

    The relationship forum, as SC has said, was closed due to the increasing amount of inappropriate conversations. Yes, there are certain facts of life, but we have to account for the fact that there are underaged visitors here, and we have to assume that it's inappropriate for them. And a bigger problem was the hurt feelings that accumulated because of it.
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  15. #15
    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    First, I still don't understand the need to remove relationship forums. If the topics are becoming too sensitive and personal, everyone can stop replying. If deteriorates into flame war and name calling, moderators can close/delete said threads.
    The main reason why the Relationships forum was closed was because many members were starting to associate this forum as a place to flirt and ask love advice. Many of the topics were too mature for minor audiences too. So in light of that, the Relationships forum was closed.

    Secondly, off topics. Conversations can (and usually do) develop into different issues. There is only so much to say about anything.
    If there is nothing else to be said about something, then a new thread should be started. That's all I ask.

    I'm not saying that any off topic in a discussion is disallowed. Just that I've been noticing that too many threads lately that has been spammed with totally irrevelant content to the topic. As Spirit has mentioned, many times these posts take over a thread and turns it into a spammed thread. When this happens to every other thread, it can get quite frusterating for those members who want to talk about the topic.


    What if a mod just come by and delete a perfectly good thread just because he/she thinks it's deviate from original topic? Not knowing that the starter isn't even bothered.
    I never said anything about deleting threads. I'm merely asking members to try to stay on topic!! You're speaking as if I'm going to have moderators look over every single post and haggle over any off-topic and delete all those threads.


    Third, non-english threads. These are where we retreated to. Because of those rules you made, these threads are the only place where we can have fun.
    I'm blinking in confusion here. What rules are we speaking of that are unreasonable? But I will consider about leaving the Mari Kita Bicara thread because I didn't realize it was still being participated by many. However, the others will probably go since it's a 2-3 way conversation between the same few members over pages.


    This is the most regulated forum I know. For comparison, a sizeable forum created & maintained by a single adminstrator alone: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/
    If the topics of discussion on this forum were only tech related discussions, I think I can handle it by myself too because no members there would bring up inappropriate topics. Bottom line, it's comparing two totally different forums with different dynamics.


    Let's be open about it. Why hide if you know you're right.
    We're not hiding anything. Otherwise, I would've just laid down the rules in the Announcements forum and closed this thread so no one can put down their input.
    -SC

  16. #16
    Senior Member Azalae's Avatar
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    Boy, this is going to be long.
    The main reason why the Relationships forum was closed was because many members were starting to associate this forum as a place to flirt and ask love advice. Many of the topics were too mature for minor audiences too. So in light of that, the Relationships forum was closed.
    Okay that's a good explaination. But as I said, I wasn't asking it to be reopen.

    If there is nothing else to be said about something, then a new thread should be started. That's all I ask.
    Because it's easier to just continue in an existing thread. I know it's not a good enough reason but that's human. Better ask spammasters why.

    I'm not saying that any off topic in a discussion is disallowed. Just that I've been noticing that too many threads lately that has been spammed with totally irrevelant content to the topic. As Spirit has mentioned, many times these posts take over a thread and turns it into a spammed thread. When this happens to every other thread, it can get quite frusterating for those members who want to talk about the topic.
    Delete the posts then not the thread. By closing the thread you also deny those who want to discuss the original topic.

    I never said anything about deleting threads. I'm merely asking members to try to stay on topic!! You're speaking as if I'm going to have moderators look over every single post and haggle over any off-topic and delete all those threads.
    Unfortunately that's what usually happened. Thread closed/removed. Not the offending posts.

    I'm blinking in confusion here. What rules are we speaking of that are unreasonable?
    The rule that we cannot always post anything (as long as it doesnt offend). But that's a moot point so I won't debate that here. Made a mistake of bringing that out.

    But I will consider about leaving the Mari Kita Bicara thread because I didn't realize it was still being participated by many. However, the others will probably go since it's a 2-3 way conversation between the same few members over pages.
    A good example of the problems. Moderators don't read. They only 'prune'. Shouldn't you investigate problems before passing verdict?

    If the topics of discussion on this forum were only tech related discussions, I think I can handle it by myself too because no members there would bring up inappropriate topics. Bottom line, it's comparing two totally different forums with different dynamics.
    It's where customers and representative of various ISPs 'talk'. Disagreements were abundants. Different groups looking down on others as inferior.

    We're not hiding anything. Otherwise, I would've just laid down the rules in the Announcements forum and closed this thread so no one can put down their input.
    I wasn't accusing you or the mods. But those who complain. Often, only one person has a problem and a thread is finished. This can give others a chance to present their views. Why close a thread if only one doesnt like while ten have no problem (as long as within regulations of course)? But this's not a major issue.


    To summarize:
    1. Please validate complains before taking actions.
    2. Delete the post not the thread. (Minimalize the 'adjustments'.)
    3. Don't assume, but ask and see.

    Many people are dissatisfied but don't dare to speak out. I'm biting the bullet here and risking myself stamped as troublemaker.

  17. #17
    Moderator CrazyLilAngel's Avatar
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    Azalae, trust me on this. It's a HUUUUUUUGE pain in the behind when you're deleting POSTS from a thread that has been SPAMMED till it's dead.

    >.<

    I had sooooooo much trouble going through and deleting post by post.

    If you haven't noticed, if an interesting thread is closed due to spam, we usually either 1) create another one asking that there be no spamming this time or 2) we allow someone else to make a new one. We're not opposed to interesting discussion, just spam.

    We're humans too, and we have lives, and we have lack of time, therefore, 'pruning' may be the best method. And there have been times when we receive complaints on threads. My email was once swamped with reports.

    >.<

    We usually don't do anything until a problem becomes a big deal, and there's nothing to do but take action. Otherwise we're leniant.
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  18. #18
    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    A good example of the problems. Moderators don't read. They only 'prune'. Shouldn't you investigate problems before passing verdict?
    This is rather an accusatory assumption don't you think? Some members seem to assume that moderators don't bother to read anything and then voice these kind of judgements.

    The reason why I wanted to close off those language threads in the first place was that it many were 1) participated by only a few members and 2) in some sense, does create a sort of barriar for others who don't speak the language to join in the discussion at all. The Mari thread is the only one that I am willing to put into consideration in leaving because it is at least participated by quite some members.

    And if I or moderators did place the verdict already without investigating, a lot of threads would be gone now. Please don't make your own assumptions.


    The rule that we cannot always post anything (as long as it doesnt offend).
    When you say something like that, it makes me believe that the discussions at the language threads are breaking the guidelines.

    It's where customers and representative of various ISPs 'talk'. Disagreements were abundants. Different groups looking down on others as inferior.
    Once again, different dynamics, comparing an ISP forum that doesn't have to worry about minors, sex talks, and spam.
    -SC

  19. #19
    Administrator spcnet's Avatar
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    Delete the posts then not the thread. By closing the thread you also deny those who want to discuss the original topic.
    Can you provide some examples of where we closed/deleted threads due to spam? The purpose of this thread was to point out that too much off topic spam is occurring and that we wish it to be lessened. I believe that to be very reasonable and is A MUCH better solution to curbing off topic content than having moderators delete individual posts. If anything, that will only get more members angry.

    The pruning and closing of topics are usually reserved for threads that broke our guidelines.
    -SC

  20. #20
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    langauge threads are all right because some members feel closer to each other if they use their native langauge.

    the problem threads are wordplay and what song are you listening to right now? two bombs.
    a member should not be allowed to make more than 3 posts in the same thread a day.

    sex talks? you don't have to worry about that because all spcnet members are christianlike.

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