Times when Cheung Mo Gei fought up to his potential and dominated like he should have

[Ken Cheng]

As a martial artist, Cheung Mo Gei is often criticized for not fighting up to his potential and struggling against opponents whom he should dominate (due to his excessive kindheartedness, his indecisiveness, and other factors). On which occasions, however, do you feel that Cheung Mo Gei fought up to his potential and dominated his opponents the way he should?

[Western Eccentric]

As a martial artist, Cheung Mo Gei is often criticized for not fighting up to his potential and struggling against opponents whom he should dominate (due to his excessive kindheartedness, his indecisiveness, and other factors). On which occasions, however, do you feel that Cheung Mo Gei fought up to his potential and dominated his opponents the way he should?

When he fought Xuan Ming Elders in Wan An Pagoda which he injure He Biweng less than 30 stances😶😶😶😶

[_Kenny_]

At Bright Peak when he fought against the 6 leading martial arts sects and at Wudang when he fought against the Zhao Min's 3 lackeys.

[Western Eccentric]

At Bright Peak when he fought against the 6 leading martial arts sects and at Wudang when he fought against the Zhao Min's 3 lackeys.

In these 2 fight he "struggling" against his opponets even he almost "die" if ZZR didn't give him a advise/guide how to "break" Yin Yang 8 Trigram Formation host by 2 Huashan Elders and He Taichong husband and wife from Kunlun..

[Western Eccentric]

I think there is the only scene/part when Wuji totally overpowered his opponets during HSDS☺️☺️☺️☺️
HSDS chapter 26 page 3 (2nd edition)..
While the Xuanming Elders were still stunned Zhang Wuji’s third palm strike arrived; as if by prior agreement each of them lifted a palm to block. Three people’s pure energy collided; the Xuanming Elders felt their opponent’s ‘yang’ [positive] energy surge in, it was difficult to block. Zhang Wuji’s palm technique was like the wind; he recalled his many years of sufferings when he was little and was struck by He Biweng’s Xuanming Divine Palm. For that reason his palm strike was a little bit lenient toward Lu Zhangke, he did not give any leeway to He Biweng.

Twenty or so palms later He Biweng’s greenish face had turned completely red. Seeing the opponent’s palm strike, he raised his left palm trying to fend it off, while his right palm is slanting down heavily. ‘Slap! Slap!’ He Biweng’s palm fiercely hit Lu Zhangke’s shoulder. In the end he still failed to fend off Zhang Wuji’s palm, which hit him squarely on his chest. Luckily Zhang Wuji had never had any intention to take his life; thus he only used 30% of his strength. With a ‘wah’ noise He Biweng spurted a mouthful of blood. His face from red turned to purple, his body swayed; if Zhang Wuji took advantage of this situation and launched another palm strike, his life would be gone right there and then. Lu Zhangke’s shoulder was also so painful that his face greatly changed and his lips bleed from his own biting.

The Xuanming Elders had always been Zhao Min’s most capable subordinates; who would have thought that both of them were injured in under thirty moves? No wonder the rest of Zhao Min’s warriors were flabbergasted; even Yang Xiao and Wei Yixiao were astonished. They had seen it with their own eyes how on Wudang Mountain the Xuanming Elders had injured Zhang Wuji with their palms; surprisingly in just several months he had made a tremendous progress. But they also remembered that in these last several months while treating Yu Daiyan and Yi Liting’s injuries on Mount Wudang, Zhang Wuji had also consulted Zhang Sanfeng on the subtle and profoundly deep study of the martial arts; finally he was able to combine the ‘jiu yang shen gong’ [nine ‘yang’ (positive) divine skill], ‘qian kun da nuo yi’ [great shifting of the universe], plus Wudang’s ‘tai ji chuan jian’ [Taiji’s fist and sword], three martial arts into one. They were secretly praising Zhang Sanfeng’s divine knowledge, which could be called ‘shen bu ke ce’ [immeasurably deep], four characters.

As the two Xuanming Elders were defeated, they howled and took their weapons out. In Lu Zhangke’s hand there was a short stick with a forked head, resembling a pair of deer antlers. The body of the stick was dark; it was unclear what the stick was made of. He Biweng’s hands were grasping a pair of pens; the tip of the pens was sharp, shaped like a crane’s beak. The pens glistened with crystal-like rays. These two people had followed Zhao Min for quite a while, but even Zhao Min had never seen them using their weapons. As these three weapons were launched, one black shadow and two white lights were seen; surrounding Zhang Wuji in their midst.

Zhang Wuji did not bring any weapons with him; with only his bare hand and empty fist, his situation was quite disadvantageous. But he was not scared one bit. He determined to test his own martial art against these two powerful opponents; he wanted to see if he would be able to score victory barehanded.

The Xuanming Elders had always relied on their profound internal energy, the Xuanming Divine Palms was a lost art of the martial art world; yet as soon as they went into battle against Zhang Wuji’s palms, his ‘jiu yang shen gong’ was actually so unfathomable that in dozens of palms they were defeated.

[Patudo]

That sequence, in the final contest with the three Du monks, where Wuji uses both inner power and technique to destroy the three trees and gives himself time to push away the massive boulder to rescue his godfather is sensational. Wuji is totally awesome there. Much more impressive than when he owns the Xuanming twosome the first time and indeed more so than when he knocks them about the second time round.

[Western Eccentric]

That sequence, in the final contest with the three Du monks, where Wuji uses both inner power and technique to destroy the three trees and gives himself time to push away the massive boulder to rescue his godfather is sensational. Wuji is totally awesome there. Much more impressive than when he owns the Xuanming twosome the first time and indeed more so than when he knocks them about the second time round.

It's more like of his overbearing superhuman strength not ability as a "fighter" I mean if We only consider "strength" Jinlun 10th Dragon/Elephant Wisdom isn't below Wuji 9 Yang skill yet We alwayz dub him as a "lousy" fighter..

[CC]

I feel that with his better martial arts and significantly greater inner strength, ZWJ could have dominated the 2 XM Elders in even less than 30 rounds if he was out to maim. As the narrator noted, he was still a little bit lenient on Lu Zhangke.

[tape]

I feel that with his better martial arts and significantly greater inner strength, ZWJ could have dominated the 2 XM Elders in even less than 30 rounds if he was out to maim. As the narrator noted, he was still a little bit lenient on Lu Zhangke.

Against the weak fighters on Brightness Peak I guess he dominated them completely as he should have, against Ah Er on Wudang Mountain (but not against the others brothers!) he dominated him -- those are the first and maybe only two that come to mind immediately when talking about domination relative to his ability.

[Patudo]

It's more like of his overbearing superhuman strength not ability as a "fighter" I mean if We only consider "strength" Jinlun 10th Dragon/Elephant Wisdom isn't below Wuji 9 Yang skill yet We alwayz dub him as a "lousy" fighter..

Nope, Wuji used high level techniques - inner power control and hand/body technique as well...

He saw that Du Nan’s long whip was threatening his back. Disregarding his own safety, his left hand reached up to let the whip strike his arm, but he dissipated the incoming force using the Qian Kun Da Nuo Yi. The Sheng Huo Ling tablet in his right hand blocked the pair of whips of Du E and Du Jie. Like a giant bird he suddenly pounced to the left, but his body turned around midair and suddenly he grabbed Du Nan’s long whip, and wound it once around the trunk of the green pine tree in which Du Nan was sitting.

This maneuver was truly unthinkable; Zhang Wuji raised his left arm, pulled the whip and wound it around the tree trunk. Du Nan was greatly shocked; he hastily pulled back. Zhang Wuji’s change of movements were amazingly fast; he also pulled the rope to counter Du Nan’s force.

Ah Er and Ah Da got thoroughly owned as well - one got blasted through a wall (that's almost comic book levels of craziness) and the other started off confronting a wooden sword with the joint most powerful weapon in JY's canon and ended up with his sword arm removed. If that isn't domination I don't know what is. Wuji dealt with them one after another too. The three Ahs are very serious opponents in my book, I suspect they're underestimated because they don't show their ability against anyone else but Ah DA is only a tiny bit behind Fan Yao in swordsmanship and quite probably at least as good or better in inner strength. Ah Er is a tank too - this section here where he meets a full power strike from Wuji and takes just one step back is seriously impressive IMO. I'm not at all sure the likes of Yin Tianzheng, Xie Xun, Yang Xiao etc. could do that...

Zhang Wuji used Taiji Fist’s “stick”, “divert” and “push” forms intending push Ah Er off balance. Unexpectedly, this person’s inner strength was extremely powerful, he himself ended up stumbling. Zhang Wuji thought: “Let me see whether your Western Shaolin’s inner power is greater or my Art of Nine Yang is greater.” Seeing a palm coming towards him, he used brute force to meet that palm directly. Both palms met with a thunderous clash, both their bodies swayed. Zhang Sanfeng inwardly yelled: “Not good! When fighting with brute force, the more powerful one will win. It’s completely opposite to the principle of Taiji Fist. This baldie’s inner power is very powerful, rarely seen in the martial arts world. The kid will suffer severe injuries under his palm.” At this moment, the combatant’s palms came crashing together a second time. Ah Er’s body wobbled and he retreated one step while Zhang Wuji stood firm and steady.

[EdenResident]

I've always maintained that Wuji is probably the biggest martial art genius in all of Jin Yong's canon. He has the unique ability to take any skill, even one he's never practiced before, and immediately perform it to the highest level attainable of that skill, sometime even surpassing the original creator of the skill! He's shown this with JiuYang, QKDNY, Dragon Claws, 7 Hurt fist, Taiji Fist & Taiji Sword, the weird Persian arts. The only other main character with this ability is probably Xiao Feng.

To compare with other heroes, Guo Jing pretty much knows one skill, and this is not a slight against him because he knows it really well. Yang Guo, another genius on his own, also can learn many skills, but it takes him a while, even after some serious soul searching, to finally able to incorporate them into his own repertoire.

The biggest strength of Wuji is the ability to make improvement DURING a battle. The more a battle drags out, the more it becomes advantageous for him, ie. either you make quick work of him or you're gonna find yourself in some serious trouble. This is due to 2 things, one is his never ending Jiu Yang inner power, the other is his quick learning, either of his own skills or finding the weakness of his opponent. What Patudo quoted above demonstrates this, when Wuji destroys the trees and forces the monks into a close battle, removing all of their advantage of the formation of the long whips. Wuji may not overpower his opponent right away the way Guo Jing or Yang Guo can do, but he has the ability to adapt to any opponent of any fighting style, due to his tremendous defensive ability and quick learning. To me this is Wuji's biggest potential. It's like he always has another gear. Just when you think he's near his limit, he kicks it to higher gear. If I had to pick one fighter against the truly elite of Jin Yong's canon, ie, the XuZhu, Shi PoTian, Sweeper monk et al, I would pick ZWJ.

[Western Eccentric]

Nope, Wuji used high level techniques - inner power control and hand/body technique as well...

He saw that Du Nan’s long whip was threatening his back. Disregarding his own safety, his left hand reached up to let the whip strike his arm, but he dissipated the incoming force using the Qian Kun Da Nuo Yi. The Sheng Huo Ling tablet in his right hand blocked the pair of whips of Du E and Du Jie. Like a giant bird he suddenly pounced to the left, but his body turned around midair and suddenly he grabbed Du Nan’s long whip, and wound it once around the trunk of the green pine tree in which Du Nan was sitting.

This maneuver was truly unthinkable; Zhang Wuji raised his left arm, pulled the whip and wound it around the tree trunk. Du Nan was greatly shocked; he hastily pulled back. Zhang Wuji’s change of movements were amazingly fast; he also pulled the rope to counter Du Nan’s force.

Ah Er and Ah Da got thoroughly owned as well - one got blasted through a wall (that's almost comic book levels of craziness) and the other started off confronting a wooden sword with the joint most powerful weapon in JY's canon and ended up with his sword arm removed. If that isn't domination I don't know what is. Wuji dealt with them one after another too. The three Ahs are very serious opponents in my book, I suspect they're underestimated because they don't show their ability against anyone else but Ah DA is only a tiny bit behind Fan Yao in swordsmanship and quite probably at least as good or better in inner strength. Ah Er is a tank too - this section here where he meets a full power strike from Wuji and takes just one step back is seriously impressive IMO. I'm not at all sure the likes of Yin Tianzheng, Xie Xun, Yang Xiao etc. could do that...

Zhang Wuji used Taiji Fist’s “stick”, “divert” and “push” forms intending push Ah Er off balance. Unexpectedly, this person’s inner strength was extremely powerful, he himself ended up stumbling. Zhang Wuji thought: “Let me see whether your Western Shaolin’s inner power is greater or my Art of Nine Yang is greater.” Seeing a palm coming towards him, he used brute force to meet that palm directly. Both palms met with a thunderous clash, both their bodies swayed. Zhang Sanfeng inwardly yelled: “Not good! When fighting with brute force, the more powerful one will win. It’s completely opposite to the principle of Taiji Fist. This baldie’s inner power is very powerful, rarely seen in the martial arts world. The kid will suffer severe injuries under his palm.” At this moment, the combatant’s palms came crashing together a second time. Ah Er’s body wobbled and he retreated one step while Zhang Wuji stood firm and steady.

Post 16 years Jinlun could "rivalled" Wuji feat like above in ROCH with his tremendous inner strength but We still dub him as a lousy fighter so for Me when Wuji singlehandedly overpowered Xuan Ming Elders at Wan An Pagoda is more impressive..

[CC]

I've always maintained that Wuji is probably the biggest martial art genius in all of Jin Yong's canon. He has the unique ability to take any skill, even one he's never practiced before, and immediately perform it to the highest level attainable of that skill, sometime even surpassing the original creator of the skill! He's shown this with JiuYang, QKDNY, Dragon Claws, 7 Hurt fist, Taiji Fist & Taiji Sword, the weird Persian arts. The only other main character with this ability is probably Xiao Feng.

To compare with other heroes, Guo Jing pretty much knows one skill, and this is not a slight against him because he knows it really well. Yang Guo, another genius on his own, also can learn many skills, but it takes him a while, even after some serious soul searching, to finally able to incorporate them into his own repertoire.

The biggest strength of Wuji is the ability to make improvement DURING a battle. The more a battle drags out, the more it becomes advantageous for him, ie. either you make quick work of him or you're gonna find yourself in some serious trouble. This is due to 2 things, one is his never ending Jiu Yang inner power, the other is his quick learning, either of his own skills or finding the weakness of his opponent. What Patudo quoted above demonstrates this, when Wuji destroys the trees and forces the monks into a close battle, removing all of their advantage of the formation of the long whips. Wuji may not overpower his opponent right away the way Guo Jing or Yang Guo can do, but he has the ability to adapt to any opponent of any fighting style, due to his tremendous defensive ability and quick learning. To me this is Wuji's biggest potential. It's like he always has another gear. Just when you think he's near his limit, he kicks it to higher gear. If I had to pick one fighter against the truly elite of Jin Yong's canon, ie, the XuZhu, Shi PoTian, Sweeper monk et al, I would pick ZWJ.

Yes but he has overwhelming inner strength PLUS higher level techniques in all his fights from Guangming Ding onwards. Its like when Xuzhu fought JMZ, he improved during the actual fight itself too but we still think of XZ as a bum who only wins cos of his brute force.

[Western Eccentric]

Yes but he has overwhelming inner strength PLUS higher level techniques in all his fights from Guangming Ding onwards. Its like when Xuzhu fought JMZ, he improved during the actual fight itself too but we still think of XZ as a bum who only wins cos of his brute force.

Well if XF never "fought" XYS MRB or Sweeper could We call him just superior to weaker opponets like Wuji but The Xiaoyao Elders also never fought someone at their level but We still consider they as "god-like" (except Sweeper)😶😶😶😶

[CC]

Well if XF never "fought" XYS MRB or Sweeper could We call him just superior to weaker opponets like Wuji but The Xiaoyao Elders also never fought someone at their level but We still consider they as "god-like" (except Sweeper)😶😶😶😶

Ah but XF got narrated as beating people with stronger internal or skills until the losers didn't even dare fight him again. That's not something Wuji approaches.

As for the XY Elders, true but they are more plot devices/background characters placed as lofty beings like Sweeper, Dugu and Feng Qingyang rather than main characters who actually mix it up regularly.

[Patudo]

Post 16 years Jinlun could "rivalled" Wuji feat like above in ROCH with his tremendous inner strength but We still dub him as a lousy fighter so for Me when Wuji singlehandedly overpowered Xuan Ming Elders at Wan An Pagoda is more impressive..

Jinlun (I keep wanting to transpose his name into Sanskrity and call him the Dharmachakra Dharmaraja) could have knocked Ah Er back, I agree... and probably by more than one step, as at "final boss" level he's stated to have tremendous inner strength. But there's no way Jinlun has the skill/technique to do things like winding the Du Elders' ropes around their trees and so on. Now I do actually think Jinlun would do well against the three monks, but he would have to use different skills/abilities (sending out the flying wheels and so on).

Wuji delivering a smackdown vs. the Xuanming elders is impressive I agree, but I consider his performances against the three Du monks to be a level above that, given that he was up against one of the most powerful formations and against very powerful opponents. I'm not sure how each of the three are individually compared to Mr. Crane and Mr. Deer, but there's no doubt that if the Xuanming elders tried to assault the three Du monks in their formation they'd be beaten, and well beaten at that.

[wkeej]

To think about it, zwj always fight to his best. The only exception (possibly lost concentration) was the fight with zzr at Shaolin.

[Western Eccentric]

Jinlun (I keep wanting to transpose his name into Sanskrity and call him the Dharmachakra Dharmaraja) could have knocked Ah Er back, I agree... and probably by more than one step, as at "final boss" level he's stated to have tremendous inner strength. But there's no way Jinlun has the skill/technique to do things like winding the Du Elders' ropes around their trees and so on. Now I do actually think Jinlun would do well against the three monks, but he would have to use different skills/abilities (sending out the flying wheels and so on).

Wuji delivering a smackdown vs. the Xuanming elders is impressive I agree, but I consider his performances against the three Du monks to be a level above that, given that he was up against one of the most powerful formations and against very powerful opponents. I'm not sure how each of the three are individually compared to Mr. Crane and Mr. Deer, but there's no doubt that if the Xuanming elders tried to assault the three Du monks in their formation they'd be beaten, and well beaten at that.

But he is not "dominated" and "beating" them like he did against Xuan Ming Elders at Wan An Pagoda that's why I consider is better and more impressive..

[Western Eccentric]

To think about it, zwj always fight to his best. The only exception (possibly lost concentration) was the fight with zzr at Shaolin.

Not really even at his "best" he couldn't beat Du Er and Du Jie when 1 vs 2 in the 2nd duel against Du Monk..

[Patudo]

Ah but XF got narrated as beating people with stronger internal or skills until the losers didn't even dare fight him again.

I wish a couple of these instances had happened in-book. How many instances did Qiao/Xiao Feng seriously "exchange hands" with someone who had greater inner power and/or better skills?